BvS The BvS Rumor/Speculation Discussion Thread! - Part 4

[rogbngp]

So is this an actual sighting of Scoot McNairy reported to be spotted in the trailers' glimpse of the Senate hearing that Superman testifies in? (See here).

A theory is being advanced that this could be a Superman: Red Son-inspired Jimmy Olsen. I know nothing about the comic, so I'll leave that for others to dissect. But I would welcome a fresh take on the character, if that guess turns out to be a good one.

 

[rogbngp]

Is this scene in the 4K version of the trailer? If the answer is yes, and someone can kindly provide the link to the 4K download, I'll see about capturing that scene for inspection of a closeup. Even just in 1080p it sure does look like Scoot, though.

 

[dhandler01]

That is from the Comic-Con trailer and as discussed quite a bit over the summer. I still highly doubt he is Jimmy Olson it is a huge stretch.

 

[rogbngp]

That is from the Comic-Con trailer and as discussed quite a bit over the summer. I still highly doubt he is Jimmy Olson it is a huge stretch.

Thanks. It does look like the character will have lost his legs based in stills of him in green socks from the knees down. But other than that who knows!

Um, at the risk of betraying my noobish-ness here about the comic books.. but as I begin to look over the Red Son story (an "Elseworlds" alternate universe tale), it does sort of intrigue me by providing a vision of a Superman that is inclined to be dictatorial and in which Lex creates an evil doppelganger of Supes. Snyder already did an alternate reality comic book with Watchmen, but maybe he is drawn to that sort of thing conceptually. What with the Flash multiverse concept sure to be introduced with Barry Allen eventually, maybe a reality where Superman becomes a tyrant is something that Batman gains a vision of in a nightmarish dream (my guess is that it would be given to him externally if that's the case, though.). I would not expect BvS would be an adaptation of Red Son any more than it will an adaptation of Miller's The Dark Knight Returns, but the film does seem to be drawing from multiple sources as inspiration for its own original story--and to have a Jimmy Olsen who becomes a politician is something I kind of like. I dunno, I'm going to buy Superman: Red Son and read it before I make up my mind on this.

 

[rogbngp]

Btw, re: the desert dream/vision I wanted to refresh my memory about what Wilkinson said, so for for reference sake, here it is. He's describing the desert Batman costume:

It is a different look. Zack had a great idea of this sort of nightmare-ish vision, almost a vision of the future, a post-apocalyptic vision. It's like a dream that Ben has, so we wanted to, it has almost a Mad Max quality to it where it's like the end of the world, trying to survive and then of course Superman and his minions come, so it's sort of a way of representing the amazing amounts of, the sort of obsessive quality that Bruce Wayne has about the threat of Superman. In this film, Superman, of course he's normally seen as a figure of hope, a positive thing, but in this film, his motivations, the consequences of his actions are really being questioned by the world. Is he a savior? Or is he a dangerous alien with unknown intentions? And this becomes an obsession for Bruce Wayne. And he really wants to sort it out. So, it's manifested in this sort of incredible dream that Zack decided to create.

 

[rogbngp]

This is a repost from the "Ben Affleck IS Batman" thread (irt this post), because it really belongs here.

I meant i'm worried we wont see Bats do some detective work... I don't know, its just a fear I have.

Okay, I moved this now to Rumors and Speculations. I have pitched the following idea here and also in this thread in quite a bit of detail. But I'm thinking it very possible that we'll see Batman both being surveiled by the government as a potential threat to Waller's program, and Bats spying on the government in return (Jena Malone's Oracle playing a key role in that). And on this basis, there is reason to conjecture from the following Snyder quote,

"So their relationship is very contentious. What Superman sees as Batman’s limits, Batman sees as Superman trying to control him, acting like an absolute dictator."

that Superman might be setting limits on Batman because the government asks him to (he does in TDRK). And as we know from the first full length trailer, Clark expresses to Perry White that

"This Bat-vigilante's like a one-man reign of terror."

and as Clark tells Bruce to his face at the cocktail party,

"Civil liberties are being trampled upon in your city. People living in fear. He [Batman] thinks he's above the law."

So when we see Clark and Bruce at the party what I'm imagining is that the government (perhaps at Amanda Waller's request) has been spying on Bruce for some time, and knows he is Batman; and the government has asked Superman to reign him in. And Bruce (Batman is always thinking several moves ahead) has already surveiled the government enough to know that Superman is Clark Kent. (This explains why Bruce and Clark seem to know who each other is at the party. It is however the first time they have met out of costume as Bruce and Clark.)

But I'm conjecturing that a deeper layer to this is that this jaded and burnt out Batman has become very bitter toward corruption in government, and sees the military-industrial complex as one of the biggest threats there is to society. (Good Lord, look at what we see of Jesse's Lex in the trailers! The government is giving him access to Kryptonian tech? The military wants to weaponize it so bad that they'll hire a deranged, maniacal psychopath to do that. And look at the results.) He is contemptuous of Superman, perceiving him as younger, green, naive, and a kind of 'lapdog' of the government. Even though in reality Superman probably knows better than to trust the government either--it's an uneasy alliance he has forged with them. But Batman's issues with Superman cooperating with the government would be on the money. For example, for Superman to have left the scout ship in the government's hands is the sort of monumental error in judgment that would fuel Batman's contempt.

Prior to the party scene Batman and Superman may already have had the run-in in which Superman destroys a Batmobile, ripping its doors off for emphasis. There he would be delivering a message to Batman about his vigilantism. So words would be exchanged here obviously. But the big smackdown between Bats and Supes (Batman 'going to war', as Alfred puts it) comes later.

Anyway... based on this speculation, this scene

precedes this one (and gives it context):

Anyway, the point of this exposition is that Batman's detective work and spying is key.

But what we're actually gonna get in this movie is anyone's guess. I do expect, though, that because Batman is being introduced to the DCEU that he'll get more slightly screen time than Superman.

 

[kguillou]

Btw, re: the desert dream/vision I wanted to refresh my memory about what Wilkinson said, so for for reference sake, here it is. He's describing the desert Batman costume:

Wow so...that quote pretty much confirms it then. The only question is, is this just some random dream or is it a vision imposed upon Bruce?

 

[rogbngp]

Wow so...that quote pretty much confirms it then. The only question is, is this just some random dream or is it a vision imposed upon Bruce?

I'm still not sure! He says "it's like a dream" and clarifies that it is "nightmare-ish vision, almost a vision of the future, a post-apocalyptic vision." (emphases mine).

It sounds like Batman is being given a prophetic vision within a dream. Either that or he stumbles onto some peyote in that desert, lol.

 

[The Guard]

It's pretty clearly some kind of premonition he is given or has.

 

[Charlatan]

36 bucks at Amazon after Mar 22

 

[KillerWolf]

I'm still not sure! He says "it's like a dream" and clarifies that it is "nightmare-ish vision, almost a vision of the future, a post-apocalyptic vision." (emphases mine).

It sounds like Batman is being given a prophetic vision within a dream. Either that or he stumbles onto some peyote in that desert, lol.

That wouldn't be a first time. One does not become a master in meditation and martial arts without getting high as a kite every now and then.

I agree with you that the batmobile scene most likely precedes the Lex's party one, by the way.

 

[Unbreakable Lex]

Wilkerson also said the dream/vision was a manifestation of Batman's paranoia, almost hinting that it wasn't a "vision" but more of a true nightmare outcome, Bruce's worst fears realized kinda thing.

 

[Charlatan]

Wilkerson also said the dream/vision was a manifestation of Batman's paranoia, almost hinting that it wasn't a "vision" but more of a true nightmare outcome, Bruce's worst fears realized kinda thing.

Yeah but those Parademons look just like they're supposed to. That's the only thing that keeps me thinking it's more than just a dream. Unless it's just his idea of what a Kryptonian flying monkey robot thing would look like.

 

[rogbngp]

That wouldn't be a first time. One does not become a master in meditation and martial arts without getting high as a kite every now and then.

I agree with you that the batmobile scene most likely precedes the Lex's party one, by the way.

Thanks, and when I watch that party scene now I'm enjoying the party confrontation scene all the more now in that possible context. We'll have to see of course.

 

[KillerWolf]

Yeah but those Parademons look just like they're supposed to. That's the only thing that keeps me thinking it's more than just a dream. Unless it's just his idea of what a Kryptonian flying monkey robot thing would look like.

Well, he is on the right track. Whenever I imagined a Kryptonian flying monkey robot thing it looked pretty much the same, just a bit more hairy. And with a mullet. But otherwise the same.

Thanks, and when I watch that party scene now I'm enjoying the party confrontation scene all the more now in that possible context. We'll have to see of course.

Heh, you know, this is the case with me as well. That context indeed makes the scene all the better. We'll see if we're right of course.

 

[Charlatan]

Well, he is on the right track. Whenever I imagined a Kryptonian flying monkey robot thing it looked pretty much the same, just a bit more hairy. And with a mullet. But otherwise the same.

Hey, don't laugh, as a small child those flying monkeys in Wizard of Oz caused me more than a few nightmares.

 

[KillerWolf]

Hey don't laugh. As a small child those flying monkeys in Wizard of Oz caused me more than a few nightmares.

They were creepy little bastards, as a matter of fact.

 

[tnekkralc]

Speculation continues of a bigger threat...could answer why they 'spoiled' Doomsday:

Is Batman v Superman Hiding An Even Larger Threat Than Doomsday?

 

[Ahasverus]

Speculation continues of a bigger threat...could answer why they 'spoiled' Doomsday:

Is Batman v Superman Hiding An Even Larger Threat Than Doomsday?

Oooooold... but unconfirmed?

 

[ManWithNoName18]

Unfortunately the translation seems a little off. And the wording is weird.

 

[Ahasverus]

Unfortunately the translation seems a little off. And the wording is weird.

Do we know anything about the original? was it a print article or what? The source is foggy af.

 

[Herolee10]

I think it was proven yesterday that entire article was made up by another comic book news related website.

 

[WitchTrialz]

Be prepared guys, now that the rumor of a bigger threat has been dropped, every two bit blogger is gonna be posting about it.

 

[rogbngp]

It has been exposed as a hoax.

 

[morningmimosa]

If their encounter at the party is only the first one outside of their costumes, that would really give the conversation between Bruce and Clark a whole new intensity. I love that idea and hope it will be the case.