TMOS Review & Speculation Thread (Spoilers) - Part 3

[Autonet]

What was hilarious to me was the numerous unnamed Kryptonisns that came in drop ships to evacuate people. Where were they before that? Is that all they do?

 

[silentrascal]

Ok....caught Man of Steel last night at its opening midnight showing, and I'm operating on 3 whole hours of sleep right now, but I wanted to offer my own $.02 on what I thought.

All in all....MOS absolutely rocks! I found it to be a highly entertaining flick; an excellent way to kickstart a new big screen series. Is it a perfect film? Does it have a "Dark Knight" kind of awesomeness to it? No, not quite, I did have some relatively minor issues with it, but basically I left the theater extremely pleased with what I'd just seen.

Allow me to start with what I LIKED: Henry Cavill really owns this role now. Not since Christopher Reeve have we had an actor in the role who really looked the part. Sorry to Routh, but his rather wooden take on it in SR was pretty weak. The visual effects throughout were consistently strong and very impressive from the beginning in Krypton all throughout the final rumble in Metropolis. I can't remember any moments that jumped out to me as particularly bad CGI. The action....oh my god, it was relentless, brutal, very physical.....everything that it should be with Superman. Loved each and every one of the hand-to-hand fights. Despite my own initial feelings of Amy Adams being a "meh" actress with "meh" looks, I can take some of that back. I thought she made for a very good Lois Lane and actually did look better than I'm used to seeing her. I found both Russell Crowe and Kevin Costner were well-suited for their roles as Kal-El's father (natural and adopted) and their performances were natural and fairly moving, too. The character of Faora, I liked and wished there was more of her in the film. She came across, to me, as more of a menace than Zod himself. I also liked the rather different and interesting take on the behind-the-scenes issues on Krypton and how much time was spent there; as well as the various flashbacks from Kal-El on his growing up and trying to adjust to his powers and even his issues in learning how to fly.

What I DIDN'T LIKE: There was no real chemistry between Cavill and Adams. We all know the Superman/Lois Lane history according to the comics, etc....but just because that's supposed to happen, doesn't mean it looked like it could have or should have. I thought it was awfully fast for any kind of romance to have started between the two. They perhaps should have hinted at that developing in the last minutes of the movie and developed it more in the sequel. That would have been more realistic. I also didn't like the blatant, in-your-face product placement throughout. Gee, do you think IHOP, Sears, and Nokia had something to do with supporting this film? As for Zod, I thought Shannon did OK.....but there was nothing unique about his performance here, and he certainly did nothing to stand out that any other actor in the role wouldn't also have done. It's kind of weak that one of his subordinates seemed more deadly/dangerous than he did. I thought it was kind of corny (no doubt Nolan's influence) to toss in the "good guy repeats back a line the bad guy said to him earlier" bit. (Batman did it to Bane in TDKR and Colonel Hardy does it to Faora in MoS.) And as far as Faora, I wanted to see more of her and more of the fight in Smallville really; it just ended too quickly (as did she). One last thing that I kind of nitpick about, and from a narrative standpoint I understand why it was done the way it was.....but with super-speed, couldn't Clark have still saved his father and have no one else notice? The Jonathan Kent death from the original Superman film was a better one, from something Clark couldn't have controlled anyway.

Anyway, I thought this was a pretty terrific film overall, even if imperfect. Personally I'd give it a 9/10.

 

[KalMart]

Also, going back to telling but not 'immersing'.....


The whole feeling of alienation as a child and the emotion over Jonathan dying I felt was underdeveloped. Maybe it was the kid's acting (I actually liked the change in outlook from that kid he saved). Not that young Clark should have been a brooding basket case...but maybe he should have become one based o the few traumatic snippets we got.


Hey...was anyone else reminded of Batman '89 when the opening studio logos came up?

 

[BlueLantern]

http://thrillbent.com/blog/man-of-steel-since-you-asked/

Mark Waid's review. Can't disagree with anything he said. I like the ending with Zod/Clark but it needed to have way more gravitas to it. Way more.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Why do you have to make it so hard to quote you?

If you're going down that route then there's really no point in you defending this film even.

You do realize your argument boils down to I didn't like it and thus it was boring and poop without much detail on why right?

Fits how? Him coming down, getting beaten up and hauling ass? That's not really cementing him as a very real threat besides empty threat and soon-to-be-collapsing buildings.

Fits that he leads by example and is very hands on. He chose to chase down Jor-El and the codex himself. It is of vast importance to him and he only really trust himself on the subject. It is why he goes after it himself again on Earth.

And empty threats my foot. He killed thousands of people. Perhaps millions. Dude started the movie out by killing a defenseless person and you see all the destruction his insurrection caused.[BLACKOUT] He kills Jor-El[/BLACKOUT]. Empty threats, no, not even close.

If you are going to go with the hyperbole at least make sure some of the movie supports it.

Well let's put it this way then. That scene was so overlong and disengaging that it had zero impact besides satisfying fans of big explosions and punches.

As someone who loves everything from "The Empire Strikes Back" to "Pride & Prejudice", to "Raging Bull" to "Beauty and the Beast". It pleased me quite a bit and had plenty to chew on in terms of story and character.

If they know he's so indestructible then why are antagonizing him and others like him by hurling more fire at them? You'd think the army would be portrayed as a peacekeeping force that would facilitate an evacuation of area, create a perimeter around these supposed hostiles and limit the damage? Or are we supposed to buy into the cliché of the military being dunderheads?

What? perimeter, evacuation? How exactly do they do that. I am curious.

They also don't know how indestructible they are. Also, really, are the humans just suppose to lay down and die? Not try?

So are you saying that the forces at his disposal are so thin that he couldn't send someone else like Jax-Ur to reclaim the Genesis Chamber or at the very least send Faora and some lackeys to defend the World Engine? Ultimately there's so many different macguffins that the filmmakers didn't know what direction to pull the story in even. Genesis Chamber, World Engine, Black Zero and Codex. Which one to defend and protect? Well, **** it we'll just leave it to chance despite the race's survival depending on ALL of it.

They show you how many people go into the Zone. It is not many.

Zod's reasoning for going himself is again made clear.

Whoever Zod had sent with the World Engine, if he could spare them, would have had the same problems Clark did there, without the ability to actually fly.

And they needed all of them for their plan to work. That is why they all converged.

The action essentially relied on Kryptonians in Black fighting a Kryptonian in Blue whilst buildings and military equipment exploded and fired around them. Good move.

Oh my Zod. You could make this argument for literally every action scene.

It boils down to some dude with a heavy hammer, that looks weightless in his hand, hitting dudes with it. Oh, and he can shoot lightning whenever he wants, that does massive damage, but he choose not to to make things more difficult?

Give me any action scene. I can do it, it is easy.

Saving Private Ryan. One side kept shooting at the other until the good guys reinforcements arrived.

See it is easy.

Again, we saw buildings collapse and a few nameless soldiers get their necks snapped by Faora all whilst Zod walks around scowling. The first and only time he put anyone's life in serious danger he dies by Kal-El's hand. So much for a super villain. Reeks of Tarkin/Khan/Palpatine/Nero/Loki/Countless Other Megalomaniacs/Bane who just expected the heroes to give in without a fight. Boring and repetitive. Considering Zod is co-written by the folks who gave us an amazingly compelling villain in the form of the Joker, color me underwhelmed.

Look above for Zod, but from there, wow.

Did you just talk crap about Tarkin? The guy who literally blew up a planet?

Loki, who was seconds away from committing genocide?

The Emperor, who threw and entire Republic into war, killing billions, slaughtered countless Jedi with Order 66, and ran an entire galaxy through fear?

That is who we are going to talk crap about. Really?

 

[Brain Damage]

http://thrillbent.com/blog/man-of-steel-since-you-asked/

Mark Waid's review. Can't disagree with anything he said. I like the ending with Zod/Clark but it needed to have way more gravitas to it. Way more.

He brings us some very, very valid points.

 

[mclay18]

Hey...was anyone else reminded of Batman '89 when the opening studio logos came up?

You weren't the only one.

I very much enjoyed the movie, but I think the movie suffers from pacing issues in the flashbacks (or rather their placement). In BB, the flashbacks were carefully integrated and felt integral.

Some of the Krypton scenes could've been trimmed down, even though I liked the different take on it. As for the lack of humor, there were a few instances where I smiled... so it wasn't completely dour.

And there was genuine heart in the film. The Kent scenes (especially the "Nice suit, son" bit) brought humanity and gravity to the film. And even though Lois and Clark didn't have much chemistry, there is something there that Snyder can expand upon in a sequel or two. And with some of the scenes

Spoiler

(like Lois being able to find Clark in mere moments after the climax)

, that's what dramatic license is for. MOS isn't the first, nor the only movie to do that.

It's an enjoyable film, and something a sequel can definitely improve upon.

 

[Illuminata]

I went to the midnight showing at the Cinerama Dome in Hollywood last night and this film is a hot friggin' mess!

 

[Ipodman]

The scene in the school where young Clark's radar sense is going crazy like in DareDevil is by far the best scene in the movie. I don't think this control-your-powers thing was ever touched on in any other Superman movie or anywhere else (maybe because I'm ignorant). Really surprised me in a good way, I felt like they were daring in the way Superman is portrayed and it was good most of the time

 

[silentrascal]

Was also good to see Clark attempting to fly for the first time, and that it didn't quite come naturally to him.

 

[BlueLantern]

You do realize your argument boils down to I didn't like it and thus it was boring and poop without much detail on why right?

Irony called. Your arguments center around 'I thought it was well done' or 'I thought it was fine'

Fits that he leads by example and is very hands on. He chose to chase down Jor-El and the codex himself. It is of vast importance to him and he only really trust himself on the subject. It is why he goes after it himself again on Earth.

Fair enough, but he does all this whilst leaving other parts undefended. Is that logical? There's no problem going with the theory of 'if you want to a good job, do it yourself' but he's really stretching that theory by then not defending other things just because he can't do it. For example, the World Engine which he assumed would just not get attacked.

And empty threats my foot. He killed thousands of people. Perhaps millions. Dude started the movie out by killing a defenseless person and you see all the destruction his insurrection caused.[BLACKOUT] He kills Jor-El[/BLACKOUT]. Empty threats, no, not even close.

I'm talking about on Earth and you know it. If he's truly an antagonist to Clark's protagonist, he'd exploit Clark's weaknesses and not ignore them. Saying 'well he did this before and doesn't need to do it again' isn't going a long way towards creating a convincing antagonist for a superhero. Just an extremely arrogant antagonist who fails to measure his opponent.

If you are going to go with the hyperbole at least make sure some of the movie supports it.


As someone who loves everything from "The Empire Strikes Back" to "Pride & Prejudice", to "Raging Bull" to "Beauty and the Beast". It pleased me quite a bit and had plenty to chew on in terms of story and character.


What? perimeter, evacuation? How exactly do they do that. I am curious.

Let's see. You notice three fairly dangerous individuals in the area or through your 'surveillance drones' a landed ship in the Smallville vicinity. By coincidence you also have troops in the area already. Arrange an evacuation. If the aliens attack you, well, it's part of the risk no? Or will that create too much conflict whilst a conveniently placed wrestling match ensues with no real risk to innocent civilians?

They also don't know how indestructible they are. Also, really, are the humans just suppose to lay down and die? Not try?

See above. Protect innocents, don't just go ready fire aim.

They show you how many people go into the Zone. It is not many.

Zod's reasoning for going himself is again made clear.

Whoever Zod had sent with the World Engine, if he could spare them, would have had the same problems Clark did there, without the ability to actually fly.

So the problems being a difficulty in flying? Surely a World Engine could be programmed to attack hostiles and support friendly incursions? Or is Kryptonian technology not that advanced?

And they needed all of them for their plan to work. That is why they all converged.

Hold on so their plan was to drill a hole through the Earth's core and terraform it but they all converged on when piece of equipment whilst leaving the other relatively undefended? Good move says the Battle of Normandy's tacticians.

Oh my Zod. You could make this argument for literally every action scene.

It boils down to some dude with a heavy hammer, that looks weightless in his hand, hitting dudes with it. Oh, and he can shoot lightning whenever he wants, that does massive damage, but he choose not to to make things more difficult?

Give me any action scene. I can do it, it is easy.

Saving Private Ryan. One side kept shooting at the other until the good guys reinforcements arrived.

See it is easy.

So let's just abandon any shred of originality and go Transformers style instead? You know the difference between Saving Private Ryan and the Avengers? Those fights are actually entertaining and not monotonous/repetitive.

Look above for Zod, but from there, wow.

Did you just talk crap about Tarkin? The guy who literally blew up a planet?

Blew up a planet and then refused to acknowledge a weak point in the Death Star's defenses resulting in his demise and a colossal space station's destruction.

Loki, who was seconds away from committing genocide?

Was ready to commit genocide but didn't think that his brother would destroy the Bifrost or anyone would think to attack the Tesseract. He lost. Badly. Due to his own miscalculations.

The Emperor, who threw and entire Republic into war, killing billions, slaughtered countless Jedi with Order 66, and ran an entire galaxy through fear?

Ran an entire galaxy through fear but then gave into old age and arrogance whilst torturing his right-hand man's son in front of him and didn't consider reinforcing a weakness in the SECOND Death Star's defenses. Died and threw the Empire into chaos because he underestimated people despite being a self-proclaimed Dark Lord of the Sith. Not very smart for a Dark Lord.

That is who we are going to talk crap about. Really?

Yup, because like Zod they're all arrogant archetypal enemies who don't actually measure the capabilities of their opponents. It's why the Joker was so damn well written. Even when he was beaten he had a backup plan. In every single way the Joker won even down to forcing Gordon/Batman into hiding behind a lie. These lot, they all just thought everything will be alright.

I think the difference between your opinion and mine is that I was expecting an original and fresh take on Superman without recycling generic stuff.

You were happy to accept whatever they threw at you regardless of how many tropes they use and exploit to the point of boredom.

My bad on that one I guess.

Regarding there being a heart to the film, I agree. There was a heart in the familial scenes and those involving Lois. But they're too few and far between to work especially since the majority of the action is so damn sterile.

 

[Kryptonian Warrior]

**** all the bad reviews! I thought it AWESOME! Everything I've always wanted in a Superman movie. It had heart, it was emotional, it was action packed. Just a fun, epic movie. The people who have the opinion that the movie is bad, are just plain and simply wrong. That's MY opinion.

 

[Project862006]

I think the difference between your opinion and mine is that I was expecting an original and fresh take on Superman without recycling generic stuff.

You were happy to accept whatever they threw at you regardless of how many tropes they use and exploit to the point of boredom.

My bad on that one I guess.

wow he has a different opinion than you so that means he just ate up what ever crap was thrown at him

so it is inconceivable that he really liked the film like many others

many people were emotionally connected and saw character development and a solid story structured

 

[Sharkboy]

July 14th...the day I absolutely stop reading Rotten Tomatoes...because that was hands down one of the best superhero films I've ever seen;.

I should have known when most of my favoured critics loved this film, but I still let the score get to me slightly and it dimmed my expectations (which could have helped actually), and knowing this board I'll likely be indirectly accused of being caught in the hype, purposely ignoring any flaws and deluding myself into thinking its a better film than it is, or trying go against some grain...or whatever this board likes to say, and who knows? maybe they are correct, and maybe I'll end up hating this film more as the flaws present themselves (most of which were apparent to me during this screening itself) but it really cannot take away how much that film blew me away today.

And yes there were flaws (definitely could write paragraphs on what was "wrong" with this film) as there are in many other films, but i guess if you can tune in to that right emotional wavelength where the music and the visuals are just in perfect sync and they hit you at the absolute right moment...then they just become pretty irrelevant to you.

Blasphemous as this might be, if that wasn't Superman...I don't want him, I want the guy i just watched for two and half hours, give me more of that and that world.

 

[BlueLantern]

wow he has a different opinion than you so that means he just ate up what ever crap as thrown at him

so it is inconceivable that he really liked the film like many others

many people were emotionally connected and saw character development and a solid story structured

He's quite blatantly said that he didn't have a problem with the action scenes since he's seen it all before. See his references.

I've quite blatantly said I didn't enjoy the action scenes BECAUSE I've seen it all before.

I'm not saying he shouldn't like the film. I'm explaining why I don't like it. I'm not asking anyone to agree or disagree with me.

It's all based on opinion.

Is that so inconceivable?

 

[Project862006]

it seems like your taking offense that people actually loved this film

this line specifically

You were happy to accept whatever they threw at you regardless of how many tropes they use and exploit to the point of boredom.

 

[LordofhouseEl]

**** all the bad reviews! I thought it AWESOME! Everything I've always wanted in a Superman movie. It had heart, it was emotional, it was action packed. Just a fun, epic movie. The people who have the opinion that the movie is bad, are just plain and simply wrong. That's MY opinion.

Very true it had all these things until the krypton scene ended that is, from there it fell apart.

 

[BlueLantern]

Not at all. I'm just pointing out what I perceive his mindset to be. I don't perceive it as better or worse, but just not the mindset I went in with.

And the irony is that the observation isn't technically wrong. Read through his posts and he's openly admitted that the action is no different to any other similar films.

It's just evident that he doesn't see a problem with this whilst I most definitely do.

The only fight that really got me happy was the final fight between Zod and Superman. The rest were just bland and boring.

Don't get me wrong, I liked parts of it. There's a greatness in it, but there's too much flab around its waist and too many clichés on its face.

 

[sf2]

Not at all. I'm just pointing out what I perceive his mindset to be. I don't perceive it as better or worse, but just not the mindset I went in with.

And the irony is that the observation isn't technically wrong. Read through his posts and he's openly admitted that the action is no different to any other similar films.

It's just evident that he doesn't see a problem with this whilst I most definitely do.

The only fight that really got me happy was the final fight between Zod and Superman. The rest were just bland and boring.

Don't get me wrong, I liked parts of it. There's a greatness in it, but there's too much flab around its waist and too many clichés on its face.

R u awake? The smallville fight was so intense!

 

[BlueLantern]

It was overlong. It had its moments, but like the rest of the film itself, it began to outstay its welcome.

A shorter and tighter moment would have definitely been intense, but considering what followed was more of the same, I don't remember it fondly.

 

[Sharkboy]

I didn't feel the climax was too long (like some people have said)...then again I'm a metal gear fan...and we are used to overdrawn and overdramatic fights so...

 

[MahvelBaby!]

Going to be seeing this tonight! Will give my thoughts later, interested to see how I feel about this movie when I see it.

 

[kalhawj]

I finally saw this movie last night. Still picking up my jaw... From begining to end it was amazing and words cannot describe how awesome and epic this movie is. I am now a Henry fan. This guy nail it as Superman. He may eventually beat out Christopher Reeve as my favorite live action Superman. Only time will tell. This move leave so much for the Sequel that I simply cannot wait. 9.5/10.

 

[Joker594]

I didn't feel the climax was too long (like some people have said)...then again I'm a metal gear fan...and we are used to overdrawn and overdramatic fights so...

Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater ended 4 different times. Freakin' Volgin, man.

 

[Poeman]

They have to figure this out in the sequel...Its almost not possible

[blackout] Henry Cavill looks like Superman when he was at the Daily Planet with glasses on...Its hard to ignore, same hairstyle too...Cant they move it to the side or something[/blackout]