Comics The '07 X-Event: Endangered Species, Messiah Complex, & Disassembled

[UraniaChang]

Better pulls him out of his current team for a change, since he kind of does nothing in Uncanny despite being the leader of that team.

 

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

Better pulls him out of his current team for a change, since he kind of does nothing in Uncanny despite being the leader of that team.

Not sure I want to re-read Rise And Fall..., but...

Did Blue call any of the shots once they left Earth?

 

[OutcryX]

nope...you actually kinda forget he was there

 

[Valechan]

I thought Xavier was the leader of Uncanny during Rise and Fall... Havok and Kurt sort of shut up and did what Charly X said...

 

[OutcryX]

I thought Xavier was the leader of Uncanny during Rise and Fall... Havok and Kurt sort of shut up and did what Charly X said...

pretty much...until he got kidnapped...which would have been the time for Nightcrawler to step up....but then Corsair came in and took over..Nightcrawler is not leadership material

 

[Havok83]

Kurt does have leadership potential as seen in Excalibur. The problem was that the Shiar arc was very generic and none of the X-men got a chance to shine. You could have easily replaced all of them with different characters and told the same story. Cyclops, Wolverine, Beast, could have easily been there in place of Havok, Warpath and Kurt. Brubaker didnt do a good job at giving each member of his team a distinct voice, personality and role

 

[La_She-Beast]

edit

 

[La_She-Beast]

How is that picture confusing? It's clean, we can distinctly see what's going on, we can make out the characters and not wonder who they are or what they're doing or what's going on. That's confusing?

What you need to go do is look at some of Bachalo's interiors. Now, that **** is confusing. A veritable "Where's Waldo?" of comic books.

Lol you only read that word in my post? Confusing?

No, no. What I mean is that- he drew too much detail-useless detail. Emma's cloth-it's just impossible a cape can have so many wrinkles, or Wolverine's veins- he just drew that to make the drawing somehow "interesting" without any documentation, nothing.

lol Yeah and Bachalo... yup, really confusing, but at least he's got a style. I find Finch quite boring...



BTW-> Here's a drawing by Moebius which is pretty the same mood
http://kauppa.tietosanoma.fi/WebRoo...862/069A/5274/EB11/FAC1/9518872791_300dpi.jpg

As you'll see there's a sense of control in the whole cover. The car Nightcrawler is sitting on was randomly put there for him to stay at the same level as the rest of the characters, whereas in that Blueberry cover every element is important and interesting to watch, even if it's a piece of wood. I know you can't compare Moebius with Finch, but... you see more or less what I mean?

 

[El Bastardo]

Gee, thanks so much for explaining the meaning of Finch's picture to me.

I dislike Bachalo, and I dislike his style. It does nothing but bug the crap out of me. I have a violent reaction to it the same way people have a violent reaction to Ramos.

And no, "confusing" was not the only word of your post that I read. However, let it be put on the record (Darth, are you writing all this down? I demand we have a legible ledger!) that supposed "useless detail" does not always equate with making a picture "confusing." There is nothing confusing about that picture by Finch. Everything is clear, clean, and crisp. Looking at a Bachalo pic, though, why yes, every little wonderful tidbit of useless detail that he incorporates makes his work confusing as all get out. His covers are great. His interiors leave something to be desired. No sense in a comics medium when you can't make sense of half of it, and arguably (or not so arguably) the half that matters most.

I don't find the pic you linked so mesmerizing, but it must be because I'm an uncultured swine. Or maybe it's just too confusing for me.

Finch uses a lot of detail, and while it may at times be unnecessary - hello, welcome to the comics medium, and hello, welcome to the superhero genre. Unnecessary, exaggerated details and parts are the way the game is played, unless you're Bryan Hitch, and even then. Finch likes corded/tense and visible muscles, prominently in his Wolverine.

Your argument for the use of the car is invalid, considering that Angel is farther back and essentially "shortest." As in, "shorter" than Nightcrawler. So maybe Angel should be standing on something too. Or flying. Making use of those feathery dipsticks on his back. Why, golly, you're right! Finch sucks! LIEK OMGZ.

And yet, for all his suckness, he nails it right on the head. We have the aftermath of what looks to be one heck of an attack or disaster, and at the forefront, we have the stoic Cyclops, finally the symbol of leadership that he should be, leading the X-Men out of the flames. Details be damned. That's what counts.

 

[La_She-Beast]

Why the heck did you answer like that? This is not a win-win situation!!!

I dislike Bachalo, and I dislike his style.

Ok. He's not my favourite artist eva, but at list he's got a style. A creative style. Greg Land for example, he just traces pictures. I respect people who admire him, but from POV there's nothing amazing.

I don't find the pic you linked so mesmerizing, but it must be because I'm an uncultured swine. Or maybe it's just too confusing for me.

Look, either Moebius or Blueberry are very recognised by artists, ok? I thought you would like or understand his art. See the compostition, colour, how similar the cross-hatching is to Finch... And no, that doesn't mean you're an uncultured swine. ¬¬

Finch uses a lot of detail, and while it may at times be unnecessary - hello, welcome to the comics medium, and hello, welcome to the superhero genre.

Not all superhero comics are like that- and you know it. Skottie Young. Bruce Timm. Mike Mignola. Check them out.

Unnecessary, exaggerated details and parts are the way the game is played, unless you're Bryan Hitch, and even then. Finch likes corded/tense and visible muscles, prominently in his Wolverine.

Too many details/muscles distract the eye from the action, and believe me, you can notice it.

Your argument for the use of the car is invalid, considering that Angel is farther back and essentially "shortest." As in, "shorter" than Nightcrawler.

I don't get it.

And yet, for all his suckness, he nails it right on the head. We have the aftermath of what looks to be one heck of an attack or disaster, and at the forefront, we have the stoic Cyclops, finally the symbol of leadership that he should be, leading the X-Men out of the flames. Details be damned. That's what counts.

But, see, all this details we've commented "interrupt" the view. I can't only say "WoW!!! Cyclops, yeah!". And who told you I HATE Finch? I liked the patterns. I said he bores me, that's all. He's nothing I haven't seen before...

 

[El Bastardo]

I often incorporate a high degree of facetiousness and general sarcasm into my posts. I never said you hated Finch. If you got confused by all the unnecessary details in my post (see above mentions of facetiousness and general sarcasm), I apologize for interrupting your view of them. t:

I'd say that Skottie Young and Mike Mignola use a lot of detail in their work - none of it is of the same simplicity of Bruce Timm who, if I'm remembering right, did a lot of the animation work for, at least, Batman: The Animated Series, yes? I've seen his cells, but no panel work he's ever done. And I don't really care to, either. But Young's work in New X-Men and Mignola's Hellboy work are certainly detailed. Not to mention exaggerated, as well.

Chalk it up to taste, I guess. I have absolutely no problem seeing heavy realistic detail. And before you try to jump on that, I mean realism vs. abstract/cartoony - IE Bryan Hitch or David Finch vs. Chris Bachalo or even Humberto Ramos or Joe MAD. My eyes adapt to the pictures easily. Corded muscles don't pull me away or give me a hard time. Nor do wrinkles on a cape.

Five thousand Bachalo explosions going on in the background while that may or may not be Iceman or perhaps it's the water guy or maybe even Cannonball because I can't even tell if that COLOR IS BLUE or not... that's the crap I can't stand. But that's more a matter of how clean the work is. I still wouldn't like his style if it was clean, but it'd definitely make reading his pictures a lot easier. On the level of Finch, possibly.

 

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

Five thousand Bachalo explosions going on in the background while that may or may not be Iceman or perhaps it's the water guy or maybe even Cannonball because I can't even tell if that COLOR IS BLUE or not... that's the crap I can't stand.

Amen. Half the time I don't know who's blowing up who while trying to decipher's Bachalo's "art".

And I wasn't exactly impressed by that Moebus cover. Make it flat-out didn't like. Oh well.

Oh, and I'm with you on how Wolvie's neck, while kinda funny to look at for about 1.2 seconds, doesn't ruin the cover.

 

[La_She-Beast]

And I wasn't exactly impressed by that Moebus cover. Make it flat-out didn't like. Oh well.

You don't like it?? I'm sure that's because the theme is boring to you. And it wasn't suppose to 'impress'... just observe it. The texture on the guy's clothes for example, how makes it distinguishing from the rest of the whole drawing with a few simple lines whereas Wolverine's claws, for example, could be made of plastic, any material. There is no consistency. All charcters are all the same only the hairstyle, clothes, make-up and accessories differs each other. The facial features don't have anything which differ between one or another. The colour (which is horrible) hasn't been blotched just like that- in the Finch cover the fire has to be orrrrange, and the characters with their respective colours, so they can be easily distinguished... the Moebius' one has a mood.

Oh, and I'm with you on how Wolvie's neck, while kinda funny to look at for about 1.2 seconds, doesn't ruin the cover.

Ok, but try to read my comments too. The whole, not just one piece. All the defects crumpled up are disturbing... the wrinkles, veins, muscles, and what I've named above. It's like an exam... with so many mistakes, Finch doesn't pass for me. And they're all common mistakes in many artists nowadays.
And "kinda funny"... he has no idea on the anatomy of a neck!

 

[El Bastardo]

I'm sure we all know that Wolverine's costume is made out of latex. Gosh, all of them are. Well, maybe not Emma. She's probably wearing leather. Err.

But latex. Yes. Maybe that's why it's shiny-ish and shimmering. As opposed to, you know, the cloth that's being worn in the other picture.

And I'm with Darth. That other picture really doesn't impress me. It's nothing I haven't seen before, only I've seen it better in sequential art. Covers and interiors. It's a lot of heavy rendering that isn't needed to make a shiny, finalized piece of art - a complaint some people have with Simone Bianchi's artwork. And by the way, if there's ANY cross-hatching in that picture you supplied, it's little to none. Either that or "cross-hatching" nowadays is like today's elementary school, meaning it does nothing and is highly overrated.

As for other parts of your reply to Darth's post, you're apparently making a case study of Finch's work off the one picture - A COVER, might I add - we have in this thread. A COVER, I might reiterate, were I a person who reiterates. A COVER, I might say once more, in which the HEROES are supposed to look stoic, tall, grim, and actually not battle-weary in the aftermath of what looks like it could be apocalyptic in nature. Furthermore, Finch's characters are not the same character repeated with different attire.

 

[Specter313]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]“What does it profit a man to gain the whole world, and forfeit his soul?”--Mark 8:36 [/FONT]

I'm sure that quite is something that's running through the head of Dr. Henry McCoy (aka Beast) since became partnered with one of his worst enemies, in his search for a cure to mutantkind's imminent extinction. This is one of the many dilemmas our furry friend has faced in the “Endangered Species” back-up stories that are running through Marvel Comics' X-Men books at the moment. And if you haven't been following the Beast's journey…what are you waiting for? Start now! You don't want to be behind the curve when “Messiah CompleX” kicks in – trust me.

And now that we've completed this public service announcement, let's continue with our regularly scheduled X-POSITION.
This week, X-editor Nick Lowe joins us for our most wacky and wild edition yet. Your e-mails covered a wide variety of topics, but Lowe stands poised and ready to take on all comers. Apparently, his mutant ability involves nerves of steel and being able to go with the flow. It makes sense Nick's an editor!

Let's go right to the questions and start things off with CuzLarry, who was curious about long-range plans for the X-books: “How far out do you guys have X-stories planned? For example, do you know what's happening 2-3 months after ‘Messiah CompleX'? And while it does sound like titles of books will be changing after ‘CompleX,' will all the same writers still be around?”

Hey, CuzLarry! Did you come up with that name because of (the TV show) “Perfect Strangers”? Anywho, we plan things out pretty far. We know, pretty concretely, what's going to happen through the first part of 2008 and have a general sense through most of 2008. All the writers involved in “Messiah CompleX” are going to be around in some capacity, so worry not. That's all you'll get out of me at this point.

See? Nerves of steel . So, when it comes to post-‘CompleX,' Teddanson37 was wondering, “Are we going to see some more graves in front of Xavier's after ‘Messiah CompleX?'”

We will. There's going to be a few surprises in “Messiah CompleX” and some of those surprises will be deadly (cue the ominous music!).

Eric Scaduto sent in a handful of questions covering some random X-characters and events. Let's see if we can make things a tad less “random” for him…

1) When will we learn the fate of Meggan?

All in good time, Eric. Meggan's too good a character to stay out of the limelight for too long. And she's an alien hottie, so we all want to see her soon. In fact, we wanted to work her into Chris Claremont and Michael Ryan's run on “New Excalibur,” but time and space made it impossible. All we were able to do was get a sketch from Michael Ryan that was lovely.

2) Is Dazzler's phantom pregnancy with a now amnesiac Longshot ever going to be explained?

I can't say concretely, but the two will both be in “X-Men: Die By The Sword” (which crosses “New Excalibur” and “Exiles&#8221.

3) Is Shatterstar's history with Benjamin Russell – as well as his implied history with Dazzler and Longshot – ever going to be touched upon?

Not in the near future, but never rule anything out. That's my #2 rule.

4) Has the popularity of the Exiles' Morph ever caused the X-office to consider bringing him to the 616 universe or resurrecting/retconning Changeling's death (even though it was a very noble)?

Morph was one of the happy surprises to come about in “Exiles.” His popularity in “Age of Apocalypse” certainly carried over to “Exiles.” But, we're going to let him be the only Morph (at least for now).

5) I know the X-Verse is big and has lots of popular characters. What are the chances of some of the more popular characters getting their own ongoing besides Wolverine? Some good choices would be Iceman, Beast, Emma Frost, and Cyclops…

One of our goals in the X-Office is to be very careful about new series and limited series. We want to make sure that they are: 1) vital reading for X-Fans, and 2) really honkin' good. So, assuming these characters are alive after “Messiah CompleX,” and assuming we can get a good team together working on a sweet idea for them, I wouldn't rule it out.

Speaking of popular mutants, MightyM had a question about a certain heroine who hasn't been seen in awhile, but whose presence has definitely been felt. “Will the X-office ever get Scarlet Witch back as a character to use? As she is the one who has forever altered the mutant landscape, it seems like she's an important individual in your universe.”

How about this: you'll see her in September and October in a couple X-Books. No joke. Keep your eyes peeled!

We will – thanks for the tip! A huge list of questions came in from heliosthemuse this week. We couldn't use them all, but here's a dozen. Let's see if we can fill up an egg carton with answers for him.

1) Any chance of Bill Sienkiewicz doing any work on X-titles?

Sorry, Helios, no plans for Bill and the X-folk right now. But we love Bill's work, so hopefully we can arrange something in the future.

2) Will we see a “What If?” of Decimation at some stage showing what things would have been like if all the depowered mutants were powered and vice-versa? I think it would cool because all the big players would be depowered, while Polaris and Professor X would be the only active members or the X-Men to retain their powers.

Are you pitching me, Helios? This isn't a pitch meeting! However, I would say to keep your ear to the ground for news about “What If?”

3) What's the X-Men's opinion of the Avengers and Fantastic Four after the Civil War?

The X-Men stayed neutral during “Civil War” and they're remaining that way afterwards. They are really sad about Captain America, but this isn't their war.

4) Any chance of an origin story for Mystique?

Well, we've seen several looks into Mystique's past and origin, but if you want more, keep your eyes peeled in February!

5) Emma Frost is probably the most successful new addition to the X-Men's line up in the last decade (in my opinion). Why do you think fans accepted Emma into the line up when so many characters entered the X-Men's ranks and quickly left over the years?

There are several factors to it: 1) Awesome writers loved her. When you have Grant Morrison and Joss Whedon really pushing you as a character, chances are you're going to stick. 2) She's such a power-house character from X-Men past. She was hugely important as a villain and as a hero in the past. 3) She's a strong woman and there's a history of those in X-Men. 4) She's a perfect foil for Scott. She's a grey to his black and white. She pushes him and challenges him. 5) You never know 100% if you can trust her, and that's just so interesting.

6) Are the Stepford Cuckoos true clones of Emma? Emma's originally a brunette and if they were cloned from her eggs, wouldn't they share her DNA (and brunette hair?). Do the Cuckoos have a father/donor?

Very good question, Helios. One I can't answer. But we'll get to that sooner or later…

7) Will we see Fixx soon?

No plans for her at this time. Sorry.

8) With the Marauders recent reappearance, will we get to learn more of their individual backstories?

It all depends on space restraints. We'd love to delve into their stories, but there's only so much room in the current “X-Men” arc and in “Messiah CompleX.” I do guarantee that you'll see them in “Messiah CompleX.” To prove it, here's some sweet Silvestri Marauder art from the one shot!

9) Will Havok ever remember the Mutant X world? It was the only time he was the main character in a title and it's been completely ignored.

As of right now, we don't have plans to bring up Mutant X stuff, but whether or not we do it depends on a story that needs it. If one of our writers wants to tell the story, then it could happen. Anyway, Havok's got plenty of other things on his mind in “X-Men: Emperor Vulcan.” Check out some sweet Starjammer action right here…

10) Will Rachel ever remember her time in the Askani timeline?

She's got plenty on her mind already (what with her recent family massacre, her past in the future as a Hound, and her feelings for Korvus).

11) Are Lady Mastermind and the other “lady” Mastermind the same person?

They are actually sisters, if you can believe that…

12) A lot of writers seem to shy away from characters with complicated histories as they seem too intimidating for new readers. What's your take on this?

It all depends on the character. There are a million ways to approach it. I always tend to push my writers toward simplicity, but there's definitely something to be said for character histories. One of the best things about working on characters with such rich histories is that you can either draw on those histories, or just not mention them. And that's not a bad thing, in my book. I don't bring up that Zepplin incident from my childhood in every current situation in my life. There's no reason why characters need to have every moment from their past referenced at every moment.

That's twelve questions and twelve answers – don't say I never did anything for you, Helios. And on the topic of characters with complicated histories, Deadoro asked, “Can you give us any clues about how Gambit will be treated after ‘Messiah CompleX' is finished? Hero? Villain? Leader?”

All I know is that Gambit's in league with some pretty bad dudes and dudettes.

Hmm. As long as we're prying for clues, Weponx_2001 was curious about the future membership of his favorite team. “What are the chances of Iceman coming over to ‘Astonishing X-Men'?”

It's always a possibility. When all of our ducks are in a row, we'll be making announcements as to who's in ‘Astonishing' under Warren Ellis and Simone Bianchi.

And we'll be waiting. Clint Theron wraps things up with a solid trifecta of queries for us.

1) Will we be seeing Avalanche anytime in the near future, or possibly a resurrected Pyro?

Dead is dead, Theron. No one is ever resurrected in X-Men comics, Clint!

2) Since Essential Dazzler Vol. 1 sold well, will there be a Vol. 2 anytime soon?

Are you already done with Vol. 1? You read too fast!!!

3) Not necessarily an X-question, but will we see Anaconda guest-star in “Cable & Deadpool” some more? I'm begging for more appearances!

There's a lot of begging in this week's X-POSITION. Where's your pride?!?

That wraps up this week's installment of our little X-coffee klatch. For our guest next week, we've gotten someone who comes from outside of the X-world, but is very busy within it: writer Christos Gage. He is currently one of the writers on the “Endangered Species” back-up stories, he's penned the “World War Hulk: X-Men” miniseries (the final issue ships next week), and he will be writing the “Avengers: House of M” mini which arrives in November.

​

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=11687​

 

[gothicFLAVOURS]

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That Lady Mastermind is amazing! I love this art

 

[El Bastardo]

Mmmm, Silvestri.

 

[Canemacar]

So is this image supposed to be after the crossover?

 

[Specter313]

No, it says right in the title it's a page from the one shot kicking off the crossover.

 

[Canemacar]

Thres another one-shot? Oy vey!

 

[El Bastardo]

Duh? The crossover gets kicked off by the one-shot "X-Men: Messiah Complex." Written by Brubaker and penciled by Silvestri.

 

[Canemacar]

Well, they *did* say it was bring done like a 90's crossover. Guess that includes a bunch of superfluous books thrown into the mix.

 

[Specter313]

Well, they *did* say it was bring done like a 90's crossover. Guess that includes a bunch of superfluous books thrown into the mix.

Uh, no. After the one shot, it's just going to be contained in the four X books. Uncanny, adjectiveless, X-Factor, and New.

 

[Canemacar]

What I'm talking about is that we've *already* had a one-shot that was supposed to kick things off.

 

[El Bastardo]

Hence the term "crossover."

And no, the one-shot "Endangered Species" kicked off the scenario and the back-up stories. The one-shot "Messiah Complex" is going to kick off the crossover.