The Dark Knight Rises The Joker's Role in the Third Film

[TheseScars]

I can't imagine there being a Batman 3, a end to the epic story the Nolan's are telling without the Joker being a antagonist...Nolan said it himself that he is wrapping up the continuity...There is no villain on the planet like the Joker and they know it, that was the trouble they had with writing Batman 3...he's a intricle part of ending this story bc he's sill alive in the films....

Harvey isn't coming back not even in a dream sequence bc thats not Chris's style.
Ras isn't coming back bc he is dead as a door nail and he's not supernatural in this story.
I say no to Poison Ivy bc it's a ridiculous character in this continuity.
No to Penguin bc he himself is ridiculous, but it might be a slight possibility.

The Joker has to lead the freaks against Batman and Gotham...I think he will have a starring role in Batman 3 and I think Michael Shannon should take on the role..The guy is a tremendous veteran actor and his performance in Revolutionary Road had so many nuances of Heath's Joker and the voice is near identical...once behind the makeup I think he will melt into the character, the guy did a tremendous job with THE best role in RR, he lost to Heath I believe at the Oscars...he would of won probably if Heath wasn't nominated...

My story would have The Joker, The Riddler, Black Mask, Catwoman and Clayface....The Joker has the mob and Black Mask to back him up while the Riddler plays the role of a citizen gone mad and plays a sort of minor role while Selina Kyle distracts Bruce and maybe helps Batman?...Clayface can be a easter egg as a guy who is obsessed with plastic surgery or something....it can be done and I think to be a success in ending this franchise these characters should be used...most importantly THE JOKER.

 

[CJ]

Just because they re gonna be doing it forever, it doesnt mean that they have to be doing it every day.

I agree.

Batman does have a wide assortment of villains. I would have liked Nolan to do at least 4 or 5 movies so we can see most of his rogue gallery and then his final confrontation with The Joker in the last film.

But Nolan said Batman 3 will be the last in his Bat-movies. If The Joker and Batman really are "destined to do this forever" then it would be ridiculous to keep The Joker out such an important storyline. The Joker is Batman's greatest enemy. You NEED him in the finale of this series.

Besides, even if The Joker isn't the main villain, Batman 3 is going to have to show the aftermath of what occurred in TDK, and that means The Joker needs to at least have a minor role (Joker in Arkham or jail, Joker on trial, flashbacks, and his inevitable escape) You can't just ignore his presence.

Ras isn't coming back bc he is dead as a door nail and he's not supernatural in this story.

"Or is Ras al Ghul immortal? Are his methods supernatural?" But yeah, I say keep him dead. He's a terribly generic and uninteresting villain.

 

[The Joker]

No to Penguin bc he himself is ridiculous, but it might be a slight possibility.

Why is Penguin ridiculous? Why is a man being obsessed with birds and umbrellas any more ridiculous than a man being obsessed with Bats and dressing up like one?

Penguin fits so well into Batman's world, and is often dismissed because of his rather comical appearance. Most of Batman's enemies are not a physical match for him. Penguin is intellectually matched with Batman. He's devious, clever, and utterly ruthless. He's always been a major figure in Gotham's underworld, either as a super villain or as the mastermind operating out of his Iceberg Lounge.

 

[KalMart]

Why is Penguin ridiculous? Why is a man being obsessed with birds and umbrellas any more ridiculous than a man being obsessed with Bats and dressing up like one?

Because the guy dressing as a bat isn't short and fat with a long pointy nose....and bats/clowns are scarier than penguins. t:

 

[zeptron]

Some people who say Penguin not being realistic enough for Nolan seem to base this off of Burton's version. He's not some mutated bird freak.

This is similar to the people saying Riddler is too much Joker because of Batman Forever.

 

[The Joker]

Because the guy dressing as a bat isn't short and fat with a long pointy nose....and bats/clowns are scarier than penguins. t:

This is what I was talking about above, Penguin is often dismissed solely based on the fact that he doesn't look threatening. It's a silly criticism, IMO. I don't find The Riddler or Ra's Al Ghul scary looking, for example. But it doesn't diminish the fact they are effective villains. So is the Penguin.

 

[Mr. Earle]

Nolan said that he will tie up the story in B3. That could mean a lot of things:

1) End of Batman's story. He dies, he quits, etc.
2) End of Batman's rookie years. The movie ends with Bruce realizing that he'll be Batman forever.
3) Tying up TDK's loose ends, meaning the taking the blame thing.

The first one should have the Joker, but he's not important for the last two. If its a story that shows the ending of Bruce's rookie years and how he finally understands his destiny, you can use any villain. And number (3) doesnt need the Joker either. He could play a part, but after tearing Gotham a new one in TDK, i'd rather someone else tries something different this time around. Like freezing it, or whatever.

 

[BestGirl]

Nolan said that he will tie up the story in B3. That could mean a lot of things:

1) End of Batman's story. He dies, he quits, etc.
2) End of Batman's rookie years. The movie ends with Bruce realizing that he'll be Batman forever.
3) Tying up TDK's loose ends, meaning the taking the blame thing.

The first one should have the Joker, but he's not important for the last two. If its a story that shows the ending of Bruce's rookie years and how he finally understands his destiny, you can use any villain. And number (3) doesnt need the Joker either. He could play a part, but after tearing Gotham a new one in TDK, i'd rather someone else tries something different this time around. Like freezing it, or whatever.

I hope it's those two. I don't want this Batman's saga to end so soon. He hasn't even fought most of his villains yet.

 

[KalMart]

This is what I was talking about above, Penguin is often dismissed solely based on the fact that he doesn't look threatening. It's a silly criticism, IMO. I don't find The Riddler or Ra's Al Ghul scary looking, for example. But it doesn't diminish the fact they are effective villains. So is the Penguin.

So is Mxyzptlk...but would you really want to see him in a Superman movie?

 

[The Joker]

So is Mxyzptlk...but would you really want to see him in a Superman movie?

Yes, I would if he was written properly.

In fact I'd rather see him in the next movie instead of Luthor.

 

[Laderlappen]

I dont want the Joker in the third. The Joker already did his thing in The Dark Knight. He killed a bunch of people, brought chaos in Gotham, and was caught in the end. What more can you do with the character that would be different from what we saw in The Dark Knight? Plus its the last movie, I wanna see new villians. The first mistake you can do when making a sequel is having the same story as the previous film.

 

[Mr. Earle]

I dont care for Mxyplizjfowhsfi. Batmite on the other hand...

 

[KalMart]

Yes, I would if he was written properly.

In fact I'd rather see him in the next movie instead of Luthor.

Well, maybe you could put them in a kid's movie or TV show together...but in the meantime, I'd rather leave the big movies to the bad-asses. t:

 

[TheseScars]

Penguin would have to be done exactly right to fit into this world and erase the Devito version out of the general publics mind so they can understand Nolan's version...tough task....I can see a cameo or a reference but not as a main villain....

I think the Joker will be the main villain but there will be multiple threats...the Riddler in my opinion makes a great secondary villain bc of his multiple incarnations as a criminal, FBI agent or whatever, a obsessive compulsive...he just works in this world Nolan created. I also think Selina Kyle works well since Rachel is gone but Catwoman might be tricky...Black Mask is a shoe in bc he's never been done and is a very interesting character that fits in Nolans world...also Killer Croc and Clayface could be adapted to fit in also...but bottemline is the Joker is a must to end the trilogy...a guy like that doesn't stop after his first crime spree...he tries endlessly to escape and do it again..

Do you really see Ledger's Joker sitting contently in a cell waiting to die?...NOOOO....He will get out or he never goes in and holds the city to ransom or destroys it...I see them pulling a Dark Knight Returns for Batman 3 either setting it into the future or having Batman retired for a little while to calm the heat and having to come out of retirement, this awakes the Joker and he comes back to battle with Bats 1 last time and he kills himself after a brutal battle with Batman....Batman being pulled out of retirement can be done with any of the villains i mentioned..

 

[Rodrigo90]

I imagine Joker to be quite content with his actions. It could be written,he knows the truth and doesnt mind sitting in Arkham,knowing that Gotham will be in turmoil and despair over losing Dent,and that Batman is now the enemy to the public. He will remain quiet about the secret,as revealing it would spoil the misery he has caused for Batman. But when Batman is cleared of any wrong doing,he will make his return to torment the Dark Knight.

 

[NoName86]

I'll say one thing, may God be with whoever picks up Batman after Nolan leaves, because he is gonna have A LOTTTTTTTTT of convincing to do for the fans.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

I think if Nolan is ending the story with the third then it needs Joker. I've said it a million times but having the finale to a Bat trilogy without Joker is just... nonsense IMO.

Yea people will say it disrespects Heath Ledger but at the end of the day, it doesn't really does it. Joker is a fictional character and a great one.

So like i said i think Joker is needed for a finale. Maybe not the whole film, just the final third or something, at Arkham. I'd pick Tom Hardy for Joker.

 

[Asterious Polyp]

Just subscribing, don't mind me.

 

[Closerframe]

In the beginning I was against the whole recasting of the Joker because Ledger put so much work and effort into the role and it deserves to be just his, but as the years have passed and Nolan finally admitting he wants this to be the last film I think recasting the Joker is the only way this film can properly end.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Two-Face returning would make TDK's ending pointless.

They have this emotional ending with this sad music, but they're just faking the memorial service because he is actually alive. And then he'll break out of Arkham and go on a killing spree again. And then random Gotham citizen will go "But wait, Harvey Dent is a killer now? Didn't Batman kill those people?" (Also, they used that back-from-the-dead device for Gordon in TDK)

His story was told in TDK. It covered the full rise and fall of Harvey Dent. There's nothing left to tell with him. He only became a reckless villain because he was inspired by revenge. Do you really think this Two-Face is going to start committing crimes by 2's randomly?

This I completely disagree with. Two-Face is an incredibly rich character that had loads of potential that was ultimately wasted in TDK. Don't get me wrong, I love TDK, but Two-Face was wasted. You can do so much with that character. And I'm talking more then just the gimmicky "I'm going to rob the second national bank on the second tuesday of the second month of the year" kind of thing. I'm talking about his obsession with duality, the dual nature of humans, the light and dark of them, and how he could exploit that. And we never saw the split personality, which with a Nolan touch, could have been extremely interesting.

Two-Face could have been much, much more. I understand where Nolan was going with his ending in TDK, but ultimately, I don't think the ending was strong enough to make the trade off of losing such a versatile character acceptable.

 

[Dirt Like Me]

This I completely disagree with. Two-Face is an incredibly rich character that had loads of potential that was ultimately wasted in TDK.

I kind of agree with this. It bugs me that most people in Gotham had no idea that Two-Face ever existed, and that his major motivatation was revenge for his dead girlfriend. TDK touched on some great ideas for the character--like chaos being fair, and being a just man in an unjust world--but then the powers that be seemingly killed him off before these ideas could be expanded. I thought Eckhardt was great in the role he was given, though.

But, I think I need to reserve judgment on how the character was ultimately handled, because I think that unravelling/resolving the cover-up will play a big part in the next movie. In that sense, I don't think Two-Face's story is "done" just yet. I hope that Joker returns to have a hand in that resolution, too.

 

[Two-Face]

This I completely disagree with. Two-Face is an incredibly rich character that had loads of potential that was ultimately wasted in TDK. Don't get me wrong, I love TDK, but Two-Face was wasted. You can do so much with that character. And I'm talking more then just the gimmicky "I'm going to rob the second national bank on the second tuesday of the second month of the year" kind of thing. I'm talking about his obsession with duality, the dual nature of humans, the light and dark of them, and how he could exploit that. And we never saw the split personality, which with a Nolan touch, could have been extremely interesting.

Two-Face could have been much, much more. I understand where Nolan was going with his ending in TDK, but ultimately, I don't think the ending was strong enough to make the trade off of losing such a versatile character acceptable.

Much as I love TDK but I agree with this. There is a lot stuff Nolan left out in the movie, they didn't need to kill him off.

 

[El Payaso]

I think if Nolan is ending the story with the third then it needs Joker. I've said it a million times but having the finale to a Bat trilogy without Joker is just... nonsense IMO.

Yea people will say it disrespects Heath Ledger but at the end of the day, it doesn't really does it. Joker is a fictional character and a great one.

So like i said i think Joker is needed for a finale. Maybe not the whole film, just the final third or something, at Arkham. I'd pick Tom Hardy for Joker.

I absolutely agree. The Joker is totally necessary to end the story properly. Joker, as any other character, is bigger than the actors who play him.

 

[8Diagrams(WU)]

I absolutely agree. The Joker is totally necessary to end the story properly. Joker, as any other character, is bigger than the actors who play him.

I agree. Nolan clearly wants to deliver the story (at least this story arc. Im not entirely convinced Nolan will be done with batman for good) they planned without any changes and there is a very good chance that the joker figured into the plans of B3 considering the Joker is the cause of the predicament batman is in at the end of TDK. The story isnt finished yet and the joker already plays a big part in it. Its sad heath passed away but the Joker does not die with him. The show must continue.

 

[Bats]

I'd like to see Two-Face return in the next film only because:

A. Killing off a major villain I don't ever agree with really.
2. I'd like to see how Batman & Gordon handle the past coming back to haunt them.

Very little people know that Dent became Two-Face, and of those ones, I highly doubt they'd care to make it public.

The Joker returning? Kind of the same reason I'd be against Two-Face appearing is that I'd rather it not be a rehash of TDK even though I think TDK is phenomenal.

He should be referenced at least. He was in BB as we all know. So him not being mentioned even in this one would feel weird.