What is the highest power class Hulk would tend to take a majority against?

[X]

Ah, no, I meant on the Hulkmovie.com boards. I was just saying, I'd mentioned him over a year ago there and they all basically had seizures at the thought.

 

[Unthinkable]

Ah, no, I meant on the Hulkmovie.com boards. I was just saying, I'd mentioned him over a year ago there and they all basically had seizures at the thought.

Hahaha, nothing beats a good fanboy reaction at the thought that their favorite character isn't the strongest/smartest/coolest..

 

[Masterfungus]

Ah, no, I meant on the Hulkmovie.com boards. I was just saying, I'd mentioned him over a year ago there and they all basically had seizures at the thought.

All of us?

 

[X]

90% of you. Are you implying you posted there? I don't remember. Then again, my memory is akin to a 120 year old mans, so hey.

I'm sure I could find the thread, and post a link. I started two vs. threads over there, which were, by and far me messing around and I was basically castrated and burnt at the stake for my heinous crimes.

I still talked to... ah, what was his name. One of the admins there, his real name is Mike.

The hypocrisy really pissed me off. They tot The Hulk as being able to beat everyone under the sun, all high fives and big smiles... But when another characters that's higher up on the food chain is even mentioned (With no malicious intent) everyone stares at you like you killed their pet and throws a hissy fit.

But, hey, whatever.

 

[Masterfungus]

90% of you. Are you implying you posted there? I don't remember. Then again, my memory is akin to a 120 year old mans, so hey.

Masterfungus = Mastermold

Someone here already had the moldy title so I decide to become master of fungus instead.

Anyway, I don't remember the thread specifically, but I do remember about a year or more ago there were some newbies there that wanted to turn the movie board into a battle board, and seemed bent on provoking the obvious fan base. If you got a heated reaction, it may have been that you were (unjustly) associated with that situation. Today, most of the regulars there (except DevilHulk and maybe a few others) don't really care about "vs" threads, and thus they don't generate much interest or posting.

 

[X]

I posted on those boards for months before though. And I personally don't remember the influx of ******** newbies... So, feh...

 

[Jimmy-San]

Devilhulk, please. I didn't say you claimed Hulk beyond Celestials and Galactus. I said you claimed he beats anyone less powerful than Galactus more often than not. And you have. You've included guys like Odin and Thanos as beings you consider below The Hulk in Marvel, so don't pretend you only give him Herald-level power or a bit above. And Hulk vs. Darkseid was not the subject.


BTW, Jon, PAD just made a playful poke at ASM#382. He didn't retcon it. Samson's general comment of a crazy dream involving Spidey and Hulk (without specifically mentioning the events of said ASM) doesn't change the fact that the arc lead directly into Spidey's next storyline, and a few issues later, as Shuruku mentioned at Edge, Spidey recalled the Hulk/Samson incident. Was Samson also dreaming up that arc's involvement of The Jury that lead directly into the next arc, as well as Spidey's own reference to it?


Of course, that wasn't a Spidey win, and was in fact a win for the gamma-virus Hulk (though Spidey pulled some good moves before losing), but that's beside the point.


I think, BTW, it can be argued Spidey won in ASM Annual#3. He had The Hulk beaten for a moment, albeit due to somewhate exenuating circumstances helping him out. The Hulk recovered quickly, but there was a moment where he was completely at Spidey's mercy, and Pete could well have outright KOed him and dragged him back to The Avengers, except he found it morally wrong. I consider that to be a Spidey win, in the same sense as I consider ASM#120 to be a Hulk win. Neither was KOed, and both quickly recovered, but there was a moment in each case where one was at the other's mercy. The main difference is Hulk's win was by sheer virtue of his power, whereas Spidey's win was largely influenced by luck.


Of course, I'd agree Hulk beats Spidey 9/10.


-Jimmy

 

[X]

Hey Jimmy, ever see that Marvel Fanfare fight where Peter beats The Hulk by coughing in his face?

 

[Jonathanos]

BTW, Jon, PAD just made a playful poke at ASM#382. He didn't retcon it. Samson's general comment of a crazy dream involving Spidey and Hulk (without specifically mentioning the events of said ASM) doesn't change the fact that the arc lead directly into Spidey's next storyline, and a few issues later, as Shuruku mentioned at Edge, Spidey recalled the Hulk/Samson incident. Was Samson also dreaming up that arc's involvement of The Jury that lead directly into the next arc, as well as Spidey's own reference to it?

It wasn't a playful poke. Someone later asked PAD about it and he said that the story just made no sense given the Hulk's status quo and the time so he "made it go away."

PAD's right: with the Hulk being an international criminal, he wouldn't be booking a commercial flight. Besides which, it's not like he didn't have the Pantheon to provide a (faster and more convenient) way home from Loch Ness.

Blame Nightmare is all I can say.

 

[Jonathanos]

Because the entire story in ASM turned on the notion that the Hulk was flying around to various places on commercial airlines and using commerical airports. This at the time when he was running the Pantheon, had access to their worldwide organization including a variety of air vehicles, and was wanted by SHIELD for criminal actions. The notion that he'd whip out a passport and hop a TWA flight at all, much less unmolested by government agencies, was ridiculous. I hated it. It made no sense. So I made it go away.

http://peterdavid.malibulist.com/archives/000870.html

 

[Jimmy-San]

It may have been his intention for it to be a retcon, but the actual scene is rather insufficient, IMO, to explain away Spider-Man's own reference to it, and the other things in the issue we know to be real events. I have a rule, personally, that I don't take "writer intent" as being absolutely canon, unless there's something in the issues that allows for it. I guess the Nightmare thing in Tempest Fugit could set it all right with PAD's intent, but I don't think it's really "right" to write the story off until there's definitive on-panel evidence to explain it away. If PAD, say, showed the Spidey/Hulk/Samson story in like a bubble in one of Nightmare's dream thingies, I think it could officially be deemed an on-panel retcon. As it stands, regardless of PAD's intention, IMO what's on-panel is insufficient for it to be deemed a "true" retcon.


And no, X, I never caught that. Been looking for it, though. The few Marvel Fanfare issues I own have been good, but it's hard to find some of the more talked about issues of the series at shops. I may eventually look for it on e-bay when I have the time or cash.


-Jimmy

 

[Jonathanos]

So how'd Hulk get on a commercial airline without hassle?

By that point, he'd invaded a foreign country and overthrown its government and kidnapped a foreign diplomat.

Micheline f***ed up. Badly. Nightmare gives an out for all parties without disrupting continuity.

 

[Jonathanos]

Oh, and I have the Fanfare issue. Hulk is infected by an alien parasite and Spidey kills it by coughing his flu virus on it. Hulk then passes out.

 

[Jimmy-San]

I'm not saying Michelinie didn't mess up, but the point is there's obvious things linking the story to Spidey's continuity that aren't explained away by "Oh, it was all just Doc Samson's dream".


Now, Nightmare is indeed a good out, and I think, as a reader, say, we could assume it works that way, OR in fact, we could assume it really was The Pantheon, and the events are real, except Samson imagined the parts of The Hulk's lines that he'd used a commerical airliner ... Y'know, Nightmare world meshing with our own.


I'm just saying that, on message boards, I beleive the "I had a weird dream" scene is insufficient to write off the versus-relevent parts of the story, given the scenes in the story that are obviously canon to Spidey's own continuity.


-Jimmy

 

[Jonathanos]

The problem with that is, Samson is aware of it being a dream. If Nightmare had simply screwed with Samson's perceptions, he wouldn't think of it as a dream.

Nightmare can manipulate different people in the same dream scenarios. So if Spidey remembers the fight, he could have been manipulated as well.

What's disrupted by the fight scene not occurring? Aunt May hiring the P.I. and Mary Jane's acting scene aren't affected and that's the only things I can think of that happened. The Jury was only mentioned (indirectly) at the end of the story and it had nothing to do with the Hulk/Spidey/Samson fight.

 

[Arach Knight]

-Hulk's strength is perhaps cosmic level in the least. In Secret Wars he supported the weight of a 150 billion ton mountain while calm (though Reed Richards was pissing him off so that he could continue ot support it).

-Hulk's over all power as a creature, is amazing, but I wouldn't be sure where to place him. I have a comic where even Doc Samson knocks out the Hulk with a single punch to the jaw (only because the Hulk thinks that Doc Samson isn't real at the moment).

-The Hulk would never beat the flash, just like he'd never beat any character that is capable of phasing (J'onn Jonz, Kitty Pyrde, Barry Allen & Wally West etc etc). If the Flash were really evil, he would just phase his hand through Hulk's chest and crush his heart. Or to be comical, he could leave a chopstick in all of the Hulk's major organs. On a basis of speed...the Flash is the fastest (and most ridulous) speester character. He is one with the speed force and is faster than light itself. Hulk has sufficent strength to kill Wally in one blow, without trying...however, he won't ever land that much needed blow.

 

[Jimmy-San]

I was mainly thinking of the Jury thing. And it's not like certain people haven't known they were affected by Nightmare or been in his dimension before. Spidey himself comes to mind (WOS#6). Samson could have, for instance, gone to sleep later, and Nightmare just blended the event with his dreams, and gave him false memory. Could have simply been to get Samson off The Hulk's case, leaving his plans later in Tempest Fugit unhindered, by erasing an event that had, at the time, left him more determined to "help" Banner.

But that's speculation regardless (though fun speculation), given that Nightmare was never mentioned by Samson or anyone else.


-Jimmy

 

[Jonathanos]

But what is affected by the loss of the fight? All of the other scenes-- May hiring the PI, MJ losing her on-screen appearance, and the Jury set-up-- could play out as shown without the fight.

In Hulk, Samson was, in fact, ON the Hulk's case very heavily because the Hulk kept skipping out of their sessions. And just when did Samson get the Pantheon's contact info? Supposedly the Pantheon told Samson where to find Hulk. Samson didn't actually interact with a Pantheon member until later.

There's so many holes in the story it's just sad that it ever got approved as written.

 

[Jimmy-San]

I'm not entirely up on the Hulk continuity of the time, but I think there could be a way to explain away the inconsistencies without chucking the story out wholesale. But again, let me specify I'm speaking as a reader. As for what's "official", until we see Nightmare, I think we basically have a story that's clearly in-continuity due to later reference, with a scene intended to retcon it, but failing to truly do so. That being said, in the realm of reader speculation, yeah we could assume the Nightmare thing you propose off-panel, but I personally just thought it was a pretty entertaining story, setting aside the continuity errors. I'd prefer to speculate in a way that would find an alterior way to put both together without throwing away the gamma virus story entirely.


Oh, and X, Zauriel in JLA/Teen Titans overpowered and owned Bumblebee and Earth Angel Supergirl (the version that somehow beat Despero) at the same time. I'm unaware of where exactly his power has been defined elsewhere, but I was going by that.


-Jimmy

 

[X]

Oh, and I have the Fanfare issue. Hulk is infected by an alien parasite and Spidey kills it by coughing his flu virus on it. Hulk then passes out.

That was a good comic. Glad to know someone else knows about it too.

Oh, and X, Zauriel in JLA/Teen Titans overpowered and owned Bumblebee and Earth Angel Supergirl (the version that somehow beat Despero) at the same time. I'm unaware of where exactly his power has been defined elsewhere, but I was going by that.

-Jimmy

Hmm, didn't know about that. Pretty impressive.

I retract my statement. Still, Zauriel never did anything even remotely impressive in Morrisonn's JLA.

 

[Franklin Richards]

All I know is that the Thing goes one on one with the Hulk all the time. Win or lose he still takes him on solo and is not a punk. Does that elevate the Thing's status or lower the Hulks?

 

[X]

Neither.

It speaks highly of The Thing's willpower and toughness. Considering he's taken beatings from Gladiator, Terrax, The Champion, and The Surfer, we can gather that he's not exactly a lightweight.

 

[Franklin Richards]

I like the sound of that.

 

[Jonathanos]

That was a good comic. Glad to know someone else knows about it too.

And who'd ever expect me to know about Hulk appearances.

 

[X]

I like the sound of that.

I'm glad.

And who'd ever expect me to know about Hulk appearances.

Me...?

Maybe...