All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - - - - Part 90

[souperman]

Cameron isnt doing anyone else's stuff

I know...he's too busy making Avatar 2-3-4-5-6-7-8....

 

[Lighthouse]

And in the position he's in, he should do whatever he wants. Why would he ever want to do an adaptation where he'll have restrictions of what he can or cannot do with a property, when he can total freedom with his own?

 

[UrNuts2]

A priest, Father Barron, talking about The Man of Steel. Deep stuff

[YT]KjyOUC_dWsU[/YT]

yup, great stuff .. humbling clarity

 

[ThreadPool]

I have a question: CBR posted an opinion article over MOS leading into both Justice League and a DC Film Universe, and according to the author, and using the MCU as an example, so far MOS is presenting a bleak DCU. Would you guys agree?

The article can be found here:
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=46374

The comparison pictures of living in a city that was just attacked by an alien terraforming ship and had Superman and Zod battling against... The end of Captain America, when Rogers had just been thawed out.

Brilliant, internet journalism.

 

[dark_b]

That's a good idea. I think it'd play out nicely, with Lex helping Clark and actually trying to "friends" with him. Maybe even offer Clark to help him fix the world. With Clark's powers, and Lex's resources, they could change the world. Until of course we discover Lex's true intentions.

this has some potential.

maybe have Lex build a kryptonian room or building from the ship that crashed in the city. 6 months plus millions plus his intelligence and i think Lex could create kryptonian atmosphere on Earth in a controled environment. the kryptonian atmosphere on Earth could be similar to kryptonite. he gets supermans trust and then maybe in the second act he traps him. Lois and Jenny save him of course at the start of third act.

the second option is that Lex uses the Zod fight in MOS against Superman and destroys his image in the media. people start to hate him.

 

[Nathan]

this has some potential.

maybe have Lex build a kryptonian room or building from the ship that crashed in the city. 6 months plus millions plus his intelligence and i think Lex could create kryptonian atmosphere on Earth in a controled environment. the kryptonian atmosphere on Earth could be similar to kryptonite. he gets supermans trust and then maybe in the second act he traps him. Lois and Jenny save him of course at the start of third act.

Now we are really starting to get somewhere. I like the idea of months of preparation, spending millions and countless resources, acquiring Superman's trust, just to get him to a spot where he'll become weak and vulnerable. It's a plan you could only pull off once.

 

[PacificBoy]

Now we are really starting to get somewhere. I like the idea of months of preparation, spending millions and countless resources, acquiring Superman's trust, just to get him to a spot where he'll become weak and vulnerable. It's a plan you could only pull off once.

With MoS's setup, the sequel could follow similarly Spiderman 2's "hero or menace" theme. What more in in a social media-crazed world where newsfeeds and talking points are more heavily scrutinized than before.

 

[dark_b]

i just know one thing. after what happened in MOS and after all the kryptnian technology, writting the sequel should be easy. the writter should not have a hard time writting the basic outline or basic story. i dont know how you call this.

i have like 20 ideas just by thinking about the third act.

and writting the perfpect Lex Luthor and perfect character development in a life action movie? after MOS? piece of cake.

Goyer writte a bad Lex Luthor ............and i will hunt you.

 

[BH/HHH]

Has everyone seen whats on the extras for the Dark Knight Ultimate Collectors Edition.:

Christopher Nolan & Richard Donner: A Conversation - For the first time, Directors Christopher Nolan ("The Dark Knight Trilogy") and Richard Donner (Superman: The Movie) sit down to discuss the trials and triumphs involved in bringing the two most iconic superheroes of all time to the big screen, and how Superman influenced Nolan when developing Batman Begins.

Looking forward to that

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

With MoS's setup, the sequel could follow similarly Spiderman 2's "hero or menace" theme. What more in in a social media-crazed world where newsfeeds and talking points are more heavily scrutinized than before.

Yep. The only way a sequel can work is to "go smaller." And then have an epic 3RD film that's more comic-bookey in style.

I feel like MOS will be the TDKR of the new Superman, so hopefully MOS2 will be the Begins, and MOS3 will be the TDK of the trilogy. That would make it the BETTER trilogy in the long run than even the TDK films, with each film increasing in quality.

I guess I am dreaming too big

 

[BH/HHH]

Man of Steel II only needs to be smaller in terms of action but bigger in terms of story. I tell you something else actually you probably could have the level of action Man of Steel had but spread throughout the film as most of it was in the final hour.

 

[PacificBoy]

Yep. The only way a sequel can work is to "go smaller." And then have an epic 3RD film that's more comic-bookey in style.

I feel like MOS will be the TDKR of the new Superman, so hopefully MOS2 will be the Begins, and MOS3 will be the TDK of the trilogy. That would make it the BETTER trilogy in the long run than even the TDK films, with each film increasing in quality.

I guess I am dreaming too big

It well could; there's plenty of raw material to mine from MoS. I'm not a huge fan of MoS but with the right direction taken in the sequel, MoS could perhaps be looked back on more fondly by its critics or have its much discussed issues addressed.

 

[PacificBoy]

I tell you something else actually you probably could have the level of action Man of Steel had but spread throughout the film as most of it was in the final hour.

Very much agree. This would address the editing and pacing issue some had with MoS.

 

[Nathan]

For the sequel, I think I don't even need action on the same level as MOS. What we had here was a Planetary threat, with villains that were equal to Superman. MOSII should definitely be smaller in scale, and when we get to the action, hopefully they'll take it out of Metropolis. The city shouldn't get a 2nd trashing, like in the fight with Zod. Unless Lex has it all planned out, to show that Superman is a menace.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

Man of Steel II only needs to be smaller in terms of action but bigger in terms of story. I tell you something else actually you probably could have the level of action Man of Steel had but spread throughout the film as most of it was in the final hour.

Since we didn't get this great character driven movie with MOS (IMHO), I would want MOS2 to be the great character driven movie, with MOS3 being the great plot-driven movie that fully embraces the genre.

After MOS3 I want him to be in the Justice League, though I want a World's Finest before MOS3 for a bit of variety, and also to satisfy WB's demands for a rebooted Batman. Have a stinger AFTER World's Finest teasing Wonder Woman(and then have that be the next solo movie).

Then after MOS3 (assuming that WW didn't come between MOS2 and 3) do the Justice League movie.

 

[Rowsdower!]

I don't understand how people didn't find MOS character-driven. The core of the story is Kal-El discovering who he is, why he is, and what he has to do. I guess if you didn't feel they did a good job of that, that's one thing, but I still found it to be very much a character-driven movie.

 

[BH/HHH]

For the sequel, I think I don't even need action on the same level as MOS. What we had here was a Planetary threat, with villains that were equal to Superman. MOSII should definitely be smaller in scale, and when we get to the action, hopefully they'll take it out of Metropolis. The city shouldn't get a 2nd trashing, like in the fight with Zod. Unless Lex has it all planned out, to show that Superman is a menace.

Oh yeah there's no need Togo crazy and blow up buildings etc but you can have as much action in terms of length just more spread out. I do want to see Superman save a train or something in the sequel

Since we didn't get this great character driven movie with MOS (IMHO), I would want MOS2 to be the great character driven movie, with MOS3 being the great plot-driven movie that fully embraces the genre.

After MOS3 I want him to be in the Justice League, though I want a World's Finest before MOS3 for a bit of variety, and also to satisfy WB's demands for a rebooted Batman. Have a stinger AFTER World's Finest teasing Wonder Woman(and then have that be the next solo movie).

Then after MOS3 (assuming that WW didn't come between MOS2 and 3) do the Justice League movie.

I thought it was very character driven, it was just driven around Clark which it needed to be.

 

[PacificBoy]

Since we didn't get this great character driven movie with MOS (IMHO), I would want MOS2 to be the great character driven movie, with MOS3 being the great plot-driven movie that fully embraces the genre.

After MOS3 I want him to be in the Justice League, though I want a World's Finest before MOS3 for a bit of variety, and also to satisfy WB's demands for a rebooted Batman. Have a stinger AFTER World's Finest teasing Wonder Woman(and then have that be the next solo movie).

Then after MOS3 (assuming that WW didn't come between MOS2 and 3) do the Justice League movie.

I could dig this trilogy sequence. But I would make MoS3 the JL Year One movie, with other superheroes answering Supes' call to fend off some massive threat.

 

[BH/HHH]

I don't understand how people didn't find MOS character-driven. The core of the story is Kal-El discovering who he is, why he is, and what he has to do. I guess if you didn't feel they did a good job of that, that's one thing, but I still found it to be very much a character-driven movie.

Agreed as I said above it was focused around Clark/Kal El and it needed to be.

 

[Lighthouse]

I don't understand how people didn't find MOS character-driven. The core of the story is Kal-El discovering who he is, why he is, and what he has to do. I guess if you didn't feel they did a good job of that, that's one thing, but I still found it to be very much a character-driven movie.

That I think is the actual criticism when people say it's not character driven.

 

[UrNuts2]

Oh yeah there's no need Togo crazy and blow up buildings etc but you can have as much action in terms of length just more spread out. I do want to see Superman save a train or something in the sequel


some kick ass feats of strength would be great .. & show how physics play a role; ie he'd have to stop that train gently, otherwise he'd wreck it .. that blunt force has to be applied with some measure

 

[Rowsdower!]

Agreed as I said above it was focused around Clark/Kal El and it needed to be.

Yeah. One thing that I hate to see in superhero movies is when they get so focused on the villains and the side characters that it feels like the hero isn't the central focus. We saw it happen in ALL of the Burton/Schumacher Batman movies, we saw it in Superman Returns and we saw it a little bit in TDK.

I'm glad we didn't see that happen in MOS, at least I didn't feel that way. They kept the focus on the hero, where it belongs.

 

[Lighthouse]

That was my big problem with the Superman Returns as well. My problem with MOS is that I don't think the character driven moments have the impact they should. The pacing problems in the first act really kill some of the emotional moments. I realize this is not the case for everyone, but it did for me.

 

[ConnorKon-El]

I get what you are saying lighthouse. Some of the emotional moments didn't have the impact they could have had. I will say none of the moments were killed for me though.

 

[Lighthouse]

I know that Snyder can do a properly paced film, he's done it before. I think Goyer is just a really lousy screenwriter.