The All Things Flash Thread.

[Logan0327]

Yes I like Man of Steel. I'm referring to garbage like Green Lantern that is a fairly recent film and of course BvS.

I think their batting average is quite poor really.

their batting average is worse than poor i can name atleast 10 great marvel movies i can barely name 6 dc movies and 3 of them are probably by nolan lol

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I was actually thinking about Donner's Superman and Burton's Batman, but you do have a point.

I love those, but they are so long ago at this point. As I said earlier, it has been 25 years. There are things I don't like about Suicide Squad, but at least the trailers show a vision and I appreciate that. There is nothing else about what WB is doing that suggest this. The situation with The Flash is another example.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

their batting average is worse than poor i can name atleast 10 great marvel movies i can barely name 6 dc movies and 3 of them are probably by nolan lol

Superman the Movie
Superman II
Batman
Batman Returns
Batman Begins
The Dark Knight
The Dark Knight Rises
Man of Steel


Can't imagine why they want another Batman movie.

 

[AndrewGilkison]

Wonder Woman was in Batman V. Superman but she was not at all integrated into the movie thematically or storyline wise, and then she showed up in costume in the final battle after the film cut away from its main narrative to show her reacting to events she had no part of or to check her email. The sad thing is that she could've been integrated very easily if they thought about it for like a second (tell me it wouldn't have made sense if she was the one that united Batman and Superman and got them to stop fighting). Did Zack Snyder forget how to do ensemble casts after Watchmen and 300? Doesn't give me much hope for Justice League 1 and 2.

I hope they get a good director for The Flash but it almost doesn't matter if WB doesn't have a coherent and competent plan for this universe of theirs. What good is having a shared universe if you can't get the team up movies right or the main characters like Superman and Batman right?

 

[Jake Cassidy]

their batting average is worse than poor i can name atleast 10 great marvel movies i can barely name 6 dc movies and 3 of them are probably by nolan lol

I can only come up with 5. Unless you're including X-Men movies.

 

[Logan0327]

I can only come up with 5. Unless you're including X-Men movies.

i am

 

[Jake Cassidy]

i am

Even with that I'm still only on 9.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

This isn't about too many characters. This is about making random creative decisions based around mood swings, and making quick cash. They want to be Marvel without the work.

There is nothing inherently wrong with making BvS, The Flash, etc. It is how they are going about this.

Agreed.

 

[Sawyer]

Sawyer, you have had the blinders on the entire time for this whole thing. I don't know why, but you became a part of the DC defense force awhile ago. SPIDEY at least saw the light on this. The fact that you just suggested they need to right the ship, means they are messing up.

Yeah, because it's totally not like I've said repeatedly that I was let down by BVS and that I'm displeased by the fact that these f***ers were short-sighted enough to schedule JL to begin production, like, two weeks after BVS opened, giving them next to no wiggle room to figure things out (i.e. fire Snyder).

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Yeah, because it's totally not like I've said repeatedly that I was let down by BVS and that I'm displeased by the fact that these f***ers were short-sighted enough to schedule JL to begin production, like, two weeks after BVS opened, giving them next to no wiggle room to figure things out (i.e. fire Snyder).

But does this change how you reacted to negative discussion of the film before it was released, or how you are again defending the other films before they are released? Even now you just fell back on the, "BvS was just one movie" argument.

I get there is hate, but reasonable discourse on this stuff is hit with a wave of lunacy and you do blow it off with sarcasm. Go into the Suicide Squad threads, mention you don't like the look of Joker or how they have decided to good OTT with sexy Harley, and you are totally allowed to have the opinion. Yeah, no.

I said it over a year ago. WB/DC don't have a plan. Setting release dates for a movie isn't a plan. Was attacked. Except of course they are proving I was exactly right.

 

[Logan0327]

lol they obviously have a plan you are just lying now

just because you did'nt like BVS that doesn't mean they dont have a plan all these films are connected may it be suicide squad connection to wonder woman appearing in gotham for wonder woman movie they are connecting their universe

a movie being bad doesn't negate that

 

[Martha]

When the foundation is poor, it's very hard to build a sturdy building on top of it.

They need to take some time to rethink how they're going to do this. Maybe they should wait for a director with a vision to come to them.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

lol they obviously have a plan you are just lying now

just because you did'nt like BVS that doesn't mean they dont have a plan all these films are connected may it be suicide squad connection to wonder woman appearing in gotham for wonder woman movie they are connecting their universe

a movie being bad doesn't negate that

That is not a plan. A few bits in the movies being connected is not a plan. That is something you draw on the back of a napkin. It is exactly why it feels haphazard and tacked on in BvS. They are there to promote the idea of inter connectivity, but nothing about this is natural. There is very little tangibly in place for WB/DC. A lot of nebulous ideas, which is exactly why there is news of a Batman flick with no firm date off in the distance, while there isn't much about movies which are suppose to come before.

A real plan revolves around leadership, their talent and a collective creative direction. Watch as the movie continue to be shifted around, delayed and potentially cancelled. Watch as the creative continues to be a revolving door. It shows there is no foundation.

MCU is actually a great example of how this goes right (Captain America) and how this goes wrong (Thor). There was no solid lead in terms of creative or talent for Thor's sequel, and it suffered massively. On the other side of the spectrum was the Russos, who impressed Marvel with their pitch. TWS was a bit of a "test", and now have a pair of directors bring Civil War and then two Avengers flicks. All backed by the writers of the first Captain America movie.

Because of this, they are able to pivot as well. As the Russos said, BvS brought Civil War to the table. And you can do that when the creative and leadership is strong.

It is like the difference between watching the Warriors or Spurs play, teams of great leadership and talent, as opposed to the Thunder, who have talent but no leadership, or the Celtics who have leadership but not enough talent.

 

[Jake Cassidy]

Since, you clearly know better, you should make your own movie, Darth. I imagine it'll be a safe, generic, unoriginal rehash of a classic movie from the 70's.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Since, you clearly know better, you should make your own movie, Darth. I imagine it'll be a safe, generic, unoriginal rehash of a classic movie from the 70's.

I am an 80s guy myself Jake. Love those sci-fi tones. My rip off of The Empire Strikes Back/Blade Runner/Aliens/Terminator will be glorious.

 

[Jake Cassidy]

No Predator? Robocop? Masters of the Universe? Transformers: The Movie? Come on, man.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

No Predator? Robocop? Masters of the Universe? Transformers: The Movie? Come on, man.

Have to keep some stolen ideas for the sequels my man.

 

[Jake Cassidy]

I just want He-Man and Optimus Prime in the same movie. You can do it O Great Basement Dwelling Filmmaker.

 

[Neno_Kos]

Then why did they hire him SPIDEY? I don't think it is random that they lost Miller and Lord. And it isn't simply because Disney and Star Wars came calling.

They hired him cause in process they expected BvS to be major blockbuster cash-cow with critics approval. And movie itself would open door for standalone Flash, Wonder Women movies to take gamble with unproven or less experienced directors from which they liked vision directing big budget movies. Giving things didnt go as planned, first with MoS and now with BvS and Wonder Women movie was already filming on shot locations, WB decided to change only thing they could still change without hurting their original release and it was director for Flash.

 

[chamber-music]

They should get Joe Cornish to direct.

 

[CaptainWagner]

It's stupid the amount of people jumping on this. When Jenkins and Wright left Marvel, was that proof the MCU was a wreck. And those were actual talented directors, not a nobody like this.Smith leaving a film that wouldn't even be starting production for at least a year is not a big deal. Hopefully they can get someone with an actual good track record to replace him. Shane Black would be great.

 

[MadVillainy]

You realize the situation is a tad different and that's why people are perceiving it differently.

 

[JackMercy]

I was actually thinking about Donner's Superman and Burton's Batman, but you do have a point.

Except the 1978-87 Superman films were not really "made" by Warner Bros., effectively only distributed and post-produced a bit by them. The first three and Supergirl (84) were produced independently by the Salkinds, Spengler, and the fourth by Cannon Films. People often forget this...or actually aren't aware of it. Warner Bros. didn't acquire back full film rights to Superman until 1993...and has been fighting with the Siegel/Shuster estates since, as well.

So it's not as simple as just 'crediting' them to Warner Bros.

Nolan's Batman films, Superman Returns, and Man of Steel weren't even fully-funded by Warner Bros., if we're being specific about it...but they do have much more of a direct over-see in these films than in the past.

 

[Doctor Jones]

@Doctor Jones
Word of advise... don't believe everything Faraci says. Actually, that should rather be "anything".

Anyway, posting this:

http://www.thewrap.com/the-flash-movie-loses-director-seth-grahame-smith-over-creative-differences/

If that's the reason, I'd say that definitely something good came out of the BvS situation. Wanted to see Grahame-Smith gone since he was announced.

Just because Faraci can be an ass, doesn't mean he's always wrong and I won't ignore what he says on principle. He actually gets good scoops and has been accurate about things and does great write ups. There's willful ignorance on the Hype when it comes to him, despite his accurate reporting.

In this day and age, a studio should know better to handle these properties. This was the final straw. If they can't handle these two characters in one movie, that means they can't handle any if not most of them. They have no excuse other than immense incompetence and a true lack of knowledge. There is a fundamental problem and that is the studio and its executives making these decisions. This isn't going to change, therefore all the decision making of the following films will lead to failure. SS and WW could succeed, but I don't think now they will be as good as they could be now.

Any studio now who fails like this deserves to be ridiculed. They deserve all the failure coming to them. People are STILL sensitive if God forbid, I say something disparaging yet true about the road these movies are going down even AFTER the disaster that BVS is. What more do you need to be totally convinced??? Two, three, more failed films? If so, the joke's already on you. You don't need to wait. BVS and the fact that the future of the DCCU is being planned in Zack Snyder's work out room says it all. Instead of blaming WB who is making these idiotic decisions, not waking up and sensing that something is seriously, seriously wrong with the future of this DCCU and finding umbrage with me instead, someone on an internet forum, then there could be low self esteem involved.

I've completely divorced myself from these movies. I have a front row seat to the freak show and I'm just gonna be entertained by this chaos. It's all you can do from keeping yourself sad about the wasted potential of comic book movies and the DCCU these days. You have to have a sense of humor.

This DCCU isn't going to go as planned. It could still be there, but vastly different and much fewer (if Batman succeeds, expect more of those, same with SS and WW but that's it with the occasional appearance of other heroes. And this still sounds awful. Seriously, there is no good outcome here) because they made so many fundamental miscalculations.

 

[Logan0327]

if you said drew or umberto i would say yes but devin doesn't have a good track record for breaking stuff devin did say bizarro was gonna be in BVS