Wolfman-The Offical Thread

[Brian Braddock]

Weaving was freaking excellent in the movie. The clincher for me was the scene in the pub when he was explaining why he wasnt out looking for the murderer.

His voice and his mannerisms were just a joy to watch, ending with probably the best delivery of the line 'a pint of bitter, please' ever to be committed to film.

 

[Darth Elektra]

I think its obvious everyone seems to have the same problems with the movie, I'm just hoping the 17 mins being inserted back into the movie for DVD/BD make the difference from an okay movie to a good one.

17 mins is a lot for a movie these days.

here's hoping the 17 minutes is used to flesh out the characters rather than adding more gore and effects.

I agree! Hopefully the Johnson cut of the film will be better!

 

[Figs]

Weaving was freaking excellent in the movie. The clincher for me was the scene in the pub when he was explaining why he wasnt out looking for the murderer.

His voice and his mannerisms were just a joy to watch, ending with probably the best delivery of the line 'a pint of bitter, please' ever to be committed to film.

Honestly, that was one of my favorite scenes. Also have to agree with how great it was when he asks for his drink a second time. I'm a huge Benicio Del Toro fan but Weaving was one of the better parts of the film next to Del Toro actually as the Wolfman in makeup.

 

[블라스]

I think its obvious everyone seems to have the same problems with the movie, I'm just hoping the 17 mins being inserted back into the movie for DVD/BD make the difference from an okay movie to a good one.

17 mins is a lot for a movie these days.

Hopefully some of that will be used to fix the "Last week, on Alias" recap feel the first 30-40 minutes had.

 

[bestever23]

I liked the movie alot, if 17 minutes more is on the blu ray, I'd be a happy customer

 

[Matt]

I think its obvious everyone seems to have the same problems with the movie, I'm just hoping the 17 mins being inserted back into the movie for DVD/BD make the difference from an okay movie to a good one.

17 mins is a lot for a movie these days.

I can't help but feel de ja vu when I hear about the 17 minutes. Terminator Salvation, anyone? Remember the supposed cut footage that would apparently save the film? Directors who know their movies have shortcomings always seem to fall back on that during press junkets. "Well, I know its not great but the studio made me cut X amount of footage." Johnston has done some good early work, but everything of the past ten years or so has been terrible. I can't help but feel he has lost his edge and is sinking to the level of directors like McG.

 

[Matt]

I agree. The Wolf Man is my absolute favorite of the Universal horrors. Though not the most polished or clever, it was just a really good story that was told very well by a superb cast and, for the day, amazing make-up effects. I love Dracula, I love Whale's Frankensteins (especially Bride), but Wolfie takes the taco. And why they couldn't just expand and broaden the original story, which works amazingly well, is somewhat unknown.

I understand that it was Andrew Kevin Walker's idea to bring in big pappa werewolf and turn it Oedipal. Apparently Benicio, who got the ball rolling on this film because he admires Chaney so much went with it. My guess is he felt they needed a twist to make it fresh and Walker completely reworked (or some would say bastardized) the Sleepy Hollow tale and that movie turned out awesome. The trick though is that movie was in the hands of Tim Burton who took an average script and made it something supremely entertaining. Even if the studio had given him more pre-production prep time and not cut out 17 minutes of character development, I still think we can agree Joe Johnston was never going to deliver something as visionary as Tim Burton.




Huh. I had the opposite reaction. I thought the set-up in the first 30-45 minutes was rushed. I think that is the bulk of where the studio re-edited it. It feels very bare bones and breathless. I thought the movie needed a gradual pace. Not counting the Oedipal stuff, I think the movie finds its rhythm after he first transforms as those sequences (the woods attack of the hunters and the rampage through London) are easily the highlights of the film.

I didn't. The only character that I feel really needed further developed was Blunt, and maybe Hopkins, though if they didn't take the twist of making him crazed wolf-father, the set up of a loney old man would've worked just fine. Especially if they went with the original film's ending and had father kill son and effectively end his blood line. If they did this, Hopkins would've had fine, albeit subtle development. Instead they took the character and did a total 180, and I think that is why he feels under developed. All the development early on such as him defending his son (which was a great scene imo), was undone by the sudden character change.

As for Ang Lee's Hulk. Nice. I def. see it. But I have to say, while Lee made a more emotionally mature film and as lame as Sir John turning into a werewolf was, it was still better than giant Hulk Poodles or the Giant Bubble Daddy at the end of Hulk. I think I cringed a bit when Sir John was a werewolf. I burst out laughing at the end of Ang Lee's Hulk when it became jolly green giant vs. the bubble.

Oh, I definitely agree there. I'd rather watch Sir John vs Wolfman than Hulk vs Absorbing Dad any day.

You see I'm going to have to disagree here. Not on the first point, I agree the movie is its strongest in the asylum sequence. From the first shot of Lawrence strapped to that torture device (waterboarding reference?) to the Wolfman escaping Weaving after the bloodbath was pure gothic horror bliss and worthy of the ticket price.

But turning it into a psychological horror where you're not sure if Lawrence is a werewolf or a nutjob a la Val Lewton's Cat People, I strongly oppose. I know that was how Sodimak originally wrote it in 1940 or '41, but the legacy and icongraphy of the Wolfman is that it is about a poor bastard who turns into...well a wolfman. I'm all for some psychological horror of "Is this real or not" and expect that from Scorsese's adaptation of the Shutter Island Lehane book that dealt with this next week. If you're adapting The Wolf Man though, I want a super cool looking monster wreaking havoc. This film strayed enough from the original's plot, this would be tinkering with the core conept. Longer scenes in the nuthouse on the DVD? Yes. Val Lewton's Wolf Person? Not a fan.

Like I said, I feel like the uncertainty should've been done for the first 2/3s of the movie to create a sense of tension. Until he escapes from the asylum, that's when we could've learned for certain. Then the final act could've been pure Wolfman greatness. If you had a good build up such as a Cat People-esque subplot, I feel like the climax would've been that much stronger.

I think it may have had more to do with editing or direction. He wanted to be Chaney and was off the mark. Either a lot of his performance is on the cutting room floor (possible) or Johnston didn't know how to reign him in for a more charismatic turn.

Maybe TS has me jaded, but I tend to think the latter.

 

[DACrowe]

I can't help but feel de ja vu when I hear about the 17 minutes. Terminator Salvation, anyone? Remember the supposed cut footage that would apparently save the film? Directors who know their movies have shortcomings always seem to fall back on that during press junkets. "Well, I know its not great but the studio made me cut X amount of footage." Johnston has done some good early work, but everything of the past ten years or so has been terrible. I can't help but feel he has lost his edge and is sinking to the level of directors like McG.

II see what you're saying. But TS just felt like a hollow affair. While it had cool special effects it never really felt alive once to me. There are moments of pure awesomeness in Wolfman. So, I'd like to think a more nuanced pace would just let the tragedy sink in more on Lawrence and Gwen. Just not their love, but just more of Lawrence's angst that was Chaney's speciality that we never got to see in the remake because the pace was boom-boom-boom.

I just never felt anything memorable to TS. Not cinematography, atmosphere, nothing. And it was quite clear that Bale was picking up a paycheck and Worthington was trying to build his clout. Neither seemed to have any passion for their character. I honestly feel though slightly off-the-mark, Del Toro loved playing the Wolfman (especially in the lunar moments) and Blunt and Weaving, with little to work with, were quit entertaining to watch.

 

[Doctor Jones]

If Johnston is able to deliver a character driven film such as October Sky, he can deliver on the character development with this film. I saw a good film somewhere. With some editing out the almost comical lines and the reinsertion of those 17 minutes, I think the film can be a solid werewolf film.

 

[DACrowe]

I didn't. The only character that I feel really needed further developed was Blunt, and maybe Hopkins, though if they didn't take the twist of making him crazed wolf-father, the set up of a loney old man would've worked just fine. Especially if they went with the original film's ending and had father kill son and effectively end his blood line. If they did this, Hopkins would've had fine, albeit subtle development. Instead they took the character and did a total 180, and I think that is why he feels under developed. All the development early on such as him defending his son (which was a great scene imo), was undone by the sudden character change.

As I said in my other post, it is more about pacing for me. There is no room for the film to really breathe other than in Lawrence's first two transformations. The third act moves fine, because that is how the third act should move. But before Lawrence is attacked, there is a scene of him, Gwen and Sir John at dinner. Moments like that just establish the guy so the audience may be sadder when he is dead. I'd also like to think scenes are expanded so we really get into his eyes and soul. This is just speculation. But we never really had a moment where Lawrence has to face his monstrosity and I feel that scenes like where he is looking in the mirror or wakes up under the Tower Bridge may have had more there that could have let him (and the audience) pause for a moment about his tragic fate. Thus making his death more meaningful, like in the original. The love story needed some more air as well, imo.

Sir John? I see what you're saying. Hopkins was just having a good ol' hammy time and I would be satisfied with what we got, though his big reveal should (again) have not been rushed through. I don't know if it was actually performed that way, but it felt like he was speed-reading through his story. I would have liked a little bit of reflection there. As for him being bad? Well again, I too prefer the original story where the proud father ends his bloodline and kills his last son. Making it a little bit like Curse of the Werewolf (1960) as you say, where he knows it is his son would have worked with this interpretation and he did it as an act of love. But he was really ambiguous for the first half of the movie. Sure he seemed glad to see his son again and protected him in one of the better scenes of the movie. But he always seemed to have an ulterior motive. I don't think he wanted to kill his son until his son came to kill him at the end. He wanted his son to embrace the curse as he had.

But if you want another answer, he also was interested in Gwen, at least subconsciously as she looked like his wife, presumably why both Talbot boys liked her (she resembled the mother). So the end fight with the mother painting and chasing Gwen can be a reversed Oedipus thing for you there.

Like I said, I feel like the uncertainty should've been done for the first 2/3s of the movie to create a sense of tension. Until he escapes from the asylum, that's when we could've learned for certain. Then the final act could've been pure Wolfman greatness. If you had a good build up such as a Cat People-esque subplot, I feel like the climax would've been that much stronger.

I respectfully disagree. IMO the audience should always know there is a werewolf or two around. I love Cat People, but not for Wolfman. I don't want to wait until the third act to see the Wolfman. Putting it off until the second act, yes. But like the original, he should transform and do grisly deeds to a cheerful audience. That was one of the reasons I didn't care for Hammer's Werewolf film...you don't see him until the end. With the Wolfman, the second act should follow the original's and have him transform and go on a rampage. I'm a traditionalist.

Maybe TS has me jaded, but I tend to think the latter.

I'd agree. But again, I find all the actors (except maybe Hopkins) seemed to be enjoying the movie. And Wolfman had some lovingly good cinematography, make-up and sequences. TS was a chore to watch and for everyone involved it seemed. BTW, as I never saw it, how was the extended version of TS?

 

[Darth Elektra]

So for those who read the very original script that Andrew wrote that had the Wolfman fighting an Alligator. How was it done and would it have worked?

 

[Doctor Jones]

Does anyone know the scenes that were cut from the film?

 

[Kurosawa]

I can't help but feel de ja vu when I hear about the 17 minutes. Terminator Salvation, anyone? Remember the supposed cut footage that would apparently save the film? Directors who know their movies have shortcomings always seem to fall back on that during press junkets. "Well, I know its not great but the studio made me cut X amount of footage." Johnston has done some good early work, but everything of the past ten years or so has been terrible. I can't help but feel he has lost his edge and is sinking to the level of directors like McG.

Daredevil had that same issue too, although most people feel the cuts did legitimately mar it.

I just don't think Johnston is a very good choice for horror. Hopefully he's okay for Cap.

 

[CrimsonMist]

If Johnston is able to deliver a character driven film such as October Sky, he can deliver on the character development with this film. I saw a good film somewhere. With some editing out the almost comical lines and the reinsertion of those 17 minutes, I think the film can be a solid werewolf film.

Honestly? Even if those 17 minutes are reinserted and make it a more solid film, it just just be a mostly solid Werewolf film that falls apart at the end due to a forced twist and a cheesy werewolf battle.

What bugged me and really marred the film for me is the twist with Abberline. In Blackmoor at the end, Abberline attacks The Wolfman with a spear. Rather than rip him apart for getting in his way like he did with EVERYONE ELSE, The Wolfman merely bites him in the arm to get Abberline out of the way just so he can go after Gwen. Abberline should have been dead by the end of that film. Like i said in my previous post: Lawrence Talbot is the Wolfman. If the Wolfman is not Lawrence Talbot in any other movie, it's a mistake.

The werewolf battle felt too damn choreographed to be effective. And the shot of Papa Wolf ripping his shirt off ala Hulk Hogan? Unintentionally hilarious, made even more so by the fact that they only did it so you can tell whose who.

I'm seeing the film again in about 15 minutes, though. We'll see how it plays out a second time.

anyways, I haven't seen CHEZ here since the Thursday night before the film came out. I hope he wasn't so disappointed that he put a silver bullet through his head

 

[Abraham]

One thing I did really like about the film was that Hopkins character - Sir John - was basically the "Werewolf of London" (1935) in terms of accepting and relishing being the wolf man, as well as his origin being the same. I thought it was a nice touch.

 

[SurfDUI]

That flick was HARD. 9/10

First my alltime monster flim top 5 is

Spoiler

1. Bram Stokers Dracula 10/10
2. American wwolf in London. 10/10
3. Interview with the Vampire 10/10
4. The Invisible Man (1933) 8/10
5. The Wolfman 9/10
Wolf/Howling/Brhd of the Wolf...etc.

The ONLY beef was 1- the pacing was like how much time has passed?! coulda been fixed easy with some gothic date graphics, and wouldn't have broke away from the theme of the film

2-Those DAMNED repeating jumpcuts!! After the 6th one I was like arightman! Damn, I'm looking for them now.

Past that it was EVERYTHING I would ask from a period movie called 'THE WOLFMAN'. It felt like a universal film with Gore and visually it was costumed and set'd beautifully.

As far as emotional depth goes...I don't need tourted broken love ina movie about a werewolf. This is the first Emily Blunt movie I've seen, but she was very good...convincing.Their relationship was appropriatly under the surface (don't forget the brother), and ended so money/so movie. The original Wolfman had its flaws to, but that movie was so long ago it might as well be a book! This was new gen wolfman with none of the new gen B.s.

...ANTHONY...muthafreakinHopkins ownwd that ****!!. He played brevity, comic relief and the dude you love to hate...that speech in Lawrence's cell @ the Asylum was God knows what he was doin as a wolf out there lol

Spoiler

HE DESERVED A BETTER DEATH

RICK Baker is one of the reasons I love monsters- He did create a Wolf-man, hunched and imposing, snarling...freakin makeup!!

All the supporting cast...they all had this Victorian, superstitios look about them. The Preachers face and expressions, Lawrence's psych doctor/ torturer, Frakin HUGO ( I wish I saw more of him in movies,) the townsfolk, the gypsies!! For a popcorn movie 5/5 as a monster mash classic 9/10. Luved it.

 

[Duneboy]

Saw the flick on valentines day w/ my girlfriend. It was real good just wish it had a longer running time. I was more appaled by the outrageous prices movie theatres are charging these days.

 

[El Payaso]

I just saw it.

An entertaining disappoinment it was. The pace was possibly the only actual good thing about it, and the transformations (really, can any director make a decent tranformation for a Hulk movie now?). The acting was bland and I couldn't feel for anyone in here, Lawrence, Gwen, you name it. Hopkins is a delight to watch but his character was a dispar mix of oh-so-strange and oh-so-evil strikes, but in the end it was just an inconsistent character made out of wannabe shocking/intriguing moments.

And for my life I couldn't see how or why Lawrence and Gwen fell in love. Another last minute twist to try to make an effect on the audience.

Oh, and how many times can you put a sudden loud noise to scare the audience just to make them realize it was a false alarm so they can relax so another sudden loud noise can be put there but this time is a real danger? It got old after the first time (in fact it got old decades before this movie was even made).

In the end it was the modern Hollywood version of a classic. I can't but be very thankful that they left out the mandatory amount of idiotic jokes that formula demands though.

2/5

 

[Silver Knight]

How did this do at the box office?

 

[SurfDUI]

I can't but be very thankful that they left out the mandatory amount of idiotic jokes that formula demands though.

2/5

well...that the makeup and the transformations @ least make it 3/5 don't it?

 

[Darth Elektra]

Honestly? Even if those 17 minutes are reinserted and make it a more solid film, it just just be a mostly solid Werewolf film that falls apart at the end due to a forced twist and a cheesy werewolf battle.

What bugged me and really marred the film for me is the twist with Abberline. In Blackmoor at the end, Abberline attacks The Wolfman with a spear. Rather than rip him apart for getting in his way like he did with EVERYONE ELSE, The Wolfman merely bites him in the arm to get Abberline out of the way just so he can go after Gwen. Abberline should have been dead by the end of that film. Like i said in my previous post: Lawrence Talbot is the Wolfman. If the Wolfman is not Lawrence Talbot in any other movie, it's a mistake.

The werewolf battle felt too damn choreographed to be effective. And the shot of Papa Wolf ripping his shirt off ala Hulk Hogan? Unintentionally hilarious, made even more so by the fact that they only did it so you can tell whose who.

I agree.

 

[Doctor Jones]

Honestly? Even if those 17 minutes are reinserted and make it a more solid film, it just just be a mostly solid Werewolf film that falls apart at the end due to a forced twist and a cheesy werewolf battle.

What bugged me and really marred the film for me is the twist with Abberline. In Blackmoor at the end, Abberline attacks The Wolfman with a spear. Rather than rip him apart for getting in his way like he did with EVERYONE ELSE, The Wolfman merely bites him in the arm to get Abberline out of the way just so he can go after Gwen. Abberline should have been dead by the end of that film. Like i said in my previous post: Lawrence Talbot is the Wolfman. If the Wolfman is not Lawrence Talbot in any other movie, it's a mistake.

The werewolf battle felt too damn choreographed to be effective. And the shot of Papa Wolf ripping his shirt off ala Hulk Hogan? Unintentionally hilarious, made even more so by the fact that they only did it so you can tell whose who.

I'm seeing the film again in about 15 minutes, though. We'll see how it plays out a second time.

anyways, I haven't seen CHEZ here since the Thursday night before the film came out. I hope he wasn't so disappointed that he put a silver bullet through his head

Oh, I didn't like that either. I don't think anything could have saved that part. I think it would be good, but still a very flawed werewolf film.

I'm glad I wasn't the only one who saw papa wolf tearing off his shirt like a wrestler as comical. I mean I almost laughed at that. He was just like, "Bring it on!"

Yeah, it would have been best if he wasn't a werwolf at all. It would have been much more tragic if he killed his son himself.

 

[xwolverine2]

oh dear just saw it...

even with my low expectations from all the negative reviews... it still was awful
barely had any redeeming qualities.

this movie was the opposite of percy jackson.. great acting but not entertaining.
both had these extremely predictable plots too.

all the cg shots of the wolfman and him transforming was awesome, but those inbetween shots of him in a nasty cheap looking halloween suit had me squinching and hoping they'd cut to something else quickly. I know that the classic design is what they were going for but it just didnt work. I was hoping they'd use shadows or something to make it work but no. Alot of people in my theater were laughing at the wolfman lol

why did universal even bother?

5 out of 10... bleh, and no rewatchability factor.

shame on you joe johnston

 

[spider-neil]

I can't help but feel de ja vu when I hear about the 17 minutes. Terminator Salvation, anyone? Remember the supposed cut footage that would apparently save the film? Directors who know their movies have shortcomings always seem to fall back on that during press junkets. "Well, I know its not great but the studio made me cut X amount of footage." Johnston has done some good early work, but everything of the past ten years or so has been terrible. I can't help but feel he has lost his edge and is sinking to the level of directors like McG.

to be fair the extra minutes inserted in daredevil really DOES make it a better movie. the extra minutes in the abyss actually makes the finale make sense. so extended aditions do help sometimes.

 

[Figs]

oh dear just saw it...

even with my low expectations from all the negative reviews... it still was awful
barely had any redeeming qualities.

this movie was the opposite of percy jackson.. great acting but not entertaining.
both had these extremely predictable plots too.

all the cg shots of the wolfman and him transforming was awesome, but those inbetween shots of him in a nasty cheap looking halloween suit had me squinching and hoping they'd cut to something else quickly. I know that the classic design is what they were going for but it just didnt work. I was hoping they'd use shadows or something to make it work but no. Alot of people in my theater were laughing at the wolfman lol

why did universal even bother?

5 out of 10... bleh, and no rewatchability factor.

shame on you joe johnston

Rick Baker's effects and the costume were fine and no, it looked nothing like a nasty cheap halloween suit. Do you really have that bad of eye sight?