The Flash Tom Cavanaugh IS Harrison Wells/Eobard Thawne/Reverse-Flash - Part 1

I"m thinking the first episode of Season three may use the vortex as another time-travel thing, perhaps revealing that even with Eddie dead, a new Thawne family sprung up who replaced Eddie's line, or Barry ends up rescuing the original Wells or Thawne soemhow.
 
yes, RF's action of killing Barry's mom happen in the past, but the action of him going back in time, happened in the future... if he didn't exist in that future to go back in time, he couldn't have been in the past
 
I hope him being a series regular isn't true.

The easiest way for me to digest this, is Eddie killing himself essentially "kills" RF at that specific point in time. But that he still previously existed, up and down the timeline. That way he still killed Barry's mother. But if he did that, then he'd also kill Harrison Wells.

So.. I'd be happy to see RF during Barry time travelling. Perhaps even him coming to Central City prior to Eddie's suicide in his own timeline. But as a series regular? I dunno.. don't want to see them Malcolm Merlyn him.

I'd be quite happy if they just moved on now, even though he was fantastic and i loved him.
 
I hope him being a series regular isn't true.

The easiest way for me to digest this, is Eddie killing himself essentially "kills" RF at that specific point in time. But that he still previously existed, up and down the timeline. That way he still killed Barry's mother. But if he did that, then he'd also kill Harrison Wells.

So.. I'd be happy to see RF during Barry time travelling. Perhaps even him coming to Central City prior to Eddie's suicide in his own timeline. But as a series regular? I dunno.. don't want to see them Malcolm Merlyn him.

I'd be quite happy if they just moved on now, even though he was fantastic and i loved him.

Eobard Thawne has been erased from history. So every action he did will be erased too.

But you don't need to worry, the days of Tom Cavanaugh as Eobard Thawne / RF are over. But Tom Cavanaugh will be regular next season... as the good (and true) Doctor Harrison Wells. Since Eobard Thawne has been erased, he hasn't kill and replaced Harrison Wells.

So Harrison Wells is alive and well. He can walk. His wife is alive. They have created Starlab, are happy together and are working on the particule accelerator that isn't finished.

As for Eobard Thawne, he will be reborn in the future... but will only be played by Matt Letscher now. We will see him "fight through centuries" with Barry, but I doubt that he will be the main villain of a season anymore.
 
Eobard Thawne has been erased from history. So every action he did will be erased too.

But you don't need to worry, the days of Tom Cavanaugh as Eobard Thawne / RF are over. But Tom Cavanaugh will be regular next season... as the good (and true) Doctor Harrison Wells. Since Eobard Thawne has been erased, he hasn't kill and replaced Harrison Wells.

So Harrison Wells is alive and well. He can walk. His wife is alive. They have created Starlab, are happy together and are working on the particule accelerator that isn't finished.

As for Eobard Thawne, he will be reborn in the future... but will only be played by Matt Letscher now. We will see him "fight through centuries" with Barry, but I doubt that he will be the main villain of a season anymore.

Thats just your theory. That presumes that the whole timeline that they're in at the end of the finale essentially dies and nothing is the same. And essentially undoes Barry's choice not to save his mother.

I don't personally believe thats what is going to happen.
 
Eobard Thawne has been erased from history. So every action he did will be erased too.

But you don't need to worry, the days of Tom Cavanaugh as Eobard Thawne / RF are over. But Tom Cavanaugh will be regular next season... as the good (and true) Doctor Harrison Wells. Since Eobard Thawne has been erased, he hasn't kill and replaced Harrison Wells.

So Harrison Wells is alive and well. He can walk. His wife is alive. They have created Starlab, are happy together and are working on the particule accelerator that isn't finished.

As for Eobard Thawne, he will be reborn in the future... but will only be played by Matt Letscher now. We will see him "fight through centuries" with Barry, but I doubt that he will be the main villain of a season anymore.

All the above is exactly how I hope it plays out.
 
Eddie's death erased Eobard from existence. Therefore there is no Reverse Flash that goes back in time to kill Barry's mother.

You make a good point, but I respectfully disagree lol.
It could go 3 ways, where you're right and I'm wrong, where I'm right and you're wrong, or we're both wrong.

The reason I say this is because it still has to be a time loop. Like, have you ever seen Misfits (the UK series)? Don't wanna spoil it,
but Simon from the Future (AKA SuperHoodie) goes to the past then has his powers removed, all so he could make Alisha fall in love with him. But then she gets killed, so the Simon of the present does the same. It was even acknowledged in the show by a cast member that the events will play over and over again.
.

The way I see it is that those events still HAVE to play out (RF going back in time, killing Nora, getting marooned, etc). It has to because it's like "canon" for that timeline. Thawne only died after Eddie killed himself, because it's easy to deduce that he's the head of the Thawne bloodline. They both appear together within the show's timeline.

The only way for it to be undone, where Thawne can't kill Nora Allen, is for something to happen to one of Eddie's ancestors, e.g. death of one of his parents. They don't exist, Eddie doesn't exist. Eddie doesn't exist, Thawne will never exist.

That's how I see it anyway. I like nerd debates lol :yay:
 
Also the 'original' harrison wells creates the Flash five years afterwards, and the show won't do a five year timeskip because of crossovers.

Add to this that if Nora doesn't die, then barry never lives with Joe and we get the whole timeline that he purposely avoided. I don't see them changing every single characters role.

I think it's more likely that everything Eobard did has stuck, he still exists in the timeline's past and future but he takes no further action from this point (i.e everytime Barry meets him in future, will be in Thawne's past, allowing both actors to play him).
 
I'd love to be a fly in the wall on their discussion. Can only imagine the headaches they are thinking of with every decision they make they need a chance in the story.

Technically, Nora shouldn't be dead if the Reverse Flash never existed, I wonder how this will change Arrow as well, so many possibilities.
 
I suspect that the black hole they have to deal with is actually not a side effect of the wormhole, per se. They shut down the wormhole, after all. I think its a side effect of Eddie killing himself, and thus paradoxing Eobard out of existence. Basically, someone took a hammer to time-space, and it produced shrapnel. It just so happens that the most obvious piece of shrapnel is "that wormhole you just closed? It decided to reopen".

Dealing with the black hole is probably going to involve some form of "patching" space-time. Some things will get changed, others will stay the same even if they shouldn't, and the result will probably be a bit of a mess. Queu Rip Hunter.
 
After Eddie's "Looper" act, and its consequences regarding Wells/Thawne, I just realized that this probably explains why RF's powers keep flickering.

Also, why didn't anything happen to Wells/Thawne during "Power Outage" even though the newspaper was influenced?
 
Probably because of temporal inertia. The universes "tries" not to change, even if the current state is technically paradoxical. Its only when something *really* severe happens that the spring snaps. I wouldn't be shocked if "punching a hole through time" contributed; under normal circumstances, Eddie's death might have resulted in nothing, but because time was already stretched to the breaking point, it didn't have much give left to give. Thus, person outright disintegrating into non-existence, and sudden black hole.
 
Wells really was in great form this week.

"I'm sorry,Cisco....Not for killing you,I'm sure I had a good reason..."

"We don't have cows anymore in my time"

:hehe:
 
I suspect that the black hole they have to deal with is actually not a side effect of the wormhole, per se. They shut down the wormhole, after all. I think its a side effect of Eddie killing himself, and thus paradoxing Eobard out of existence. Basically, someone took a hammer to time-space, and it produced shrapnel. It just so happens that the most obvious piece of shrapnel is "that wormhole you just closed? It decided to reopen".

Dealing with the black hole is probably going to involve some form of "patching" space-time. Some things will get changed, others will stay the same even if they shouldn't, and the result will probably be a bit of a mess. Queu Rip Hunter.

The idea of patching stuff up is interesting. Maybe there needs to be a Reverse Flash as much as a Flash. So Barry will have to create a new Eobard or Hunter Zolomon.
 
Ok, so what was the big twist with Wells that Grant had been going on about no one predicting yet?

I could have sworn that was supposed to be in the finale, unless he was actually referring to the fact that Thawne killed the original Wells and took his place, but that happened episodes ago.
 
If Barry encounters the real Wells next season, will he harbour feelings of resentment and hostility towards him? But the real Wells is a good man and has not done anything wrong to Barry. In fact, he probably helped him become the Flash in the first place, and had as much taken away from him as Barry did when Thawne killed his mother.

I hope Cavanagh does feature strongly as a regular, and not as a regular in the sense that Brett Dalton has been a "regular" cast member in Agents of SHIELD season 2 where his appearances have been sporadic. I would like him to be an ally of Barry's and a true mentor.
 
On the subject of Cavanagh's return and Real Wells

Every time someone brings up wanting him back, and having the Good Wells be the way to do it, I have to wonder do they really get what they're actually saying. We fell in love with his Eobard/Wells. That's who you actually want back people.

Real Wells was a gooey puppy, and it was tragic what happened to him, but just in those flashbacks you could tell he's ultimately a boring character. He's Barry's science love, and Eddie's to good for this sinful earth persona. Again he's boring. Who wants to see a whole season of that? Cavanagh is brilliant, but even he can't make that interesting. Everything we loved about his acting was poured into his Eobard masquerading as Wells. Again fandom you want him back.

Also Cavanagh himself only wanted to play Eobard/Wells/Reverse Flash. Even in his most recent interviews he keeps saying that.
 
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Here how I think the actor could return while keeping the Reverse Flash dead. Have him be an Alt. Harrison Wells. If Jay is introduced, he could be the Wells of that universe. Also if ever see scenes from the original timeline, he could then also play the original Wells. There is also a possibility of him appearing as Thawne through flashbacks/hallucinations/dreams in season 2.
 
If the producers want to bring Cavanagh back as RF -- not as some alternate version nor as the original Wells -- they've shown that he had the necessary tech to keep himself safe.

The disguise box could have copied Eddie's DNA in an instant while Eddie was RF's captive. RF would then be able to drop off Eddie's clone (named Malcolm?) at a convenient point in the timeline to continue the family line.

Barry didn't cooperate, so RF could have used a lifelike hologram to fake his own death. RF still has to deal with the clone, but the timing of these events can be loopy (think Bill & Ted and the keys) as long as it works out in the end.
 
On the subject of Cavanagh's return and Real Wells

Every time someone brings up wanting him back, and having the Good Wells be the way to do it, I have to wonder do they really get what they're actually saying. We fell in love with his Eobard/Wells. That's who you actually want back people.

Real Wells was a gooey puppy, and it was tragic what happened to him, but just in those flashbacks you could tell he's ultimately a boring character. He's Barry's science love, and Eddie's to good for this sinful earth persona. Again he's boring. Who wants to see a whole season of that? Cavanagh is brilliant, but even he can't make that interesting. Everything we loved about his acting was poured into his Eobard masquerading as Wells. Again fandom you want him back.

Also Cavanagh himself only wanted to play Eobard/Wells/Reverse Flash. Even in his most recent interviews he keeps saying that.

Yeah,I've never really wanted the "real" Wells. Cavanagh was really playing Thawne, not Wells.
 
On the subject of Cavanagh's return and Real Wells

Every time someone brings up wanting him back, and having the Good Wells be the way to do it, I have to wonder do they really get what they're actually saying. We fell in love with his Eobard/Wells. That's who you actually want back people.

Real Wells was a gooey puppy, and it was tragic what happened to him, but just in those flashbacks you could tell he's ultimately a boring character. He's Barry's science love, and Eddie's to good for this sinful earth persona. Again he's boring. Who wants to see a whole season of that? Cavanagh is brilliant, but even he can't make that interesting. Everything we loved about his acting was poured into his Eobard masquerading as Wells. Again fandom you want him back.

Also Cavanagh himself only wanted to play Eobard/Wells/Reverse Flash. Even in his most recent interviews he keeps saying that.

Thank you. I've been hoping against Cavanagh playing the real Wells in future seasons since they revealed Harrison Wells was a real person. He's one of my favourite live action portrayals of a comic character ever.

Honestly his brief appearance in the Legends trailer makes me think they'll go back in time to prevent Eddie killing himself, which in turn prevents Eobard's disappearance, which in turn prevents the black hole at the end of the Flash.
 
You make a good point, but I respectfully disagree lol.

Even with the resetting to the original timeline which inspires Eobard to change the timeline, it still results in a fatal paradox and not a causality loop. The alternate timeline (the one in which the show existed) is always voided. Hence the giant rift in space/time cliffhanger. That timeline likely can't exist in a persistent state and season 2 may be dealing with a broken timeline rather than a simply reset one (the pre-Nora's death timeline). Which could be backed up by Grant Gustin saying they will explore multiple timelines in the next season.

Your theory about one of Eddie's ancestors being killed to assure Eobard never exists to come back and kill Nora is a little off also. All you need is to ensure that Eobard doesn't exist in the original timeline also. Eddie (or any descendant pre-Eobard) dying in the original timeline would also ensure that. It's just that in the original timeline there is no cause or foreknowledge to make that possible.

If the producers want to bring Cavanagh back as RF -- not as some alternate version nor as the original Wells -- they've shown that he had the necessary tech to keep himself safe.

The disguise box could have copied Eddie's DNA in an instant while Eddie was RF's captive. RF would then be able to drop off Eddie's clone (named Malcolm?) at a convenient point in the timeline to continue the family line.

Barry didn't cooperate, so RF could have used a lifelike hologram to fake his own death. RF still has to deal with the clone, but the timing of these events can be loopy (think Bill & Ted and the keys) as long as it works out in the end.

That never happened though. The finale showed you Eobard being erased. Clearly he left no Eddie clone or other assurances that his lineage would carry on to eventually produce Eobard Thawne. There would be no time rift otherwise.
 
Yeah,I've never really wanted the "real" Wells. Cavanagh was really playing Thawne, not Wells.

Technically, as Thawne was pretending to be Wells, Cavanagh was playing Thawne playing Wells. :cwink:

In my mind it isn't exactly a stretch to imagine that the real Wells would be somewhat similar to how Thawne portrayed him back when no one [including the audience] knew that he wasn't Wells. Yes, Tina McGee mentioned the change in his demeanor [for the worse] after the car accident but Thawne/Wells was still a 'nice' guy by in his own right for the majority of the time, at least to Barry, Kaitlin and Cisco, before he got revealed.

Although Cavanagh clearly had a blast playing 'full-on' bad guy (and I certainly had a blast seeing him have such a blast) I did like the relationship between 'nice' Thawne/Wells and co before the whole RF thing blew up and it would be good to get back to something like that, only this time it would be almost like meeting a completely new person and there is something interesting in that given the fact that a completely new relationship would have to be built.

Plus its a convenient way of keeping Tom around. Which is paramount.
 

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