The Loki Thread

[Octoberist]

Fringe is very good indeed, and I think everybody has to start somewhere.

It would be different if the writers worked on Cody Banks and then 10 other Disney projects, THEN Thor.

 

[irapogi]

For reference, here's a character analysis of Edmund from King Lear:

http://www.shmoop.com/character/literature/william-shakespeare/king-lear/edmund.html

The big thing to know about Edmund is that, as Shakespeare repeatedly says, he’s "a bastard." Not only was he born out of wedlock, but he also acts like a jerk from the beginning of the play to the end. He’s one of the first characters we meet, and his father Gloucester goes out of his way to let us know that Edmund is his illegitimate son. Here’s how he introduces his Edmund to a friend: “though this knave came something saucily into the world before he was called for, yet was his mother fair; there was good sport at his making, and the ****eson must be acknowledged.”

Pretty mean. Imagine yourself at a party and your dad says: “Oh, here’s my son, his mom was a ****e, but we had fun together, so here he is.” Would that make you mad? Would it make you want to get even? How about if it happened again and again? The play makes it pretty clear that this is a standard conversation for Edmund and his dad. So the first image in this play is a father smiling and abusing his son, and the son smiles right back, just soaking it up.

But this is Shakespeare, and let’s face it, Edmund’s a villain, and he’s proud of that fact. So of course he has a plan to even the score, to punish both his father and his legitimate brother Edgar. (If you get these two brothers mixed up, just remember the “G” in Edgar for “good” and the “M” in Edmund for “mean” or “malice” or maybe…“misunderstood.”)

There’s no doubt that Edmund has guts and drive, and that’s hard not to admire. As we see in the first scene, Shakespeare makes it clear that he got a bad deal from the start, and it’s hard to blame him for wanting to change his life.

His drive helps him to be incredibly successful – rising in a matter of days from an outcast child to his father’s favorite son, then taking over his father’s position as Earl of Gloucester, and at last coming within reach of ruling the entire kingdom. Edmund is so charming and so good at what he does, it’s sometimes hard not to root for him – even though he betrays his family members, seduces two sisters at the same time, and condemns innocent people to death.

Edmund’s actions are cruel, but it’s not hard to see where the impulse comes from. There’s a lot of evil in Edmund, but Shakespeare has gone out of his way to make that evil plausible, to give us a reason to sympathize with the villain. That sympathy makes it possible to imagine ourselves in his place, and it makes his choices and his eventual downfall all the more moving and disturbing.

And for all of Edmund's cruelty and manipulation, we can't forget that he attempts to save Lear and Cordelia. For the whole play, Edmund boasts about the evil that he does. It would make sense for him to go to the grave triumphant that he managed to have Lear and Cordelia killed even after he’d been defeated by his brother, Edgar. But this isn’t what happens. Instead, he makes an eleventh hour attempt to save them before they’re murdered by one of his soldiers. Edmund admits that this decision is totally out of character. "Some good I mean to do, despite of my own nature," he declares (5.3.241-242).

Edmund’s rescue attempt is only half successful; his confession comes too late to save Cordelia. But his motivation for this sudden change of heart is very unclear. Edmund might be unexpectedly moved by Edgar’s story of his father’s death (5.3.198-199). Alternatively, Edmund’s sudden generosity could be linked to his delight that, perhaps for the first time, someone loves him. Morbidly, this delight is over the deaths of Goneril and Regan, one of whom killed the other for his sake. Looking at their dead bodies, he boasts, "Yet Edmund was beloved" (5.3.247).

If you want to argue about it, you could say that Edmund attempts to save Lear and Cordelia because it is the kingly thing to do. Only a king has the ability to pardon those about to be executed. By attempting to pardon Lear and Cordelia, Edmund symbolically takes on the power of kingship. Edmund, originally just an illegitimate child and a social outcast, dies in command of the kind of power only held by those in the highest position.

...

And a quote:

EDMUND: Why bastard? wherefore base?
When my dimensions are as well compact,
My mind as generous, and my shape as true,
As honest madam's issue?

this makes me very much excited.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Kevin Feige on Loki:

But the only things that are official are Chris and Tom [Hiddleston] and Tom Hiddleston's another one who we were very impressed with. He's almost like a young Ian McKellen in terms of being a great, great actor who's very good looking. He did indeed do a screen test for Thor and blew us away with his acting. Ken had worked with him on a number of things and he's just got that great sense. He was good as Thor. We were like, “Well, he's a little skinny,” and in he two weeks he really bulked out. It was very impressive, but we were just like, “There's something a little off about him” - but in a great way, a very Loki way. I think our burden with Loki is that I want….I think that Magneto is the best super villain in our movies to date. I think he's one of the best super villains in comics. I think one of the best super villains in comics is Dr Doom. I don't necessarily think that you saw that in the movies, unfortunately, what makes Dr Doom a great super villain. So that leaves us [with] Loki. Justin Hammer, Ivan (Whiplash) who Mickey Rourke plays, Obadiah Stane; all of these of course are good. Tim Roth as Abomination I loved. But in terms of a super villain that can carry over multiple franchises and really still be your movie super villain that you love to hate, Loki is going to be our guy.

Sounds like Loki will be showing up for Avengers too. Encouraging words about Tom Hiddleston too.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, I'm looking forward to Hiddleston's performance.

Nice to see someone involved with the movies cop to the fact that Doom sort of sucked, too.

 

[Jake Cassidy]

A young Ian McKellen? Now that's a compliment.

 

[Lobo]

I'm glad it seems Loki will be the villain in Avengers, too.

 

[chamber-music]

I'm glad Kevin Feige said that stuff because it means he understood what worked for the other Marvel movie adaptations and what didn't especially in Dooms protrayal. I agree with him saying Magneto is the best super villain in our movies to date.

McKellen was one of the best things in the X-Men movies and one of the few actors you didn't have to worry about giving a bad performance.

Tim Roth and Jeff Bridges where good as well they where not over the top villains like other actors have been in comic book movies.