The Dark Knight The Official Plot holes thread.

[Nivek]

How did Joker get bombs ALL OVER the hospital? How did he get them NATIONAL GUARD FERRIES?

He had people working on the inside.

 

[brightgreenpupi]

- During his first meeting with Harvey, Gordon says something to the effect of, "If I only worked with cops you haven't investigated, I would be working alone."

That makes sense. Thanks

 

[CRABBAH HUK!]

I don't think that any of the points you guys are bringing up are "plotholes" they are just pointless details that have nothing to do with the plot of the movie

Then leave.

 

[brightgreenpupi]

In terms of theme, character, and spectacle, this movie is absolutely perfect

But the lack of explanation for what happens at the party after Batman saves Rachel, just annoys the heck out of me

 

[coleyhinson]

First let me say this is not a Dark Knight bashing thread. But I didn't notice anyone talking about the plot wholes that I keep thinking about. These were evident but it still didn't stop the movie from being good as hell

1. Batman showing up in places of danger he should know nothing about.

The first time this happened was when Harvey kidnapped jokers thug after the attempted assasination of the mayor. Harvey takes him to an abandoned wharehouse to interogate while batman interogates Maroni by throwing him off the roof. Then suddenly Batman shows up to stop harvey's interogation. How the hell did he know where harvey was because he sure didn't tell anyone even rachel.

It happens again at the end of the film one minute batman has joker hanging upside down, then he shows up at the ware house were Rachel was killed, not even knowing Gordon was there or that Two face would be there. (Granted he may have just been checking the place of Rachels death or he may have used the sonar if so they didn't make it clear)

2. Did batman really have to take the fall for harvey? Really they could have just blamed the joker for harvs killings. After I thought about it because it made the movie cooler because I realized that this is the first superhero movie where the villan actually won. The joker corrupted harvey, and made the public believe batman broke his one rule, essentially corrupting batman too. He won so bad that the good guys had to essentially lie and pretend it didn't happen.

there is actually more but I'm tired of typing

Batman knew where Dent was because of the Sonar...he must have heard Dent on the phone with Dawes

 

[LostGuy]

I don't think that any of the points you guys are bringing up are "plotholes" they are just pointless details that have nothing to do with the plot of the movie

Oh, that's something I agree with. The movie plot was very solid. Just some details seem to have been forgotten.

 

[Hole Shot]

But the lack of explanation for what happens at the party after Batman saves Rachel, just annoys the heck out of me

I'll tell you exactly what happened. Joker was looking for Harvey, couldn't find him, Batman showed up so Joker drew Bats' attention of himself by tossing a woman out the window and bolted. High rises have many elevators and doors on the ground level, loading and delivery areas in the back alley, plus underground parking which the elevators would go directly to. It doesn't really take a stretch of the imagination to figure how he left the party.

I can't figure out why some people are taking such issue with this.

 

[Infinity9999x]

I don't know if this has been mentioned yet but, how the Joker knew that the guy would take off his handcuffs after egging him on, so he could take the shard of glass and get his phone call.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the Joker threated that guy with a shiv he had hidden somewhere. It seemed like that thing had a handle to it. I could have just missed that though.

And Joker's handcuff's were taken off by Gordon before he let Bats beat the beejesus out of him.

the joker seemed pretty specific in his threats and he didnt call out gordon. gordon appearing "dead" in no way advanced their chances of catching the joker.

It didn't advance their chances that much strategically, but it did protect Gordon's family. No, Joker hadn't called out a hit on him yet, but if I'm Gordon I'd be betting it's only a matter of time.

Faking his death allowed Gordon to carry on his job without worrying about the Joker targeting him or his family. It was a smart thing to do, and something I would have done in his situation. Saying he shouldn't have faked his death because Joker hadn't targeted him yet is a bit naive. It's like saying "no, I don't need to wear a bullet proof vest in a shootout. Sure, other people have died because they didn't wear one, but I haven't yet so I should be okay."

Gordon knew it was only a matter of time before the Joker came after him. It was a bit overly dramatic, but if Gordon had chosen to try and send his family out of town somewhere, there's still a good chance the Joker would have gone after, and found them. Removing himself as a target removed any reason for the Joker taking any interest in his family.

 

[Doc Holliday]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the Joker threated that guy with a shiv he had hidden somewhere. It seemed like that thing had a handle to it. I could have just missed that though.

It was a piece of glass from when Bats smashed his head into that two-way mirror. They can be seen on the sill thing behind Joker's head in the shot where he is smacking just before the cop starts to attack him.

 

[Sonic1002]

Since I'm too lazy to look through this all to see if it's brought up:

Gordon: Who are going after?
Batman: RACHEL!
*shows up at Harvey's location*

Did they just decide 'f*** this, we're going to the other person" or did Joker lie about each other's location... OR WHAT?!

 

[Doc Holliday]

Since I'm too lazy to look through this all to see if it's brought up:

Gordon: Who are going after?
Batman: RACHEL!
*shows up at Harvey's location*

Did they just decide 'f*** this, we're going to the other person" or did Joker lie about each other's location... OR WHAT?!

He lied because he knew Bats would go for Rachel.

 

[emadz89]

Since I'm too lazy to look through this all to see if it's brought up:

Gordon: Who are going after?
Batman: RACHEL!
*shows up at Harvey's location*

Did they just decide 'f*** this, we're going to the other person" or did Joker lie about each other's location... OR WHAT?!

the fact that the joker tricked batman was pretty obvious

 

[Hole Shot]

He lied because he knew Bats would go for Rachel.

No. Assuming this means that the Joker knows Bats is Bruce Wayne. Everyone is basing the idea of him knowing Rachel is his weakness is the party scene, Bats would have jumped after anybody had they been tossed over.

Joker either assumed Bats would go after Harvey only to his surprise find Rachel and kill the D.A. Which backfired. Or he strategically placed Harvey so whether Gordan or Bats goes for him he'd be saved and get to hear to Rachel die.

Regardless, the switch was all about Harvey not Batman.

 

[Infinity9999x]

No. Assuming this means that the Joker knows Bats is Bruce Wayne. Everyone is basing the idea of him knowing Rachel is his weakness is the party scene, Bats would have jumped after anybody had they been tossed over.

Joker either assumed Bats would go after Harvey only to his surprise find Rachel and kill the D.A. Which backfired. Or he strategically placed Harvey so whether Gordan or Bats goes for him he'd be saved and get to hear to Rachel die.

Regardless, the switch was all about Harvey not Batman.

That's not completely true. In the interrogation, Joker says something to the effect "I've seen how you look at her" he obviously knew, or was making a guess, that Batman had feelings for Rachel. How he figured this out I'm not sure. Maybe as he was escaping he saw how long Batman talked to her while lying on that car.

But I do believe that Joker wanted Harvey to live the whole time. He wanted Rachel to be the one who died, so he could later try and turn Harvey into a villain.

 

[thePan]

He just wanted Batman to choose the person he wants to save, so that person dies.

 

[Tex]

where did bruce go during the party scene into the "panic room"? and then bam hes in the bat suit. i thought the the makeshift batcave was off in some abandoned area under a big container?

 

[samsnee]

Batman knew where Dent was because of the Sonar...he must have heard Dent on the phone with Dawes

But Batman didn't know Joker had turned Dent. When Joker was talking about having an ace up his sleeve in Harvey Dent, Batman was completely surprised about it.

 

[AJGoodfella7]

Refering to the Joker dissappearing from the party: It has been stated that there is a deleted scene that shows the joker in a getaway car leaving the party... also this was shown (whysoserious.com) in a picture of the Joker in the backseat with masked thug from the party driving. I'm sure the rumored half hour of deleted scenes filled in alot of the blanks that happened, but scenes had to be cut i'm sure to get this at a reasonable running time. It seems to me that the less important details as to how Batman can get to places so quick were left out because they are not neccessary to progress the story. I mean he's Batman for God's sake... I'm sure Nolan realizes that not showing every detail of how he does everything gives him more of a mythical quality.

As far as Batman finding where Harvey and Gordon's family are at the end... Nolan shows the police show up before Batman shows up so he obviously could have followed them or have been listening to police broadcasts.

I mean honestly if people want to nitpick a Batman movie it should have nothing to do with his sneaking skills or dissappearing acts... I would have been upset this didn't happen at least once in the movie.

 

[Hole Shot]

I'm sure the rumored half hour of deleted scenes filled in alot of the blanks that happened, but scenes had to be cut i'm sure to get this at a reasonable running time.

Agreed. I've seen deleted scenes from Pulp Fiction to Singing in the Rain where you don't realize until after seeing those scenes that parts in the final cut didn't make sense without them but you never noticed they didn't make sense until having seen the deleted clip.

That's not completely true. In the interrogation, Joker says something to the effect "I've seen how you look at her" he obviously knew, or was making a guess, that Batman had feelings for Rachel. How he figured this out I'm not sure. Maybe as he was escaping he saw how long Batman talked to her while lying on that car.

But I do believe that Joker wanted Harvey to live the whole time. He wanted Rachel to be the one who died, so he could later try and turn Harvey into a villain.

I don't remember the line from the interrogation room, if it's true then there is validity that it was an attack on Batman. I guess you can he was trying screw with the head of both of Gotham's heroes with one stroke.

 

[co2]

I think so much of this movie, but I will say the one thing that continues to bug me..and it is such a funny issue..is when Scarecrow is escaping in the van and Batman drops from the elevated parking level onto the van...it immediately stops. The van must have been going 15-20mph, so why would it automatically come to a dead stop? Even if Scarecrow for some reason stomped on the brake, it's not going to come to a dead stop. If anything it will throw Batman off the top of the van.

 

[Raskolnikov]

That's not completely true. In the interrogation, Joker says something to the effect "I've seen how you look at her" he obviously knew, or was making a guess, that Batman had feelings for Rachel.

More specifically, he said something like "The way you jumped after her I almost believed you were Harvey Dent." He doesn't care who Batman is; but he was observant enough to notice that Batman - whoever he is - obviously felt a certain way about her. thePan's answer was even better than mine, though:

He just wanted Batman to choose the person he wants to save, so that person dies.

 

[DonnyLebeau]

Why would the JOKER be left ALONE in the Interrogation room of a prison WITHOUT handcuffs and items such as glass(from the mirror) and a metal chair to use for weapons??

Why wouldn't he be immediately locked up into a maximum security cell or even back into the cell he was in earlier???

Why would some old, fat cop be allowed to "watch" Mr. J when he clearly laughed off a beating from Batman himself?

 

[[A]]

Why would the JOKER be left ALONE in the Interrogation room of a prison WITHOUT handcuffs and items such as glass(from the mirror) and a metal chair to use for weapons??

Why wouldn't he be immediately locked up into a maximum security cell or even back into the cell he was in earlier???

Why would some old, fat cop be allowed to "watch" Mr. J when he clearly laughed off a beating from Batman himself?

Why, why, why.. Too many why's keep you from enjoying anything!

 

[Hole Shot]

Why would the JOKER be left ALONE in the Interrogation room of a prison WITHOUT handcuffs and items such as glass(from the mirror) and a metal chair to use for weapons??

Why wouldn't he be immediately locked up into a maximum security cell or even back into the cell he was in earlier???

Why would some old, fat cop be allowed to "watch" Mr. J when he clearly laughed off a beating from Batman himself?

Because people thought he'd have enough sense to shoot the guy in the head if things got out of hand not to antagonize him a try to fight him.

 

[christpunchers]

Only if they're not officially plot holes and people just missed things (like the cane...).

With the rate that I'm answering these questions, I think the threads should be merged.

The only "plot hole" I can think of is how Gordon got away with faking his death, but I've come to the conclusion that he worked with Batman on it, and they concocted something up DKR-style.

I dont think Bats and Gordon were both in on it, otherwise you wouldnt have Batman shutting down the hideout and talking about quitting.