The Official "I Loved Raimi's Spider-Man' Thread - Part 1 of 99 Luft - - Part 11

[Lantern Venom]

Avi,as much as some hate him,was one of the people really responsible for Marvel movies even coming to the big screen wasn't he?
Plus,and I've said this before,I never thought he forced Venom on Sam at all. Sam could've said no. Some people make it sound like Arad told Sam,"You include Venom or I'll take your family hostage!" I don't think that was the case at all,but that's just my opinion.

I've read interviews that say differently. It was just a bad situation all around, and while I think he's overstating the negatives of the final product, I'll give Raimi credit for owning up to his laziness:

It's a movie that just didn't work very well. I tried to make it work, but I didn't really believe in all the characters, and so that can't be hidden from people who loved 'Spider-Man

One character Raimi didn't believe in was Venom, played by Topher Grace and included at the behest of a producer. When the script became too unwieldy, he considered splitting it into two movies, but abandoned the idea when no one could decide where to end the first half.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/12/31/sam-raimi-spider-man-3_n_6400254.html

There were too many cooks with too many outdated recipes. We're all lucky that SM3 wasn't an abomination of Batman & Robin proportions.

 

[Bruce Malone]

There were too many cooks with too many outdated recipes. We're all lucky that SM3 wasn't an abomination of Batman & Robin proportions.

It wasn't that bad certainly, but man some of the cheese that was in it...

Now dig on this...

 

[Lantern Venom]

It wasn't that bad certainly, but man some of the cheese that was in it...

Now dig on this...

LOL--I don't mind a bit of cheese to accentuate other things, but one dancing scene on top of another is cheddar overload.

 

[Nardz937]

Sam quit when he found out that they were developing ASM behind his back while he was already working on Spider-Man 4. And they probably gave him an unrealistic release date to work with too force him out.

Speaking of which, I remember listening to a podcast or radio show a long time ago, it was probably 2009, and Sam was on it. At one point during the interview he said that he was at the studio working on Spider-Man 4 at the same time he was doing the podcast/radio show. Anybody know what I'm talking about, or have a link to where I can listen to it again? Thanks!

 

[Spidey_62]

Sam quit when he found out that they were developing ASM behind his back while he was already working on Spider-Man 4. And they probably gave him an unrealistic release date to work with too force him out.

Speaking of which, I remember listening to a podcast or radio show a long time ago, it was probably 2009, and Sam was on it. At one point during the interview he said that he was at the studio working on Spider-Man 4 at the same time he was doing the podcast/radio show. Anybody know what I'm talking about, or have a link to where I can listen to it again? Thanks!

I don't know of any links talking about that but I know what you mean, there were articles saying that very thing. Sony did have Vanderbilt writing a script for a backdoor reboot in the case that Raimi walked.

He had written a SM4 script and I recall we knew about that, but not that he was also working on a reboot script until it was announced. Which, Raimi makes it sound like Sony were pretty adamant on getting SM4 out on the May 2011 date or nothing else. It seems like there was no room to work for Sam because part of what he said when leaving was that he didn't want to make something for that date that wasn't good. So then Sony moved forward with their reboot without him.

It's still confusing in retrospect, why not give him the time to make the film work and maybe if you have to- push it back to 2012? That's when the reboot came out anyway. Really, they shot themselves in the foot every step of the way since 2005 or 6.

 

[Lantern Venom]

He had written a SM4 script and I recall we knew about that, but not that he was also working on a reboot script until it was announced. Which, Raimi makes it sound like Sony were pretty adamant on getting SM4 out on the May 2011 date or nothing else. It seems like there was no room to work for Sam because part of what he said when leaving was that he didn't want to make something for that date that wasn't good. So then Sony moved forward with their reboot without him.
.

I remembered reading in numerous places that Sony wanted Raimi and Co to shoot Spider-man 4 and 5 together.

I’m also told that, right now, the studio is trying to figure out if it can feasibly shoot Spider-Man 4 and 5 at the same time because doing that is so cost effective and “it wasn’t so easy to get everybody back together.”

http://deadline.com/2008/09/exclusi...i-studio-may-shoot-4-and-5-at-same-time-6868/

Not only were there creative disputes, but it seems like there was a lot of conflict over various contracts. The cracks in the foundation were starting to show by this point.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

Wasn't Tobey really opposed to shooting Spidey 4 and 5 back to back? I don't think he or Kirsten were all that bothered anyway.

 

[Venom75]

I always got the vibe,especially from Kirsten,that she was sick of doing the movies. Of course,you could see that by part 2 she wasn't all that thrilled with being in them. I think she was tired of the stuntwork and of always having to get captured and scream all the time. I think that for her,and this is just my opinion,that she was glad the series ended.
Now,I know James Franco wanted to be in more. I remember an interview he did where he said he loved being in the series.
With Tobey,I'm not quite sure. I'm positive he disliked the exercise that he had to do to get in shape for the role but he never really seemed to ever hate being Spider-man.
Although,again just my opinion,but I think all of them would jump at the chance to do the series again. That includes Sam Raimi.

 

[Bruce Malone]

I thought Kirsten by part 3 was definitely a weak spot for the franchise. I ideally would have liked to have seen her not come back back for a part 4 at the time.

I think part 4 would have been a good time to bring in Felicia Hardy.

I think even Toby seemed a bit out of it by part 3, he really seemed to put no effort into his physique as evident by the double chin. I think a part 4 coming 4 years after the 3rd one could have seen a more revitalized Maguire.

 

[Venom75]

I thought Kirsten by part 3 was definitely a weak spot for the franchise. I ideally would have liked to have seen her not come back back for a part 4 at the time.

I think part 4 would have been a good time to bring in Felicia Hardy.

I love Kirsten,but I could go with that. Instead of Venom killing Harry he should've killed MJ. Give the romance a break for a film but introduce Felicia or maybe develop Gwen a bit more.

 

[Leenie]

I don't know if Kirsten disliked being in these movies, exactly. I remember reading a ton of stuff about her in 2006-2008 that revealed she was going through mental health issues (depression, mostly) during that time.

If you're depressed, you can easily lose interest in a lot of things. And it was after Spider-Man 3 that she kind of disappeared from mainstream Hollywood (everybody knows how this business can break a person). She seems happier now doing smaller movies once in a while and spending more time with her family though, so good for her.

Also, I remember her saying stuff like if Sony recasts or reboots the Spidey movies, then they are going to doom themselves for failure (and I remember her catching SO much flak for that). That doesn't sound like someone who hated being a part of those movies, in my opinion.

EDIT: I also remember her doing an interview not too long ago that talked about her experience with the Spider-Man movies and how she's recognized for them. She didn't seem bitter at all. She talked about the movies fondly.

 

[Venom75]

I don't know if Kirsten disliked being in these movies, exactly. I remember reading in ton of stuff about her in 2006-2008 that revealed she was going through mental health issues (depression, mostly) during that time.

If you're depressed, you can easily lose interest in a lot of things. And it was after Spider-Man 3 that she kind of disappeared from mainstream Hollywood (everybody knows how this business can break a person). She seems happier now doing smaller movies once in a while and spending more time with her family though, so good for her.

Also, I remember her saying stuff like if Sony recasts or reboots the Spidey movies, then they are going to doom themselves for failure (and I remember her catching SO much flak for that). That doesn't sound like someone who hated being a part of those movies, in my opinion.

EDIT: I also remember her doing an interview not too long ago that talked about her experience with the Spider-Man movies and how she's recognized for them. She didn't seem bitter at all. She talked about the movies fondly.

You do make a lot of good points and I do recall a lot of what you said,how she defended the series. I myself have been suffering through severe depression and have lost a lot of love for interests and even living life. So I know how that can be.
But I also remember(although I can't quote her exactly)that during Spidey 2 and 3 I think Kirsten did say some negative things about the films. She kinda acted like she was tired of doing them. It might have been the depression but I'm not sure. I know she kinda pissed off a lot of fans with either what she said or by her attitiude.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

I remember a UK interview they did with Jonathan Ross back in 2007, where he asked her how she could possibly travel the world promoting movies she didn't care for. Her answer?... ''You fake it!''.

When he pressed her on the particular film, she just laughed. (It's probably on youtube somewhere)

EDIT: Here it is... @5:30

[YT]YvCU4M7A3g0[/YT]

I think she was over ALOT of things around that time, due to her mental issues, but thankfully she is in a better place now and seems to look back on her Spider-Man days with fondness.

In fact, both Maguire and Dunst seemed exhausted in Spider-Man 3, despite the three year gap.

 

[henzINNIT]

I agree there's a palpable sense of exhaustion to Tobey and Kirsten in SM3. I bet the shoot was difficult. There were a lot of script issues that were being ironed out very late in the game, I expect the actors didn't really know what was going on.

Dunst was probably particularly tired of repetitious hostage sequences. She didn't record any ADR for the SM3 one. All the screams were taken from the last film.

 

[Daltonio]

I never had a problem with Dunst in the role, just in the writing of MJ.

 

[Nardz937]

Tobey's demands were getting crazy after 3. He wanted $50 million for 4 & 5 together and for his family to also join him while he's shooting.

There were a lot of influences for the reboot. This was likely one of them.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Source of that info?
He did not seem bitter about the reboot, the way you described him one would think he'd end up livid with anger about the reboot and losing the potential cash.

 

[Nardz937]

Source of that info?
He did not seem bitter about the reboot, the way you described him one would think he'd end up livid with anger about the reboot and losing the potential cash.

http://screenrant.com/tobey-maguire-50-million-spider-man-filmnerdjamie-3713/

 

[Bruce Malone]

Tobey's demands were getting crazy after 3. He wanted $50 million for 4 & 5 together and for his family to also join him while he's shooting.

There were a lot of influences for the reboot. This was likely one of them.

It'd be naive to not believe that was a factor.

I think Garfield was paid chump change in comparison to what Tobey was making.

It should be noted that that $50 million demand came around the time part 3 had just been released and was actually doing some amazing numbers.

I'm pretty sure by the time it was decided to just move forward with a part 4 only, his demand probably went down.

 

[Doctor Octopus]

In fact, both Maguire and Dunst seemed exhausted in Spider-Man 3, despite the three year gap.

Agreed. But I think that is not exhaustion but not as much enthusiasm for 3 because it not as good as 2.

 

[Johnny-Oh]

Well comparing the box office numbers of Raimi's trilogy to Webb's films, its understandable Tobey got paid so much more, the GA fell in love with him after the first film.

 

[Leenie]

I rewatched Spider-Man 2 yesterday.

Yeah, it is still my #1 favorite comic book movie, after all of these years. I'm excited and hopeful for what the MCU has in store for Spidey, but I really don't think Marvel will be able to top Spider-Man 2 (which is fine; that doesn't mean I think the new movies will be bad). I just think that Spider-Man 2 is that good.

Spider-Man 2 is everything I wanted in a Spider-Man movie. This movie feels like a love letter sealed in gold to Spider-Man fans like myself. The movie really does feel like a labor of love. I think it's the most fun and heartwarming comic book movie to date. I mean, damn, I feel the emotional weight of this movie every time I watch the Uncle Ben "Take my hand, son" and the Aunt May "I believe there's a hero in all of us" scenes. And along with the emotional stuff, we get all of the fun and cool stuff we love about superheroes and comic books ... That train sequence has yet to be topped by another comic book movie, as far as I'm concerned.

 

[The Joker]

^ Hear hear. 11 years later and it's still awesome. Until TDK it was my favorite CBM, now it sits at a comfortable 2nd favorite after TDK for me.

 

[DX]

^ Hear hear. 11 years later and it's still awesome. Until TDK it was my favorite CBM, now it sits at a comfortable 2nd favorite after TDK for me.

Saaaaaaaaame.

 

[Bruce Malone]

S2 has aged surprisingly well.

It and X2 are probably the only comic book films from that era 2000-2004 which don't feel absolutely dated.