The Official Goku/Justin Chatwin Thread

[Man of Tomorrow]

Goku was definitely drawn to have an asian appearance in DBZ. The natural jet black hair color denotes that. It's the equivalent of Rei/Mars in Sailor Moon.

Asian or mixed is fine by me, but I still think it's silly having a white guy named Goku running around.

Justin Chatwin looking like a dork makes it worse.

 

[louiebling$]

to that i reply...

http://forums.superherohype.com/showpost.php?p=15765065&postcount=4

You have forgotten one thing.... its not only based on The "Journey to The West"... its an amalgam of JTTW and Supermans origins.... so with that being said.. He's still an alien and an alien has no true race as far as asians and Caucasians .... yes I always thought goku would be asian but then I thought more and no he's not he could be asian he could be white in the end he is a Saiyan which has no specific race. When it comes down to it... its a matter of opinion.

 

[SolarTiger]

To play Devil's advocate, there is no real argument you can make that Goku should be white...but there is a lot which say he can be Asian.

I relaly don't have a problem with his race just saying(saiyan?).

 

[BestGirl]

Casting would be so much simpler if more anime artists drew their characters to look stereotypically Asian instead of giving them pale skin and round eyes.

 

[mr. peasant]

To play Devil's advocate, there is no real argument you can make that Goku should be white...but there is a lot which say he can be Asian.

I disagree. I don't think there's any real argument to say that Goku either White or Asian. I mean, anyone saying the art style resembles a particular race (outside when being deliberately stereotypical) is hallucinating. I mean, who on Earth has triangular or bracket-shaped eyes connected directly beneath their eyebrows?!

 

[DorkyFresh]

I disagree. I don't think there's any real argument to say that Goku either White or Asian.

there are more reasons for Goku to be portayed by an Asian than there are for Goku to be portrayed by a Caucasian...just like there are more reasons for Superman to be portrayed by a Caucasian rather than an Asian.

 

[Man of Tomorrow]

People hated Dean Tanaka Cain for playing Superman because he's part asian (and a bad actor).

So I can understand why asian fans would be upset a white dude is playing 'Goku'

 

[huzzah]

I'm sure Chatwin will speak a few words of Chinese in the film as he brought up by gandpa Gohan.

 

[Ratcrawler]

People hated Dean Tanaka Cain for playing Superman because he's part asian (and a bad actor).

So I can understand why asian fans would be upset a white dude is playing 'Goku'

I have never EVER heard that. Regarding the part asian thing, not the bad actor thing. But really, if they did, they have more serious problems, I'm sure.

Interestingly enough, Chatwin has blue eyes. So I guess that won't be part of the whole Super Saiyen transformation in the sequel.

 

[louiebling$]

Super saiyans have green eyes

 

[Orb]

^Really? I believe it was blue eyes for Super Saiyan 1 and green eyes for super saiyan 2.

 

[louiebling$]

Nope... you tube gokus 1st tranformation and be amazed lol

 

[Alchemyst]

yep, supersaiyans have green eyes

 

[mr. peasant]

So I can understand why asian fans would be upset a white dude is playing 'Goku'

But the question nonetheless remains... do we have any proof that the majority of Asian fans are upset or angry with Goku being played by a Caucasian actor? Was there some kind of poll on it?

there are more reasons for Goku to be portayed by an Asian than there are for Goku to be portrayed by a Caucasian...just like there are more reasons for Superman to be portrayed by a Caucasian rather than an Asian.

Regarding there being more reasons for Goku to appear Asian, what are they? Is it because it was made by the Japanese for Japanese people? Then, what do you make of Gunslinger Girl? Is it because of his name? He didn't choose it and then there's the fact that people don't always have names that match their ethnicity (even if you could argue that the name 'Goku' is specifically Asian). So then, you could argue that he's based off the Monkey King. Except that the Sun Wukong was neither Asian nor looked like one. He looked like a humanoid monkey!

 

[Man of Tomorrow]

No poll but the overwhemling negativity about this issue and the film itself on pretty much ever major DB or Anime site (and even on superhero sites like this one) kinda drive home how the fanbase regards this.

I haven't seen such a negative reaction on the net to an unrelased film like this since Catwoman.


The worst part is they CAN do a proper live action DB film but they're handling this project all wrong; starting with the casting.

 

[huzzah]

But the question nonetheless remains... do we have any proof that the majority of Asian fans are upset or angry with Goku being played by a Caucasian actor? Was there some kind of poll on it?



Regarding there being more reasons for Goku to appear Asian, what are they? Is it because it was made by the Japanese for Japanese people? Then, what do you make of Gunslinger Girl? Is it because of his name? He didn't choose it and then there's the fact that people don't always have names that match their ethnicity (even if you could argue that the name 'Goku' is specifically Asian). So then, you could argue that he's based off the Monkey King. Except that the Sun Wukong was neither Asian nor looked like one. He looked like a humanoid monkey!

Seems like the writer of Gunslinger Girl stuck with Western names for their characters. Is it because of the Italian culture / setting?

And although Sun Wukong / Goku did not look homosapien the story is influenced by Asian religion / culture. There is no Western influence in it all.

The problem I have is in this adaptation is grandpa Gohan has given a Caucasian an Asian name when the obvious thing to do would to give him a Caucasian name. Now that Goku is in high school will ANY of his school colleagues ask where his name came from and thereby question true his origins? If this was the real world people would questions right from the get go!

 

[DorkyFresh]

Regarding there being more reasons for Goku to appear Asian, what are they? Is it because it was made by the Japanese for Japanese people? Then, what do you make of Gunslinger Girl? Is it because of his name? He didn't choose it and then there's the fact that people don't always have names that match their ethnicity (even if you could argue that the name 'Goku' is specifically Asian). So then, you could argue that he's based off the Monkey King. Except that the Sun Wukong was neither Asian nor looked like one. He looked like a humanoid monkey!

you're too focused on finding ONE reason. i said that (if we're going by race ALONE) then there are MORE reasons for Goku to be portrayed by an Asian than there are reasons for him to be portrayed by a Caucasian. that means that the sum of all the reasons for him to be played by an Asian outweighs the sum of all the reasons for him to be played by a Caucasian. i've listed many reasons why Goku should look like an Asian and you seem to know most of them. so my question for you is...what are the reasons for Goku to appear as a Caucasian?

 

[mr. peasant]

Seems like the writer of Gunslinger Girl stuck with Western names for their characters. Is it because of the Italian culture / setting?

Yes, but the point I'm trying to get across with Gunslinger Girl is that just because the series was made a Japanese for a Japanese audience, it doesn't mean that the characters of said show are Japanese as well. The fact that it is obviously set in Italy merely strengthens my point.

And although Sun Wukong / Goku did not look homosapien the story is influenced by Asian religion / culture. There is no Western influence in it all.

But Goku was not based purely on Sun Wukong. Sure, he got his name from the latter, but he's also based off Superman. Besides, if I'm not mistaken, Akira Toriyama once said he didn't have any specific race in mind with Goku.

The problem I have is in this adaptation is grandpa Gohan has given a Caucasian an Asian name when the obvious thing to do would to give him a Caucasian name. Now that Goku is in high school will ANY of his school colleagues ask where his name came from and thereby question true his origins? If this was the real world people would questions right from the get go!

But then, what about Angelina Jolie's adopted children? One has a Welsh name despite being Cambodian while another has an Arabic name despite being Ethiopian. Let's face it. In the real world, people have a vast variety of names, many of which aren't remotely related to their original ethnicity. They can have any name they darned well please.

you're too focused on finding ONE reason. i said that (if we're going by race ALONE) then there are MORE reasons for Goku to be portrayed by an Asian than there are reasons for him to be portrayed by a Caucasian. that means that the sum of all the reasons for him to be played by an Asian outweighs the sum of all the reasons for him to be played by a Caucasian. i've listed many reasons why Goku should look like an Asian and you seem to know most of them. so my question for you is...what are the reasons for Goku to appear as a Caucasian?

No, I don't think so. I'm simply pointing out those reasons are very arbitrary and don't hold water when put to the test. There are many examples that contradict the reasons in shows other than Dragon Ball. Hence, I don't think they're particularly good reasons. Likewise, I don't think there are any particularly strong reasons why Goku has to be Caucasian. What I'm saying is that Chatwin's race is (or at least should be) a non-issue as far as judging his suitability to play Goku.

 

[DorkyFresh]

No, I don't think so. I'm simply pointing out those reasons are very arbitrary and don't hold water when put to the test. There are many examples that contradict the reasons in shows other than Dragon Ball. Hence, I don't think they're particularly good reasons.

well just because you don't think they're good reasons doesn't mean they don't hold water.

What I'm saying is that Chatwin's race is (or at least should be) a non-issue as far as judging his suitability to play Goku.

i agree, however, the subject of race has been brought up again...which is why we're talking about that, instead of Chatwin's merits. if you would like to change the topic to that then feel free to do so.

 

[mr. peasant]

well just because you don't think they're good reasons doesn't mean they don't hold water.

You're getting my causality wrong. They don't hold water (i.e. there are examples when they're not true, even in mainstream media and so not hard and fast rules). That's why I don't think they're good reasons.

i agree, however, the subject of race has been brought up again...which is why we're talking about that, instead of Chatwin's merits. if you would like to change the topic to that then feel free to do so.

Fair enough. I think we should move on. The very fact that there are two fairly vocal groups, one certain Goku looks Asian while the other convinced that Goku looks White speaks volumes for the issue in and of itself.

 

[DorkyFresh]

You're getting my causality wrong. They don't hold water (i.e. there are examples when they're not true, even in mainstream media and so not hard and fast rules). That's why I don't think they're good reasons.

you don't think they're good reasons because they're not always true (not only Asians have black hair, adopted kids can have foreign sounding names, etc.) but that doesn't necessarily mean it doesn't mean that our arguments don't hold water. just because something isn't true ALL the time doesn't mean it's not true MOST of the time. to some people a statement like 'dogs pee on trees' is true while to others it's not...but either way you spin it, that statement holds water because it's somewhat true. the same goes for many of the arguments we've put forth...

...so just because you don't think they're good or valid reasons doesn't mean they don't hold water.

 

[louiebling$]

Seems like the writer of Gunslinger Girl stuck with Western names for their characters. Is it because of the Italian culture / setting?

And although Sun Wukong / Goku did not look homosapien the story is influenced by Asian religion / culture. There is no Western influence in it all.

The problem I have is in this adaptation is grandpa Gohan has given a Caucasian an Asian name when the obvious thing to do would to give him a Caucasian name. Now that Goku is in high school will ANY of his school colleagues ask where his name came from and thereby question true his origins? If this was the real world people would questions right from the get go!

Are u talking about JTTW or DB?

 

[huzzah]

Are u talking about JTTW or DB?

Journey To The West

 

[huzzah]

But Goku was not based purely on Sun Wukong. Sure, he got his name from the latter, but he's also based off Superman. Besides, if I'm not mistaken, Akira Toriyama once said he didn't have any specific race in mind with Goku.

But then, what about Angelina Jolie's adopted children? One has a Welsh name despite being Cambodian while another has an Arabic name despite being Ethiopian. Let's face it. In the real world, people have a vast variety of names, many of which aren't remotely related to their original ethnicity. They can have any name they darned well please.

But was the Superman influence from Dragonball or did it start in Dragonball Z?

With regards Angelina were they born with those names or did she rename them to fit in with Hollywood? My point regarding Granpda Gohan and this film is that it doesn't make sense to give him a name that's going to draw attention to Goku and people starting to ask questions about him and his origin. I wonder if Chi-chi will ask questions or perhaps the wont bother addressing it in the film.

 

[mr. peasant]

you don't think they're good reasons because they're not always true (not only Asians have black hair, adopted kids can have foreign sounding names, etc.) but that doesn't necessarily mean it doesn't mean that our arguments don't hold water. just because something isn't true ALL the time doesn't mean it's not true MOST of the time. to some people a statement like 'dogs pee on trees' is true while to others it's not...but either way you spin it, that statement holds water because it's somewhat true. the same goes for many of the arguments we've put forth...

...so just because you don't think they're good or valid reasons doesn't mean they don't hold water.

Fair enough. But the thing is, for some of those statements, I think they're only true some of the time. In that it's only about a 50-50 chance or so (as opposed to a 90-10 chance) of it being completely true.