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Discussion in 'Marvel Comics' started by PhotoJones, Dec 12, 2007.
No, before that. Although it could be viewed as a kind of boot camp.
Anubis just has the best job.
Not feelin' the art, but I'll give this a try.
You're crazy. That art is great.
Nighthawk's hand is kind of small in that first panel on the bottom row, but I like it overall.
Yeah, that's pretty weird, actually.
Colossus is in it, I'm on it
"Who is this Last Defender and how can he be summoned?"
"It is Tarna... of the Blood of Tarek the Defender and must be summoned as our forefathers summoned Tarek himself.... from within."
Sorry... Thread title gave me a Heavy Metal flashback.
I guess Wolverine inspired him to try the "multiple teams at once" thing...
I want to see that colored.
I can live w/ 2
Reposting and expanding on my prior thoughts:
The biggest problem with Blazing Skull is he looks like Ghost Rider and that may fool casual readers in the shoo who see issue #1 and who don't read solicts online. Fooling readers is never a good way to avoid a second issue dive. Still, the choice is one I like; Blazing Skull is a Golden Age character, and as JSA shows, keeping some around to train the younger heroes is a good idea. It might be cute if it becomes a running gag for Skull to have to go, "No, I am NOT GHOST RIDER! That biker punk ripped ME off!" to people who confuse the two.
Still, most teams have more than four members, so I have some hope for some of the other actual Defenders showing up, especially as many are registered with the Initiative and Nighthawk personally worked with all of them for years.
To stay fresh, Nighthawk actually did lead the Defenders for short stints when Dr. Strange would be away, and sometimes funded and housed the team, but he usually was too unstable to lead for long.
Still...that roster does sound random. Like someone stuck all the pages of the Marvel Handbook on a wall and threw some darts. Why Colossus and not some X-Men who were actual Defenders like Beast, Iceman, or Angel? Especially when She-Hulk is as strong or stronger?
The art looks good to me, man.
I'm glad it's the Blazing Skull. I groaned when I first saw the cover, thinking it was Ghost Rider. BS is a much better character.
The last thing he was in was INVADERS, which I didn't touch. The art looked weird and I heard nothing good about it.
I just fear the casual comic reader picking up #1 because they think Ghost Rider is in it, at least some casual readers, being disappointed by that shallow means, and ditching it for a sharp #2 drop. It is a weird decision since Ghost Rider is well known, or at least better known than Blazing Skull. To paraphrase someone, "Joe Casey is either very smart or very dumb."
Colossus, though, THAT is the real mystery. Very random. What, is it Marvel's life's mission to get every one of their X-characters into some mainstream superhero team? Sometimes it works, and sometimes it just is ill-fitting. I don't see the need. Especially since Colossus has been THE wimpiest 85 ton tanker for the longest time now, and I don't see that changing. His most recent claim to fame was beating Ord, a few issues after Lockheed did. Aside for that, whenever he is pitted against any other "tanker" character, Hulk, Juggernaut, etc., he is always punked. Even Strong Guy got to TKO Spider-Man once. Colossus' last "pwned" moment before Ord was friggin' Proteus. In the 70's. I also don't see much of a character reason. Beast, Iceman, Angel, have served on other teams before, like the Avengers, Champions, and/or Defenders. Colossus really has never left the X-Men. It either will work, or seem random. Nothing in-between.
And my fingers are still crossed for Hellcat, Valkyrie, and Gargoyle. It won't feel like the Defenders without at least one or two of 'em beside Nighthawk. Especially since the "founders" are all busy.
I don't mind Colossus being a Defender. It's rare we get to see a character like interact with people outside of his own team. I'm for it. As for people being "tricked" into buying this due to a flaming skull being on the cover: Good. Most people looking for GR comics are assclowns anyway. A potentially decent comic might do them some good.
Was that a shot at me because I read GHOST RIDER?
The problem with shallow fans is, if they buy a comic for that one dude on the cover, and that dude isn't there, quality doesn't matter and they just cut off. Second issue drops burn many books; DEFENDERS by Joe Casey will probably be a book that needs every fan.
I'm not saying I would RATHER Ghost Rider. Not at all. Just that, I don't know, more of Blazing Skull was shown so no one would be misled or confused.
As for Colossus, it seems silly to me that Iceman, Beast, and Angel were all Defenders before yet they decide to stick Colossus on the roster. Angel is busy with the Renegades and whatnot, and Beast has Messiah Complex (in-between visiting Camp Hammond to introduce Moonstar, of course), but that always left Iceman. I'd probably rather him than Colossus.
There would be the hope that Joe Casey will use this book to finally, FINALLY have Colossus bust some ass and build a rep as a tanker (which means actually beating, or putting up a worthy showing, alone, against a top class tanker), but I have been disappointed too often to hope for that. Hopefully he'll at least get some pants out of the new artist. I really don't see the motive here. Colossus has never desired to be a hero outside of the X-Men, who he has a personal connection to. Why start now?
If Joe Casey returned Colossus to the tanker status that he once had, that's reason enough for me to have him on the team. He's the new Scott Summers. Once cool, now *****fied, needs desperately for some writer to make him cool again.
And no, that wasn't a shot at you. I was stereotyping. Don't worry, you're not a stereotype, Dread. In that way, at least.
And this could use all the sales it'll get. The people who are genuinely interested in this will buy it all the way through. Those people feeling "tricked" could possibly pick it up and all that will do is help sales for the first issue. The book's certainly not relying on that, anyway.
But he needs a REASON for being on the team that makes sense. When Angel & Iceman founded the Champions, they were fun-loving college guys taking a break from Xavier's and finding adventure in Cali. Beast joined the Avengers 'cuz...I forget. But what the hell is Colossus' motive?
Now, if Iceman or one of the other aforementioned former Defenders X-People turns out to be on the roster, then I would understand it more. Iceman could definitely use a boost, too. The reason has to be better than, "*shrug* What else is a big metal mutant to do?"
Blazing Skull came out in 1941 and his history is rather scarce. Every team needs a good Golden Ager who killed Nazi's and I'm game for exploring him.
I don't say that because I dislike Colossus. Far from it. I actually like him. The problem is that because I do, I have been treated to one weak-ass moment after another for him. Even in WWH: X-MEN he gets snapped like a twig. Whedon had his chance but after Ord just blew it with inaction.
Especially since She-Hulk is on the roster. She's just as strong as Colossus, and with anger can likely get stronger. She is more popular and has maintained an ongoing far longer. I'm curious as to why the heck they're on a team together when they both do the same thing.
Colossus is disenchanted with the X-Men's newfound penchant for nasty violence and leaves to save lives a superhero. Problem solved.
Oh, I totally agree. 616 Colossus needs waaay more feats of strength and wins. His Ultimate counterpart is one of the most badass characters in that universe. I think it'd help to draw Colossus bigger too though
Eh, at least he's not at Rhino levels......yet
That doesn't wash, as Colossus took part in some of those himself in the old days. He killed Proteus and Riptide when he had to, after all. He boinked Nareel in the Savage Land and was later oblivous to the fact that she had his child.
But, we'll have to wait and see, I guess.
Ultimate Colossus has had a lot of good moments. I'd argue many of them stopped after Mark Millar left, and we had stuff like Falcon poking him in the eyes to beat him in ULTIMATE NIGHTMARE (oh, c'mon). But, considering that Ultimate is only 7 years old vs. the 30+ of 616, Ultimate Colossus has been seen as more of a tanker. They often call him "the strongest mutant" over there. That doesn't happen in 616.
No, Piotr isn't anywhere near Rhino levels. Spider-Man hasn't stunned him with a single kick yet.
616 Colossus definitely needs some added rep and that only comes from beating noteworthy opponents, or at least battling some to a draw. Thing's never beaten the Hulk, but he often gave him a workout, which is worthy of respect. I think he did beat Hulk once during the 80's when he was extra spikey and stronger (and Hulk was Grey and weaker), but I forget. But, the point is Colossus in 616 needs to become a bad-ass in some way, or at least not be seen as the Marvel Universe's most underachieving 85 ton tanker.
But above all...616 Colossus needs PANTS.
I couldn't agree more about the pants. Even his AOA costume with the booty shorts was better
And I refuse to acknowledge that eye poke submission
I like Colossus on the team, and I actually wouldn't be surprised if they just took a Marvel Handbook and threw darts.
That's usually how the best teams are created (Champions, New Warriors, most of the Defenders line-ups).
Well God bless the dart than landed on Petey's big metal face