Well....Shawn Levy is Directing the Flash

[hippie_hunter]

But why should we settle for a an average/ok movie when we can get something better?

I know what you're saying. I feel the same way. But I don't think that we are going to get a movie that is absolute garbage like most people seem to think here. This is a definete wait and see before we judge.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

I would love to see Latino Review give us a review of Goyer's Flash.

 

[Thunder Emperor]

This is fu*king disgusting. I knew those idiots would do this. Don't they ever learn? Did Batman & Robin teach them nothing?

The worst part about this isn't just that this film is now guaranteed to suck, but that when the film fails, they won't try again. The Flash doesn't have the icon status of Batman and Superman to feed off, so when their shi*ty Shawn Levy film blows it they won't consider a Flash revamp to be a viable option.

Every hope of ever seeing a good Flash movie just went up in smoke, and that's really infuriating, because I love the Flash. this blows.

Its the WB, they have no Idea how to run their franchise other than into te ground

 

[Ultimate Movie-Man]

Alright I'm sick of all the bashing.

Pretend this is a crime, with Levy as the culprit. We are the police. His previous films (besides Night @ the Museum, and Just Married IMO) aren't Oscar material...they were drug counts. This one is a huge bag of coke. We have to wait and see what Levy does with this. Come on, give him a chance. If he fails the "test", THEN we can send him to cyber-nerd-hack-bashing-jail.

 

[Saint]

Jay Garrick is Golden Age though. Not referring to those guys. If that's the case then the Green Lantern Movie might as well be about Alan Scott (who's not even related to the GL corps.).

But it really all depends. Are the movies going for Golden Age or Silver Age. If it's Silver age, then it's obvious that Hal and Barry should be the first ones...I'm not a DC fanatic (I just know enough. It gets crazy with the alternate timelines and such) but were the Golden Age Flash and Green Lantern even related to the Silver Age Flashes and Green Lanterns before the crisis (infinite earths)?

The "age" they are from is irrelevant. Jay Garrick and Alan Scott have been a part of the main DC timeline since 1986. In the current continuity, they predate Barry and Hal, and hell, they stuck around after Barry and Hal died (though Hal came back). They're still run the Justice Society.

Bottom line is that your "you should start at the beginning" line is irrelevant any way you slice it. The Flash legacy started with Jay. The truth is that you don't really believe in the argument you're giving me; you just like Barry better. That's fine, and as valid arguments go it's a lot better than your "You should start at the beginning, except ignore Jay for some reason" argument. I mean, I would prefer a movie with Wally as the main character--featuring Barry in some capacity--because I grew up with Wally, and I prefer him. That said, I don't make up bogus arguments to justify using him over Barry. I just like him better. You should probably admit to the same.

 

[Savage]

I actually like Wally better. And to be honest John Stewart is my favorite Green Lantern. I just don't consider Jay and Alan part of these legacies. They just happened to have the same name. Just like I don't consider the original Ghost Rider (The white one on the horse) to have anything to do with Johnny Blaze or Dan Ketch. It's just a name. Alan Scott has nothing to do with the corps. and Jay Garrick didn't have anything to do with these Flashes until the crisis in 86. As far as I'm concerned The Flash Legacy (Where there's a Flash and a Kid Flash who later becomes the new Flash) started with Barry.

 

[The Guard]

There's no reason THE FLASH can't work with Barry OR Wally, and include Jay Garrick in some capacity. Especially if it's a generational tale that involves time travel. It makes perfect sense. And I fail to see why when you hear Goyer wrote a script that was "dark" you all think his Flash was like Batman or something. I doubt it. Odds are his Zoom did dark things and the story was a serious take on the effects of time traveling, not that his Flash was uber-lighthearted.

 

[Mike_D202]

 

[jaguarr]

I'm not a Goyer fan, but I definitely dislike Levy more than I do Goyer. Levy is a horrible choice. Every single one of his films has looked like complete ass to me and cater to the lowest common denominator.

jag

 

[GL1]

I actually like Wally better. And to be honest John Stewart is my favorite Green Lantern. I just don't consider Jay and Alan part of these legacies. They just happened to have the same name. Just like I don't consider the original Ghost Rider (The white one on the horse) to have anything to do with Johnny Blaze or Dan Ketch. It's just a name. Alan Scott has nothing to do with the corps. and Jay Garrick didn't have anything to do with these Flashes until the crisis in 86. As far as I'm concerned The Flash Legacy (Where there's a Flash and a Kid Flash who later becomes the new Flash) started with Barry.

Here's is the reason why this arguement can't float with anyone else. The popular fan conception that Jay and Alan "don't count" has no basis other than, possibly, "I grew up with hero X." From my perspective, based on current and previous continuities, both Jay and Alan had significant influence on the origin of Hal and ESPECIALLY Barry. We can ignore that because as children we concieved of Barry as the first, we can even call the Barry where Jay is irrelevant the "true" origin in order to add empty validation to our viewpoint...

Bottom line, "Jay doesn't count" is a non-fact. There's no reason a moviemaker should have to take "as far as the fans are concerned" into account when the comics clearly differ. And that could lead me into a tirade, so I'll stop now.

 

[GL1]

A- I give you that, i don´t read Flash in a couple of years

B- Yes, there is. Barry Allen is essential to the all DCU, if
you don´t get that, i´m not the ones that is going to explain.

C- If that´s your comeback, you really need to work it out.
A legacy has a start, this is it. To have something passed, you need for something to start, right? Barry Allen life and death is too damn important to be just a footnote or a 15 minutes sequence.
But tell me, why do you want Wally so much?

D- Flashbacks are stupid the moment you use to them to tell something that should have a movie about. To tell a character´s life and dead in a simple flashback is not only stupid, is moronic. More even when the character has the importance of Barry, but clearly you don´t get that, you don´t get his importance to Wally and what he is today.
And if you do, you don´t seem to?

E- Read the above and find out.

By your username, you seem a Green Lantern fan.
So, would you like to start with Kyle or Hal?

B - Barry Allen is important to the Flash legacy, a Flash movie cannot work without acknowledging him as a great hero who sacrificed his life. I don't believe the entirety of his life is important to all Flash stories, neither do I think it has an influence on the non-existant movie DCU. What kind of hero he was is important... that's it.

C - Too important to you. His death, just like any early movie or opening sequence death IS important to the situation and formatin of who wally is. The lessons that he taught Wally are deep and insightful. But a trilogy about Barry Allen is not about the Flash Legacy, just as a Batman trilogy is not about the Batman legacy. Now as comic readers, WE know that these are legacies, but a movie or trilogy about a single hero is just that, not a legacy movie.

I want Wally because that's the BEST way to have BOTH. You can recognize the greatness of Barry Allen, and USE that as a plot issue, a cornerstone even, with flashbacks to Barry being the great amiable teacher we all know and love, AND you can have Wally trying to fit into this legacy with his own struggles and doing all those Wally speed tricks. A Barry movie CAN'T give the best of both worlds, but a Wally movie CAN, WILL and MUST.

D - Good thing I wasn't planning on that.

I get the importance of what kind of hero he was, his sacrifice in death and his mentorship of Wally, all that is crucial to who Wally is, no doubt. What I don't get is how that DEMANDS a trilogy or how starting with Wally is "wrong."

I am a GL fan, and I would have to do an ensemble movie with Hal, Sinestro, John, Katma and Kilowog at the center of it. The Green Lantern mythos are too big to reduce it to centering around Hal and reduce everyone else to just a footnote or supporting cast member. I believe that Barry and Hal are important, but not so important that John, Wally and Kyle should be ignored, or "saved for another trilogy."

Barry and Hal are not, to me, more important than Jay and Alan either, for the record.

Read my reply to RINB...

Your reply to RINB is not a reply to me... at least not one that makes sense.

 

[Savage]

Here's is the reason why this arguement can't float with anyone else. The popular fan conception that Jay and Alan "don't count" has no basis other than, possibly, "I grew up with hero X." From my perspective, based on current and previous continuities, both Jay and Alan had significant influence on the origin of Hal and ESPECIALLY Barry. We can ignore that because as children we concieved of Barry as the first, we can even call the Barry where Jay is irrelevant the "true" origin in order to add empty validation to our viewpoint...

Bottom line, "Jay doesn't count" is a non-fact. There's no reason a moviemaker should have to take "as far as the fans are concerned" into account when the comics clearly differ. And that could lead me into a tirade, so I'll stop now.

Fair enough. Quite honestly I grew up reading about Wally but I don't favor him over the others. But hey, I'm more of a Marvel guy than DC. What exactly is the relation between Barry and Jay?

 

[souloffire]

If this movie gets made I'll wait for a trailer before forming an opinion. Remember they hired the director of "Pee Wee's Big Adventure" and "Beetlejuice" to direct Batman and got "Mr. Mom" to play him. Just because a guy directed some comedies doesn't mean he'll make "The Flash" one. Maybe he's tired of doing comedies. We don't know. Way too early to start bashing it.

 

[Isildur´s Heir]

B - Barry Allen is important to the Flash legacy, a Flash movie cannot work without acknowledging him as a great hero who sacrificed his life. I don't believe the entirety of his life is important to all Flash stories, neither do I think it has an influence on the non-existant movie DCU. What kind of hero he was is important... that's it.

But that´s the thing, a movie can work without Barry, but a movie about the Flash can´t.
If you want to make a action/adventure movie, sure it can work just fine, but you will not make a FLASH movie.

C - Too important to you. His death, just like any early movie or opening sequence death IS important to the situation and formatin of who wally is. The lessons that he taught Wally are deep and insightful. But a trilogy about Barry Allen is not about the Flash Legacy, just as a Batman trilogy is not about the Batman legacy. Now as comic readers, WE know that these are legacies, but a movie or trilogy about a single hero is just that, not a legacy movie.

To give importance to Barry´s death, to make people care, you have to show him before having the powers, for people to understand the man.
Than, you have to show him after having the powers, to show people the hero he became.
To show just his death, and a resume about his life, is an empty effort for drama, because no one will fu**ing care.

I want Wally because that's the BEST way to have BOTH. You can recognize the greatness of Barry Allen, and USE that as a plot issue, a cornerstone even, with flashbacks to Barry being the great amiable teacher we all know and love, AND you can have Wally trying to fit into this legacy with his own struggles and doing all those Wally speed tricks. A Barry movie CAN'T give the best of both worlds, but a Wally movie CAN, WILL and MUST.

And this is where you fail, because you lack vision.
You want to have all in one movie, you want to fall in the same problem that Daredevil faced, you want to tell 20 years of the character in one lousy movie.
Wally will not give the best of both worlds, in fact, it will not give the best of his own world, because it will end by being a extremly convulted movie, with much going around, too much information.

D -I get the importance of what kind of hero he was, his sacrifice in death and his mentorship of Wally, all that is crucial to who Wally is, no doubt. What I don't get is how that DEMANDS a trilogy or how starting with Wally is "wrong."

Why?
I get that you don´t want the movie to start with Barry, but how do you fail to see that it needs a trilogy to tell the life and dead of Barry Allen?
Origin (1st movie)-Hero (2nd movie)- Sacrifice (3rd movie)...is not really that hard to figure out.

I am a GL fan, and I would have to do an ensemble movie with Hal, Sinestro, John, Katma and Kilowog at the center of it. The Green Lantern mythos are too big to reduce it to centering around Hal and reduce everyone else to just a footnote or supporting cast member. I believe that Barry and Hal are important, but not so important that John, Wally and Kyle should be ignored, or "saved for another trilogy."

And it would suck!
Once again, an extremely convulted movie.
Make a movie about Hal, and make the audience get into the all Green Lantern corps throught his eyes.
Have him battle Sinestro in the second, because, unless you have a full Green Lantern in Hal Jordan, his fight with Sinestro doesn´t have the same dramatic angle.
Read Emerald Dawn, and understand why things can´t be rushed.

But i get it now, and that´s what separates me from you and several others...
You want a cool Flash movie, with all excitment and thrills and special effects, with cool action scenes and all that.
That´s why you are fine with Wally being it.
I want for the average joe to get what i love about comics, to understand the characters, to understand and care for what they are watching, to want to come out for more, not because it was a 2h joyride, but because they understood and cared for what they were watching.
I want for people to get out of the theater and saying: NOW I UNDERSTAND, NOW I KNOW WHO HE IS

 

[jaguarr]

If this movie gets made I'll wait for a trailer before forming an opinion. Remember they hired the director of "Pee Wee's Big Adventure" and "Beetlejuice" to direct Batman and got "Mr. Mom" to play him. Just because a guy directed some comedies doesn't mean he'll make "The Flash" one. Maybe he's tired of doing comedies. We don't know. Way too early to start bashing it.

Yeah, but Burton had made some very good, albeit very quirky, movies prior to Batman. Movies that were unique, had their own style, strong storytelling and imagery, and still stand up as classics even to this day. Levy has made "Just Married", "Crappier By The Dozen" and that horrid, craptacular "Pink Panther" rehash. Ladies and gentlemen....Steve Martin is.....The Flash!!!!! *wacky hijinks ensue*

jag

 

[souloffire]

Yeah, but Burton had made some very good, albeit very quirky, movies prior to Batman. Movies that were unique, had their own style, strong storytelling and imagery, and still stand up as classics even to this day. Levy has made "Just Married", "Crappier By The Dozen" and that horrid, craptacular "Pink Panther" rehash. Ladies and gentlemen....Steve Martin is.....The Flash!!!!! *wacky hijinks ensue*

jag

Yes but the point is the same things I'm hearing in this thread is the same thing I heard back when they made Batman. Nobody here knows what kind of movie Levy will make. Mabye it will be good, maybe it will suck. We won't know till we see the movie.

 

[Katsuro]

What I still dont get, and I'm not really too big on Flash anyway, is exactly HOW you'd connect Jay Garrick to the rest of the Flashes. I mean, Wally is Barry's nephew and sidekick, and Bart is a descendent of Barry who was Wally's sidekick, but Jay isn't really connected to them at all.

I mean, in terms of writing an interesting film, how do you bring Jay in as a character and have it make sense? How do you make the character relevant to what's going on with Barry, and not have him seem tacked on and useless? Especially if you start with Wally, because then you have to explain that not only did Wally's uncle use to be the Flash, but that even before that there was this other guy named The Flash... for some reason.

 

[jaguarr]

Yes but the point is the same things I'm hearing in this thread is the same thing I heard back when they made Batman. Nobody here knows what kind of movie Levy will make. Mabye it will be good, maybe it will suck. We won't know till we see the movie.

But Burton was a good director BEFORE he made Batman. Levy is NOT going to be a good director before he makes The Flash.

jag

 

[Saint]

I actually like Wally better. And to be honest John Stewart is my favorite Green Lantern. I just don't consider Jay and Alan part of these legacies.

Then your considerations are wrong. They are a part of those legacies, whether you think so or not. Jay especially. Go pick up an issue of The Flash and see for yourself.

They just happened to have the same name.

Yeah, I mean, it's not like Jay Garrick has been a consistant supporting character in "The Flash" for years... oh, wait.

It's just a name. Alan Scott has nothing to do with the corps.

Incorrect. The source of Alan's power, the Starheart, was assembled by the Oans (thank you, retcons). There is also a connection to an ancient member of the Corps, but I can't remember exactly what it was.

and Jay Garrick didn't have anything to do with these Flashes until the crisis in 86.

So? That's twenty-one years--only nine short of Barry's run as the Flash, and one longer than Wally's. Let's be realistic here: this has nothing to do with the beginning of the legacy. You just don't want him in the film. I don't either, but at least I'm not dishing out faulty arguments as to why.

 

[Isildur´s Heir]

What I still dont get, and I'm not really too big on Flash anyway, is exactly HOW you'd connect Jay Garrick to the rest of the Flashes.

Because he was the first Flash?
Just a wild guess...

 

[fabman]

And what if they'll ignore the legacy aspect of "THE FLASH" making Wally West the only Flash giving him for example Barry Allen's job etc. ...then we can expect a LOT of whining!!!

 

[souloffire]

But Burton was a good director BEFORE he made Batman. Levy is NOT going to be a good director before he makes The Flash.

jag

Yes but people were ripping him anyway. When people heard Burton and Keaton they thought they were gonna get the tv series all over again. I have never seen a Levy film to my knowledge so I can't comment on his directing skill but even if his movies have been bad it doesn't mean he can't make a good one.

 

[jaguarr]

Yes but people were ripping him anyway. When people heard Burton and Keaton they thought they were gonna get the tv series all over again. I have never seen a Levy film to my knowledge so I can't comment on his directing skill but even if his movies have been bad it doesn't mean he can't make a good one.

Levy has SEVERAL very BAD films under his belt. I don't think he's going to somehow make a miraculous recovery and suddenly make a good one. His track record speaks against him in a very big way. Burton's track record was good, even though he hadn't don't a superhero film. Big difference. Levy's a terrible choice. Similar to the Catwoman fiacso, this will be FINO.

jag

 

[fabman]

Even if I don't think he's a good or the best choice for 'The Flash' I really liked 'Night at the Museum'!

 

[souloffire]

Levy has SEVERAL very BAD films under his belt. I don't think he's going to somehow make a miraculous recovery and suddenly make a good one. His track record speaks against him in a very big way. Burton's track record was good, even though he hadn't don't a superhero film. Big difference. Levy's a terrible choice. Similar to the Catwoman fiacso, this will be FINO.

jag

Like I said, people were saying the same things about Batman. We won't know till we see the film.