The Guns thread - Part 1

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Elektra1 said:
That's hilariously ironic.
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I'm pretty sure I saw pictures of toddlers holding up anti-Trump signs... that is ****ing ridiculous. Don't use little kids to espouse your political agenda, even if you're right.
 
Greens said:
I'm pretty sure I saw pictures of toddlers holding up anti-Trump signs... that is ****ing ridiculous. Don't use little kids to espouse your political agenda, even if you're right.
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But what does that have to with calling them "violent radicals"?
 
Greens said:
I'm pretty sure I saw pictures of toddlers holding up anti-Trump signs... that is ****ing ridiculous. Don't use little kids to espouse your political agenda, even if you're right.
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I don't have a problem teaching kids that protesting can be valuable.
 
Generally speaking, I don’t think small children should be involved in protests they’re too young to understand or to choose to be affiliated with.
 
Greens said:
I'm pretty sure I saw pictures of toddlers holding up anti-Trump signs... that is ****ing ridiculous. Don't use little kids to espouse your political agenda, even if you're right.
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While I agree to a point, I bet that the loudest complainers about this are also the ones who see no problem forcing their kids to go to church.
 
Greens said:
I'm pretty sure I saw pictures of toddlers holding up anti-Trump signs... that is ****ing ridiculous. Don't use little kids to espouse your political agenda, even if you're right.
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Normally I'd agree with you, except that Trump isn't a normal president. Like, I could hate W. Bush's administration but he handled himself with enough dignity that I wouldn't think it necessary or appropriate to try to explain to a very young child all the things that were wrong with his presidency.

However, Trump routinely engages in socially maladjusted behavior that I wouldn't want any kid to emulate. So parents are kind of forced to deal with him as a factor in bringing up their kids. It's not even a policy or GOP issue. It's pre-verbal, even. Just look at the way Trump shoved the Prime Minister of Montenegro on TV. You'd be remiss if you didn't tell your kid that he/she shouldn't look up to someone who acts like that.
 
Talk about missing the point. Thousands of gun deaths on the one hand versus several hundred moms who brought their kids and asked them to hold signs at a rally. So hard to put these into perspective.
 
I spent 4 hours at the #marchforourlives today.

I saw hundreds of signs condemning the NRA & gun owners.

I did not see a single sign condemning the shooter, Nikolas Cruz.

Nor did I see a single sign condemning the FBI or Broward Co. Sheriff for ignoring dozens of warning signs.
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- Benny Johnson
 
Thats... not what the marches were about.

Because, if he didn't have those guns, those other points are kind of moot.
 
Haha, yeah...let's try to negate the need for gun reform in this country by arguing that protesters weren't making the right signs as I deem it. Conservatives are crazy these days. Protesters are pissed at the shooter too, believe me, but we recognize that he was just one crazy kid and there's no real reason to protest him. What would that accomplish exactly? Jeeze.
 
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Holding up signs that condemn Cruz is...stating the obvious? No one is arguing that. Whoever Benny Johnson is, they're an idiot.
 
MaceB said:
Haha, yeah...let's try to negate the need for gun reform in this country by arguing that protesters weren't making the right signs as I deem it. Conservatives are crazy these days. Protesters are pissed at the shooter too, believe me, but we recognize that he was just one crazy kid and there's no real reason to protest him. What would that accomplish exactly? Jeeze.
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IMO, crazy is screaming bloody murder at an organization for defending our 2nd amendment rights, while saying nothing about the cops sat outside and did nothing while kids were getting shot. Then there's that Obama-era policy which ended school based arrests based on "minor misbehavior."
 
Yes, because lets defend Dana Loesch. Who called out these students that they wouldn't be famous if their classmates were still alive.

Look, this is essentially what the NRA has created. Pushing the narrative "there is nothing we can do" "that this is the price of freedom". The generation that has grown up with active shooter drills is coming of age. And has found their voice.

And amazingly, there is more than one issue at stake. As has been pointed out, they broadened the protest beyond just school shootings. This was a protest over gun violence in general.
 
Mike5575 said:
IMO, crazy is screaming bloody murder at an organization for defending our 2nd amendment rights, while saying nothing about the cops sat outside and did nothing while kids were getting shot. Then there's that Obama-era policy which ended school based arrests based on "minor misbehavior."
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There is nothing crazy about recognizing the obvious truth that our gun laws and regulations are fundamentally broken and need reform.

There is also nothing crazy about the fact that the 2nd amendment actually allows for this reform. The founding fathers did not say we could have guns without restrictions. The line that says "a well regulated militia is important to the security of a free state" indicates they thought restrictions were important and necessary.

The NRA doesn't even represent a majority of its own members. They are extremist and corrupt. They need to be treated the way the tobacco companies are now treated. They stand in the way of common sense.
 
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Mike5575 said:
IMO, crazy is screaming bloody murder at an organization for defending our 2nd amendment rights, while saying nothing about the cops sat outside and did nothing while kids were getting shot. Then there's that Obama-era policy which ended school based arrests based on "minor misbehavior."
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God, that's some next level crazy talk you've got going. Folks were protesting because they believe that common sense gun regulation can exist along with the 2nd amendment, and can help the obvious gun violence epidemic that is happening in the United States. That is their right to do. Protesters are under no obligation to talk about all the wrongs in the universe... including the local law enforcement's reaction to school shootings.
...We're not out to blame anyone. We're out to fix the problem. What is wrong with you?
 
Elektra1 said:
While I agree to a point, I bet that the loudest complainers about this are also the ones who see no problem forcing their kids to go to church.
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I don't agree with that either, but that only makes it hypocritical on the left. Leave kids who don't understand **** about politics out of it.
 
Mike5575 said:
IMO, crazy is screaming bloody murder at an organization for defending our 2nd amendment rights, while saying nothing about the cops sat outside and did nothing while kids were getting shot. Then there's that Obama-era policy which ended school based arrests based on "minor misbehavior."
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That organization isn't defending the 2nd amendment. They are a trade organization attempting to swamp the market with a profoundly unsafe product. The 2nd amendment applies to the right of a 'well-regulated militia' to bear muskets. It was never intended as a blank check for my cousin in Florida to amass a stockpile of military-grade weapons for his own amusement.

And if I'm wrong, then... the 2nd amendment, like any law that is obsolete or has become harmful to the republic, should be repealed.

For decades reasonable people have insisted that they do not want to take away all guns, only put in place a better system to regulate their ownership and use. The NRA's response to these positions has been to further radicalize and portray ANY regulation of firearms as an assault on the 2nd amendment.

You don't need to look farther than an NRA ad featuring the despicable Dana Loesch-- A person who has essentially mobilized fear and hatred for her own wealth and celebrity--to see that the NRA is selling paranoid fantasies as a way to enrich the gun industry. It is a cancer on society.

Look at any comparable democracy-- Canada, the UK, Australia. They live with tight gun laws and the rate of gun violence is vastly smaller than the U.S., not just in raw numbers but proportionally. This isn't hypothetical: We can clearly see that other countries with better laws do not suffer as we do. We can change. We must.
 
He also sounds super unhinged. I hope he doesn't own a gun (he probably does). Accusing people of being "lovers of Satan" is disturbing.
 
I'm shocked. :( You'd think a shooting survivor would have more sympathy for someone else in the same boat.
 
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