The Official Pirates of The Caribbean: World's End Thread!

[Cmill216]

When the majority of your story involves the gathering of the Pirate Lords, and said Pirate Lords end up serving no purpose in the film's climactic moments, I'd say there's something really wrong with your story.

 

[Erzengel]

My biggest gripe of AWE. Okay cool, an army of Pirates. Alright, they are just going to sit this one out?

Outside of their "presence" during the final battle, they are essentially a plot device to release Calypso. They serve no other purpose other to kill some screen time.

 

[L0ngsh0t]

Yet, you dislike the Wil/Elizabeth storyline which essentially like one of the main storylines.

And personally, the best 2 Spider-Man or X-Men movies tell a better story than Pirates.

The X-men movies are garbage

all three of them, piss poor adaptations of the best series of comic books ever, the story presented may have been a good one for some indie movie about kids that don't fit in, but it was about 1/100000 what an x-men movie should be, terrible use of great characters


its not that I don't like the Will/Liz storyline its that I think it doesn't have to be there, I think since it is there it is a good storyline, but more or less just to keep those two in the movies

I like the Spiderman movies a lot, though the story in all three of them (with a semi exception to 2) is like a 200 million dollar Power Rangers episode where there is a conflict in Peters life that reflects the external conflict and he resolves both conflicts the same way, its all very basic, it works great but its nothing special. Not that Pirates is, but I liked the cross movie almost hyper link style they had, I loved their use of foreshadowing in DMC, while silly quite effective.

And the Pirate Lords? Yeah they didn't do a whole lot in the final fight, but if they where just a plot device to get Calypso then its not like they did nothing ether. Calypso could be viewed as the reason they won, if the storm hadn't come the E.I.T.C. probably wouldn't have only sent one ship into fight

 

[LostSon88]

And the Pirate Lords? Yeah they didn't do a whole lot in the final fight, but if they where just a plot device to get Calypso then its not like they did nothing ether. Calypso could be viewed as the reason they won, if the storm hadn't come the E.I.T.C. probably wouldn't have only sent one ship into fight

Didn't do a whole lot? They did absolutely nothing!!! Lol.

It still bothers me how we get that speech from Elizabeth to fire up the Pirate Lords, all of them hoisting they're flags as if they were ready to go to war...I was so psyched in the theater thinking we were going to get this EPIC battle among the pirates and the Royal Fleet.

What do I get?

A kinda cool final battle between the Dutchman and the Pearl with dozens of Pirates and soldiers probably munching on popcorn, looking on.

Nice.

 

[DACrowe]

Calypso did NOTHING. She would wreck havoc on all men and most especially Davy Jones. What does she do? Oh no a little rain that HURTS NOBODY. She has nothing to do with Jones' defeat. She IS THE plot device for SFX, that they could have had anyway but they wanted as soon as it was over for it to be sun shiny and slow mo Jerry Bruckhemier BS.

Sorry, I just really hated that ending.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Calypso did NOTHING. She would wreck havoc on all men and most especially Davy Jones. What does she do? Oh no a little rain that HURTS NOBODY. She has nothing to do with Jones' defeat. She IS THE plot device for SFX, that they could have had anyway but they wanted as soon as it was over for it to be sun shiny and slow mo Jerry Bruckhemier BS.

Sorry, I just really hated that ending.

One of the many things that was stupid about this terrible movie.

 

[Cmill216]

The stories in the Spider-Man films (1 or 2, at the least) weren't structurally complex, but they were still rock solid stories that developed the characters well enough and gave reason to everything that happened.

Meanwhile in the Caribbean.....a good majority of the things that happen in the Pirates films are completely irrelevant to how the story finally comes together. Fans can twist it however they want to mask the flaws, but the storytelling in the sequels was severely below average, and the "scope" of the film gives off the allusion that you're watching this great epic story.

 

[PaulGilbert]

The stories in the Spider-Man films (1 or 2, at the least) weren't structurally complex, but they were still rock solid stories that developed the characters well enough and gave reason to everything that happened.

Meanwhile in the Caribbean.....a good majority of the things that happen in the Pirates films are completely irrelevant to how the story finally comes together. Fans can twist it however they want to mask the flaws, but the storytelling in the sequels was severely below average, and the "scope" of the film gives off the allusion that you're watching this great epic story.

If you didnt understand the stories just say so t:.

The Pirates films were much more complex in terms of numerous levels to the story than Spiderman was. Spidey fanboys and those that didnt understand the movies are far too quick to call bad storytelling. Spiderman basically spoon fed you everything...whilst Pirates didnt , some people dont like having to think during a film. You'd have to look far to find a worse example of writing than Spiderman 3...

 

[Eelectro 2]

that's not fair to say. spider-man are deep movies on their own. i loved all 3 spidey and pirate movies, loved them all. no complaints for any really.

 

[Episode29]

If you didnt understand the stories just say so t:.

The Pirates films were much more complex in terms of various levels to the story than Spiderman was. Spidey fanboys and those that didnt understand the movies are far too quick to call bad storytelling. Spiderman basically spoon fed you everything...whilst Pirates didnt

If, by spoonfed, you mean that it told comprehensive stories that could be enjoyed without endless pointless plot developments and a Down's Syndrome ending, then yes Spider-Man was lame.

Face it, Pirates 1=Really good movie
Pirates 2 & 3=Over-indulgent, nonsensical, *********ory writing.

I will submit on Spidey 3, though. It had plenty of problems too.

 

[PaulGilbert]

I will submit on Spidey 3, though. It had plenty of problems too.

It was one long problem

 

[Cmill216]

If you didnt understand the stories just say so t:.

Hey, hey, hey! Never question my intelligence!

The Pirates films were much more complex in terms of numerous levels to the story than Spiderman was.

Explain to me how the film was "complex". And by complex, I don't mean having plenty of meaningless 'twists' and 'turns' and changes of alliance that amount to nothing more than fluff drama meant to make you think the story is a lot deeper than it actually is.

some people dont like having to think during a film.

No. People don't like to be completely confused by the barrage of magical plot twists that DMC and AWE threw at them. Please, please, please don't tell me you think the Pirates movies are "thinking man's films". I might have to cry on my Keira Knightley poster if you do.

 

[Erzengel]

If you didnt understand the stories just say so t:.

The Pirates films were much more complex in terms of numerous levels to the story than Spiderman was. Spidey fanboys and those that didnt understand the movies are far too quick to call bad storytelling. Spiderman basically spoon fed you everything...whilst Pirates didnt , some people dont like having to think during a film. You'd have to look far to find a worse example of writing than Spiderman 3...

I wasn't confused by the storyline, I just thought it was lazy and rushed story telling.

Norrington and the Kraken, key parts in DMC, reduced to a quick sentence and a few scenes to "resolve" their storylines.

The needless love triangle introduced in DMC, only to be quickly resolved in like 2 scenes in AWE.

Calypso and Davy Jones story? Where did that go?

And you can't call Pirates "complex" if you later say you don't really have to think during the film, which kinda contradicts that.

 

[PaulGilbert]

And you can't call Pirates "complex" if you later say you don't really have to think during the film, which kinda contradicts that.

I didnt say 'you dont really have to think during the film.' I said the exact opposite actually.

 

[Erzengel]

My mistake then, however, these blockbusters aren't suppose to be King Lear.

I'm curious how Pirates is more "complex" on so many levels more than Spider-Man.

Please, explain?

Edit: I notice CMill, asked the same question too.

 

[PaulGilbert]

My mistake then, however, these blockbusters aren't suppose to be King Lear.

I'm curious how Pirates is more "complex" on so many levels more than Spider-Man.

Please, explain?

Edit: I notice CMill, asked the same question too.

Its not 'thinking man's film' by far but when considering summer blockbusters Pirates has alot more depth and fits that role better than Spiderman.

Really Pirates simply has a large number of narratvies, charecter arcs and plot points running throughout, some inter-twined some not, which give a depth to the saga as a whole. There are plot points in Pirates that are not initially apparent to the audience and that may require some thinking to actually understand. Spiderman however is very straightforward, simplistic even and gives the audience everything in it's entirity. I also think Pirates puts to better use symbolism motifs etc throughout...all adding to the scope of the movies.

 

[Erzengel]

Examples please.

 

[PaulGilbert]

Examples please.

You can find those yourself, I'm not here to prove a point, I'm here to give my opinion.

 

[Erzengel]

So one doesn't need to back up his opinions? I mean you listed "generic" words like narratives, character arcs and plot points but you don't really back up your case unless you list specific examples.

 

[PaulGilbert]

So one doesn't need to back up his opinions? I mean you listed "generic" words like narratives, character arcs and plot points but you don't really back up your case unless you list specific examples.

I'm really too lazy to get examples for you - if you want proof go seek it out. This aint highschool...I'm not your teacher.

And no opinions dont need to be backed up.

 

[Erzengel]

I'm really too lazy to get examples for you - if you want proof go seek it out.

I'm suppose to rewatch these movies, to gain "your" perspective on how you viewed Pirates?

Not trying to call you out here, but saying "you do it" and "I'm too lazy" usually is a sign that you can't back up your opinion.

 

[PaulGilbert]

I'm suppose to rewatch these movies, to gain "your" perspective on how you viewed Pirates?

Not trying to call you out here, but saying "you do it" and "I'm too lazy" usually is a sign that you can't back up your opinion.

Yes you are supposed to rewatch them if you want to know what you asked, cant expect others to do the work for you.

Really, it has nothing to do with not being able to back up my opinion. It has everything to do with the fact that I have NO reason to go out of my way to find examples for some random guy on the net, just to get him to validate my opinion. If you're really that interested go look it up , then you will see what I mean.

 

[Erzengel]

Um, how old are you?

I've watched all these movies, I do not need to rewatch them again to gain a new persepective. That's why I was asking you to point out what you saw, so we can debate and discuss which is why we are on a messageboard btw.

The large number of narratives you state, imo are too much, because it leads to lazy storytelling and hurried finishes such as Norrington and the Kraken, 2 huge parts of DMC that become quick finishes in AWE.

Your character arcs? You mean like Calypso and Davy Jones in AWE? They tried to add a little depth to their story and it pretty much goes nowhere. Or the needless love triangle between Jack, Liz and Wil?

The plot points? Such as the Pirate Lords, who's only function is to release Calypso? They might as well of had Balbossa run around her 3 times and say that's how you release her, it would cut some time from the movie.

And the depth in this movie? C'mon. This is Bruckheimer, not necessarily known for his deep storytelling. That's like saying Michael Bay makes deep movies. No, Armageddon, Independence Day, Transformers, Pirates they make fun popcorn movies that you aren't suppose to think when you are watching it.

 

[Cmill216]

And no opinions dont need to be backed up.

And like Erz said, you seem to be merely throwing out a couple generic literary devices out there that you believe Pirates has, but you can't even take the time to actually tell us where these devices are in the films. Is it laziness, or is it because you actually can't and are just trying to defend the film on some level?

I'm not criticizing you here, Gilbert. But I am challenging you to give me something more than just, "Go look for yourself." That's really weak, homie.

 

[PaulGilbert]

Is it laziness,

I said above I was too lazy to try and 'prove' my opinions. Still am....

I'm not criticizing you here, Gilbert. But I am challenging you to give me something more than just, "Go look for yourself." That's really weak, homie.

I would if I wasnt too lazy, lol. Really it isnt my job to prove anything and I feel no desire or need to. I just came to give my opinion, debates bore me. I stand by what I said about Pirates...