The Flash The Flash season 3 episode 11 "Dead or Alive"

[Headliner]

Good episode.

I can't put my finger on it, but I'm losing interest this year compared to previous years.

 

[Mister J]

-Gypsy was fun (and really REALLY hot), as was her dynamic with Cisco (and our man has a type it would seem, hot and dangerous). Hopefully we see her again.

-The Miss Tessmacher/Catco cameo was fun.

-The pop culture references all felt really cool.

-I SO wanted as Star Wars reference when they went to that lava planet (Mustafar anyone)?

-They remembered that Iris was a journalist, cool.

Insanely hot, that Gypsy. Also, a far different version of the character than I'm used to. She needs to show up again.

I was expecting Cisco to make with a Mustafar quip. I knew I couldn't have been the only one.

 

[DrCosmic]

Was it just me, or was this the best written Flash episode we've had in a while. Cisco's quips while flirting with Gypsy were golden and Iris was actually badass, and Wally was actually fun. Even Caitlin had something specific to do, it was off screen, but man. And there was, like, genuine character development for Cisco and others. I'd be really excited about Flash if I knew I'd get this kind of entertainment every week.

 

[zenith16]

I think that's why I liked the episode so much. I've really missed cheerful, funny Cisco. Watching him mope around and scold HR just hasn't been much fun. Let's hope this personality development stays the same for the rest of the season.

that and I hope that cisco start working on that tech barry got him last week from plunder. and makes it work for diggle I stated that was something that should be made for diggle before he got that name spartan when I was pushing the ordinance name. habe gun with smart bullets similar to trick arrows and that rifle is it.


if cisco can make handgun's and smg variants just for diggle and some more special arrow head for oliver and think they'll be set. I may have dropped that show and I had alot of reason for it. but that is something that should be considered would be of great help to team arrow.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Al didn't sound like a jerk to me.
"Who needs to work on his people skills?"

Are we going to talk about how much Barry needs to up his speed every season?

Looks like it.

 

[CrystalFortress]

So was it me or was the graph of Barry's rate of speed increase really over simplified to the point it was just an warning of dread. I'd assume his speed doesn't increase at the same rate all the time, he'll go through bursts where the rate is greater and by choosing only 2 points you lose the data where you can demonstrate he has the capability to put in the effort for huge improvement.

Did anyone catch the speed reading when Wally came out the speed tunnel thing? I could have sworn it was over 1800 m/s but that doesn't jive with the dialogue with that being over Mach 5. The Mach 3 Line suggests it'd be just over 1000 m/s

 

[Mike Murdock]

They are really making people over the top with Wally.

Are we going to talk about how much Barry needs to up his speed every season?

About one minute in:
[YT]WvUXbzxxdo0[/YT]

 

[flashpo1nt]

well i don't like the idea of barry implying wally is going to save iris, it seems as if he's saying wally is going to surpass barry in speed, thats ridiculous if they do that.

basically there's no point calling barry the fastest man alive anymore, and there's no reason wally should be able to accelerate his improvements that fast to the point of surpassing barry. Especially since barry has attempted way more things to try and get faster including communicating with the speedforce, and all wally's been doing is running...makes no sense.

Sure barry has done some cool tricks with his powers but honestly the guy should be significantly faster than his friends wally and that includes jessie...I really don't know why wally is getting faster so quick just by running when barry did the same thing and wasn't making huge improvements like that.

 

[zenith16]

well i don't like the idea of barry implying wally is going to save iris, it seems as if he's saying wally is going to surpass barry in speed, thats ridiculous if they do that.

basically there's no point calling barry the fastest man alive anymore, and there's no reason wally should be able to accelerate his improvements that fast to the point of surpassing barry. Especially since barry has attempted way more things to try and get faster including communicating with the speedforce, and all wally's been doing is running...makes no sense.

Sure barry has done some cool tricks with his powers but honestly the guy should be significantly faster than his friends wally and that includes jessie...I really don't know why wally is getting faster so quick just by running when barry did the same thing and wasn't making huge improvements like that.

that's not what barry has in mind or is saying . the point is when he saw thing in the future it was of Barry that didn't know that future and there was no wally there savatar knows this and knows no matter what Barry won't be able to stop him with speed, this is about the element of surprise then speed. have wally in closer position where iris is standing there now that they know the place and time

while savitar is focused on taunting with his annoy talk to the hero which would be Barry. Wally is in a closer position and in hiding like the bush's I guess I hope they have camo flug or cloaking or holographic device there which will be unknown to savitar. So wally be able to reach is older sister befor savatar can stab her cause wally is the new unknown factor . he was there in what Barry saw. so it's interesting move.


This isn't speed, so much as it's just about out smarting the villain. so please don't think about it in these terms. neither is faster then the other . it's about positions and strategy and more importantly foiling the villains plans cause speed doesn't matter to this villain currently .

 

[zenith16]

or distracting savatar with a new element that the plan there . He's just expecting Barry and may be too over confident in the speed is every thing department

 

[Batmannerism]

Good episode. I liked that we're getting closer to Cisco being his old self while also evolving into a crimefighter. I liked Gypsy other than her name. That needs to go unless they decide she's not Cindy and her parents named her that without much thought. Yes I know comics, but come on. Jessie's not a Chambers either.

I like that Julian's making use as part of the team while still reporting for work. Man's got priorities.

H.R. develops enough to work if this is the final form Cavanagh takes. Not my favorite take, but Harry without Jessie would be irresponsible I guess and they left no room for an Earth-1 Harrison surviving, let alone to exonerate himself of Eobard's crimes. Don't think the writer's will ever touch that with a ten foot pull.

The twist that Barry doesn't need to get faster Wally does is new.

In all serious if we're going to use Wally I'm glad he's not wasted anymore and is getting up to a level to help Barry. I get the feeling though that the show will run out speedster plots to top the last and need to cut back which will mean he or Barry will go. Either Barry "dies" as the final twist and that's probably being saved down the line when the movie's made, or Wally moves over to Legends and we lose another important Flash character to that show.

I wish they'd have gone with Iris doing actual reporting all along, but they can't even keep that consistent on Supergirl where that's what the main characters do. Of course people will complain that Iris didn't answer to daddy, or Barry, or whatever people are going to suddenly complain about after putting her down all season for doing nothing, but be supportive.

Very much on the same page with most of that. Felton has been a welcome additon this season, great to see him getting some good moments - a Cisco centred episode has been a long time coming - they should change the name to Flash and Friends or Flash and company, it's always been about the team, and while Barry's the star player he wouldn't have made it without his peeps.

Having Gypsy defeat Barry so easily is a bit silly, she would have to have super speed to open a portal before Barry got to her (given that he's able to run fast enough to travel through time).
The writers needed a better way to get around the inevitable attempt by Barry to intervene.

All in all a good episode though !

 

[zenith16]

Having Gypsy defeat Barry so easily is a bit silly, she would have to have super speed to open a portal before Barry got to her (given that he's able to run fast enough to travel through time).


The writers needed a better way to get around the inevitable attempt by Barry to intervene.

nah A teleporter is about one of the few characters that can throw off a speedster charaters. even japan has been show caseing this very thing with their anime shows inthe same genre alot recently. next to other that minipulate space by being every where at once..

I belive that power called Ubiquitous there. and there also making sure a sppedster has no place to run from the start among others or not allowing them to have a good footing to start.

so they are sort of on the right track with Barry there.

I did find it weird reverb in earth 2 was scared of zoom him self and with death storm too . those are the only people could have taken him on. I guess they just weren't that skilled in their powers and that version of Ronny most likely doesn't know about his own abitlity to phase and transmute yet. And he died before learning yet.

 

[Saitou Hajime]

Now I really don't want Julian to be the prophesied turncoat. He was such a great addition to the team, with his strategic input and brutal snark.

 

[ZIPBAGS]

I guess the way the episode ended they left it open for Gypsy to return full time. In that she could have been found to have lost HR and is banished from Earth-19.

 

[Thome216]

They just vibed to Supergirl's world.

No idea why, but that was a nice little treat.

I'm sure they vibed there because Cisco has been there before.

Liked this episode! Very FunCisco all the way! And of course he would flirt with the hot girl trying to kill him. That's his charm. Although I will agree, her giving up when he tripped her up once was too easy. She had him the same way a few times and hadn't considered the fight won as simply as that. But I'll forgive, because it's FunCisco!

I also liked the twist with Barry saying Wally will be saving Iris. It shows a definite growth in the character, away from the belief that Barry alone has to rescue and save everyone. A good leader uses every member on the team in order to win, and the best way to best Savitar may just be to toss a ringer in, especially if Savitar is convinced Barry will try and do it all himself.

I'm liking Julius on the team too. Just keep him prickly, he's better that way! Though I liked Cait's little aside comments about 'improving...'

 

[Avenging Angel]

Cisco is Nightcrawler now awesome!

 

[BlueLanternKal]

I don't think Wally is going to save Iris.

I think Barry, Jay, Wally, and Jesse are going to save Iris.

 

[batnkevlar]

Are there any hints to what the lava world was?

 

[DrCosmic]

So was it me or was the graph of Barry's rate of speed increase really over simplified to the point it was just an warning of dread. I'd assume his speed doesn't increase at the same rate all the time, he'll go through bursts where the rate is greater and by choosing only 2 points you lose the data where you can demonstrate he has the capability to put in the effort for huge improvement.

Did anyone catch the speed reading when Wally came out the speed tunnel thing? I could have sworn it was over 1800 m/s but that doesn't jive with the dialogue with that being over Mach 5. The Mach 3 Line suggests it'd be just over 1000 m/s

Yeah, I got the feeling a long time ago that they play fast and loose with science in order to get the dramatic effect they want. It's a shame because if they were more consistent they'd get more eyeballs and the drama they create would reach back to things established instead of trying to exposition-in drama that perhaps isn't all that compelling in light of what's come before.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Are there any hints to what the lava world was?

My brother guessed the world of Trigon.

 

[legendkillin]

Instead of worrying about getting faster, they need to train Cisco. He has great potential and if Gypsy can stop Wally. That should mean Cisco can stop Savitar, he just needs to get better.

 

[Thome216]

^
Agreed.
Savitar only has speed as his power, while Cait and Cisco can bring so many more powers into the mix. Yes, the show is called 'The Flash' but he's the leader of a team and the 'team' is what should be stopping Savitar. Especially as Barry has been noway near up to the task.