The All Things Flash Thread. - Part 2

[Lily Adler]

No, they should in no uncertain terms do that. That ranks up there with someone saying Cavill should play older Superman in Kingdom Come bad.

Stop giving WB these ideas internet!

 

[JannTosh]

Am I the only one that doesn’t feel that connected to Keaton’s Batman? I mean he was barely in his own movies. Certainly not a draw in that k will see something that looks unappealing just because he is in it

 

[jetage]

I do wonder how long DC/WB can wait before making a statement on this matter. Supposedly a second family with a twelve year old has been given and order of protection against Miller, something to do with Miller brandishing a gun.

For WB this is a very tricky and fraught moment, so I can give them some leeway with not made an announcement about the whole mess, but I do think there is an ultimate time limit before at least starting the conversation.

Any guesses?

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

Am I the only one that doesn’t feel that connected to Keaton’s Batman? I mean he was barely in his own movies. Certainly not a draw in that k will see something that looks unappealing just because he is in it

Keaton's Batman has a huge fanbase.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

I do wonder how long DC/WB can wait before making a statement on this matter. Supposedly a second family with a twelve year old has been given and order of protection against Miller, something to do with Miller brandishing a gun.

For WB this is a very tricky and fraught moment, so I can give them some leeway with not made an announcement about the whole mess, but I do think there is an ultimate time limit before at least starting the conversation.

Any guesses?

Any corporation's primary aim is protection of the brand (without that, nothing matters). Saying nothing in the short-term can be a sound strategy. But there comes a point when you reach the 'hump in the road'. The crest of that hump is the optimal moment to make your move in respect of damage limitation. If you pass over that hump but do nothing, potential brand damage begins to increase like a snowball rolling downhill, and from then on every day costs. WB's risk strategists will be working overtime on this, but I would say that WB are dangerously close to landing the far side of that hump.

 

[Captain Tired]

Keaton won’t be the draw WB thinks he is. He is great but Bale’s Batman has largely overshadowed him

Really doubt it. The Nolanverse seems to have completely overshadowed the Burtonverse in what everyone’s feels os the ultimate version of onscreen Batman. Bale’s Batman is also the first time the Bruce Wayne character itself got focus and didn’t feel like a guest appearance in his own movie

lmao this sounds like a ****show. And lol at WB thinking 70 year old Keaton is going to be some massive draw

Keaton won’t be this huge draw. Bale’s Batman has overshadowed him and is the Batman a significant percentage of todays moviegoers grew up with. Keaton was barely in his own films

Am I the only one that doesn’t feel that connected to Keaton’s Batman? I mean he was barely in his own movies. Certainly not a draw in that k will see something that looks unappealing just because he is in it

JannTosh I'm starting to sense a running theme in your posts here. This kind of obsessive hate really isn't healthy.

 

[dhandler01]

Probably a Battfleck Stan

 

[Ultra Nolanite]

Ezra Miller must have some major pull at WB/DC that they would allow them to ruin The Flash like this. And I'm not just talking about the movie. (That thing's been dead for a while now.) No I'm talking about the character, the brand that is The Flash.

I know I had reservations sending my kid to daycare wearing her Flash tee today and ended up deciding against it, and I doubt that I'm some outlier or anything.

So yes WB/DC, no matter how you spin it you are right now allowing Ezra Miller to tie the brand ,The Flash, to pedophilia, possibly forever so bravo. I don't know what is being discussed over there but it's time to bite the bullet.

 

[Rijowhi]

Yeah, its certainly a cluster.

As far as Keaton goes, one option at this point for Keaton's Batman, is to just release Batgirl as is with him as Batman and move forward from there in terms of his version of Batman.

The issue with that ,of course, is that there won't be an explanation for Keaton suddenly being Batman again.

However , audiences have shown they're willing to just go with the idea that Pattinson is Batman in one film, Phoenix is Joker in another film etc. if the film knocks it out of the park.

It's not a perfect solution by any means, and it has its set backs.
But facing reality, there really aren't going to be any perfect solutions .
Just alot of bad to worse solutions.

Given that this will be the first Batgirl film, they'll probably have leeway to set their own rules, in the eyes of the GA.
If Keaton happens to be the Batman of this film, then it's easier for audiences to just go with it.

If WB made Batgirl a more of a self contained film like Aquaman, WW( i.e. it's not totally reliant on other characters and events in the DCU), it could work.

Now that's assuming Batgirl is much more focused on the characters in Gotham , and not trying to bend over backwards to connect to the wider DCU.

They've got a year , so a better option may come along.
But looking at things now, I think that's one way to proceed.

I thought about this myself. They could add a segment explaining why Keaton is Batman to the Batgirl movie.

I’m not keen on Keaton’s Batman myself to be honest but oh well. Affleck killed it as Batman for me.

 

[king666]

Ezra Miller must have some major pull at WB/DC that they would allow them to ruin The Flash like this. And I'm not just talking about the movie. (That thing's been dead for a while now.) No I'm talking about the character, the brand that is The Flash.

I know I had reservations sending my kid to daycare wearing her Flash tee today and ended up deciding against it, and I doubt that I'm some outlier or anything.

So yes WB/DC, no matter how you spin it you are right now allowing Ezra Miller to tie the brand ,The Flash, to pedophilia, possibly forever so bravo. I don't know what is being discussed over there but it's time to bite the bullet.

Yep, really starting to feel like they don't give a ****. People won't forget this, and the character will be forever tied to this mess.

From the Deadline article:

The hope is that the scandal will remain at a low level before the movie is released, and hope for the best to turn out.

I mean, come on. This is disgusting. Miller's been grooming kids, carrying guns around and threatening people; meanwhile the people at WB just "hope the scandal remains at a low level before the movie is released". What the actual ****.

 

[Karelia]

Yeah, this isn't going away. Come on WB...Let's move on from Miller.

 

[dhandler01]

I highly doubt most people are devaluing the brand...most people don't even know who Ezra is let alone that he is the Flash. (the film doesnt exactly have mainstream buzz) I still see people wearing Flash stuff around...most people I hear talking about it barely associate them with the Flash outside of saying they have filmed the movie or was in Justice League. I don't think people are having an issue separating the two. (it helps that he isn't the better known Flash)

As was stated earlier WB probably has their legal teams, risk management and 3-4 other departments working on how to deal with this but it is not just as easy as you think it is. If the film was still filming or had yet to really start the solution is simple...you are talking about a film that is done being made and is set for release. The choices are much more complex now from a corporate studio standpoint. I guarantee no one at WB wants Ezra anywhere near anything, but firing and trashing them in the press isn't really going to solve many of the problems. Right now it is about what causes the least damage...

Ezra will be fired (I mean they effectively have been disavowed going forward so it is a foregone conclusion) but it is not as easy as some of you seem to think it is. As someone else said though...the time is coming near.

note: I am not speaking as what I would do personally, but how a major corporation deals with these things is 100 times different than how the average person does. There are ripple effects and other problems that caused by every decision. WB has worries and issues we don't.

 

[DarkKnight88]

People won't forget this, and the character will be forever tied to this mess.

I don't think so.

Ezra isn't tied to the character like say Christopher Reeve as Superman or Hugh Jackman as Wolverine. Flash has only really been in one released movie fully and people don't even really know Ezra as an actor. The character lives on despite who plays them.

Henry Cavill could come out as the devil, but it won't affect Superman as a character. It wouldn't stop people from wearing the S shield. The character is much bigger than whoever plays them.

 

[Lily Adler]

Ezra Miller Reportedly Out As Barry Allen After ‘The Flash,’ Regardless Of What Happens Next

 

[Karelia]

I would say more people probably view Grant Gustin as their Flash over Miller...even before all this madness happened. I wouldn't say the character of The Flash is a damaged brand because of Miller at all. Once he's replaced, his version of the character will be left in the past.

 

[samsnee]

John Wesley Shipp is the Flash, period.

 

[Karelia]

John Wesley Shipp is the Flash, period.

I love him as The Flash, but if you did a poll with a variety of people, I think Grant wins it by a mile.

 

[Iceman]

Yep, really starting to feel like they don't give a ****. People won't forget this, and the character will be forever tied to this mess.

From the Deadline article:


I mean, come on. This is disgusting. Miller's been grooming kids, carrying guns around and threatening people; meanwhile the people at WB just "hope the scandal remains at a low level before the movie is released". What the actual ****.

Agreed. There will be a fair few who will hold this against WB going forward I imagine, if they completely ignore it as they seem to be doing. The Flash’s name could be tarnished too.

 

[Iceman]

I would say more people probably view Grant Gustin as their Flash over Miller...even before all this madness happened. I wouldn't say the character of The Flash is a damaged brand because of Miller at all. Once he's replaced, his version of the character will be left in the past.

As things stand yes. It just depends what happens with this film as this is a Flash-focused film unlike JL.

 

[I Am The Knight]

Keaton's Batman has a huge fanbase.

Is that so? I love the guy but I'm genuinely asking here. I remember the buzz around Maguire and Garfield returning for No Way Home. I haven't seen anything like that for Keaton except for fanboys online. Again, I'm not hating on Grandpa Keaton, but it feels like to general audiences he is a relic of the past while Bale, Pattinson and Affleck (as much as people may not want to hear this) are the popular Batmen with regular folks who make up most of the audience for these movies.

 

[Lily Adler]

Is that so? I love the guy but I'm genuinely asking here. I remember the buzz around Maguire and Garfield returning for No Way Home. I haven't seen anything like that for Keaton except for fanboys online. Again, I'm not hating on Grandpa Keaton, but it feels like to general audiences he is a relic of the past while Bale, Pattinson and Affleck (as much as people may not want to hear this) are the popular Batmen with regular folks who make up most of the audience for these movies.

I would say had they gotten Bale back would have blown people's minds since you know his movies are actually good and he was in the public consciousness more than Keaton simply because he's newer. But I do love the Batman Beyond vibes with bringing him back.

 

[Doctor Jones]

I don't think so.

Ezra isn't tied to the character like say Christopher Reeve as Superman or Hugh Jackman as Wolverine. Flash has only really been in one released movie fully and people don't even really know Ezra as an actor. The character lives on despite who plays them.

Henry Cavill could come out as the devil, but it won't affect Superman as a character. It wouldn't stop people from wearing the S shield. The character is much bigger than whoever plays them.

This movie is going to be released theatrically. Unless something unimaginable happens and this blows up the world. Right now, there's just too many big pieces for it to be ****canned. Anything can happen I suppose, but as of now, chances are, your parents or Joe McPopcorn don't know who the hell Ezra Miller is to care.

 

[Lily Adler]

This movie is going to be released theatrically. Unless something unimaginable happens and this blows up the world. Right now, there's just too many big pieces for it to be ****canned. Anything can happen I suppose, but as of now, chances are, your parents or Joe McPopcorn don't know who the hell Ezra Miller is to care.

I'm predicting HBO Max DCEU series with a new Flash that'll have a backdoor to that GL series.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

Is that so? I love the guy but I'm genuinely asking here. I remember the buzz around Maguire and Garfield returning for No Way Home. I haven't seen anything like that for Keaton except for fanboys online. Again, I'm not hating on Grandpa Keaton, but it feels like to general audiences he is a relic of the past while Bale, Pattinson and Affleck (as much as people may not want to hear this) are the popular Batmen with regular folks who make up most of the audience for these movies.

A heck of a lot of people who saw Keaton's Batman are still around (I was a mere 28 at the time! ) and still love him. He doesn't even have to be their favourite; I actually prefer Bale's Batman by a hair (although I prefer Keaton's Bruce Wayne), but the possibility of Keaton's return in this context (s**tstorm aside) excites me far more than if it had been Bale.

 

[Doctor Jones]

I'm predicting HBO Max DCEU series with a new Flash that'll have a backdoor to that GL series.

I'd think they'd want to retain Flash as a theatrical franchise since there's just more money there. Unless maybe it becomes a GL situation at the box office and it's a huge flop? But who knows? DC was pretty chaotic before, but under Zaslav's it's too early to tell what their reactions might be. So far the only hint is he wants to bring back Superman and wants to coalesce the DCU better, so if he wants to do that, Flash might have a chance of being a theatrical reboot.