Arrow Arrow S3 E1 The Calm

[godisawesome]

I think one of the reasons why people ship those two together is because she was probably the first female character on the show that wasn't so "angst" filled and allowed Oliver's character to interact with someone that could bring out some natural comedic elements. Whether or not that justifies them being together is another thing of course.

Yeah,I agree.I don't really get the "thrill" people seem have by their interaction.It was cute when they first met and she'd say the wrong thing and everyone would laugh.But I can't see turning that into a successful relationship.

I think by and large most of their fans (probably a majority of women) like seeing the "average" girl getting the hot guy.The usual trope has the hero as the "nerd" in his civilian guise in this scenario,pining after the hot girl.(Spider-Man,now Flash,apparently.)

And these are exactly the reasons why Felicity became the de-facto-female-lead in Season 2.

Season One only really kicked into gear when Felicty was added to the Arrow cave as the comic force to Ollie and Dig's straight men (and when Bennett's Slade made the island scenes more focused and fleshed out). She brought a new perspective on Ollie scenes that forged the formula for Season Two's humor and thus also allowed the writers to have a gauge on which to measure and episode's threat: if Felicity's still cracking jokes and being "normal," the threat's not big. If she's serious, $#!+ just hit the fan.

And Felicity is probably a far more emphatic audience surrogate than Laurel will ever be for the show's current female demographic. Laurel seems almost like a parody of the archetype, with her "I'm a serious assertive female characterization with angst issues" portrayal, and that would be okay, but they kept on subverting that characterization by having her still love the guy who died cheating on her with her sister who also died, and by having her repeatedly being reduced to Damsel-In-Distress (some of her turns as that tired trope occurred with an almost casual indifference as to how or why). Then along comes Felicity, who's far closer to the Internet savvy and web-involved girls who actually do watch the shows, and she's got a good sense of humor and realistic(-ish) reactions to everything around her.

Laurel's mishandling by the writers is the biggest make or break thing about this season. If they can make all the mistakes they made about her disappear in exchange for a good character, they'll succeed, but they could botch this up, and the sad fact is they haven't shown all that much ability to course correct her without a character dying for her yet.

 

[Verick808]

Laurel's mishandling by the writers is the biggest make or break thing about this season. If they can make all the mistakes they made about her disappear in exchange for a good character, they'll succeed, but they could botch this up, and the sad fact is they haven't shown all that much ability to course correct her without a character dying for her yet.

That's kind of a comic thing though. Peter Parker himself screwed up and his uncle died for it. Batman lost his parents. Dick lost his parrents. Barry watched his mother die. Becoming a superhero pr a vigilante is an extremely action so the call to action generally has to be pretty extreme. Tommy's death was actually more for Ollie than it was Laurel. Transforming from a vigilante killer to a true hero is a large part of his story and honoring Tommy's death is the reason why he decided to change. He says so at the beginning of every episode. So at this point Sara has been the only character killed off for the sake of progressing Laurel's story.

I do agree that they absolutely have to get her character right this season though. No more whining or feeling sorry for herself, except for maybe next episode. Hopefully they will avoid a Ted Grant romance arc. It would just seem a little odd if she was taking time to flirt with her trainer when she's supposed to be focused on revenge, which is probably going to be the case.
I'm also hoping her version of Canary is a little more brutal. Canary is supposed to be one of the best martial artist in the DCU but she's more of a well oiled brawling machine than a LoA assassin type. Punching people in the face is probably a hobby for her.

 

[DrRocket]

Great episode! One of my personal favourites. I loved Roy in this episode with his flips an tricks. Hope to see more of that. Ray palmer was awesome, and I can see oliver has got spidey sense with how he sensed that rocket coming

That ENDING THO HAD ME LEGIT SHOOK, as soon as the guy said "hello Sara" and how his voice was I got chills and dreaded the worse and the BAM! But it didn't sink in for a while because I thought she hadn't died till the next day.


And now comes my crazy theory:
I think the killer is Tommy, what with them not showing the killer and the episode 4 description and Collin turning up at the NYCC comic panel with Amell and the voice being disguised.

Any who, glad my favourite tv show is back!

 

[The Guard]

See I'm not buying the "she was caught off-guard" part either. One of two things would have had to happen, given how that scene played out. Either:

-The killer would have had to draw an arrow, knock it, raise the bow, and then fire, all while she was looking right at him.

or

-He already had the bow in his hand with the arrow already knocked.

You're assuming the killer killed her with a normal bow and arrow.

Of course she had time to react. But human beings are fragile creatures, and occasionally, even with training, people get caught off guard or shocked into inaction. It really shouldn't be this much of a stretch to believe that could happen.

 

[Herolee10]

I think another big reason why people have a hard time warming up to Laurel is that they also have a hard time being able to respect her as well.

I mean, really, who would easily respect a character that would still have the hots for a guy that cheated on her with her own younger sister, which led to the latter's supposed death for 5 years and would run back to him without any qualms while leaving another guy (Tommy) that was actually decent and good to her in ways that Oliver wasn't?

Not to mention the fact that, in season 2, Laurel was blaming everyone for her issues and playing the "victim" card.

Laurel achieved more hate in 2 Seasons than the character of Lana Lang did in 4-5 Seasons worth.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Laurel just hasn't been a well-written character. It's not Katie's fault but, the writers for the most part just hasn't had any idea what to do with her for the most part.

I crapped on the writers a lot for not having no clue what to do with her in the first half of S2 to the point that she was dragging the show down. Outside the whole Blackmail thing, which was created and resolved in a ridiculous manner, she's been getting better. I think the big mistake they made with Laurel's character was waiting so long for Laurel to find out that Ollie was Green Arrow. It was like the writer had her standing around on the sideline scrambling to find her something to do and scraping the bottom of the barrel for her to get her to do something. They should have had her find out Ollie's identity. Also, they should have had used a good amount of her screentime to give to Isabel Rochev, who went missing for a good chunk of episodes.

 

[Seb]

At least Lana wasn't the canon endgame for the writers. I don't know about other people, but I really liked Lois in Smallville.

Also, Lana started out lame and actually developed some. Laurel just seems to alternate between meandering and spiralling because as a non-hero non-love interest in a CW show she has no real reason to get screen time beyond loyalty to a comic character that is usually a hundred times more interesting than her (at least, that's my experience of Dinah after reading all of the Pre-New 52 Birds of Prey comics).

PS. I don't think that people blame Cassidy for Laurel being lame. I think we all get that it's a scripting issue. (doesn't matter how well you can act if your writers give you nothing to work with. Cassidy pulled off the whiny time wasting character that the writers gave her perfectly)

 

[Human Torch]

At least Lana wasn't the canon endgame for the writers. I don't know about other people, but I really liked Lois in Smallville.

Also, Lana started out lame and actually developed some. Laurel just seems to alternate between meandering and spiralling because as a non-hero non-love interest in a CW show she has no real reason to get screen time beyond loyalty to a comic character that is usually a hundred times more interesting than her (at least, that's my experience of Dinah after reading all of the Pre-New 52 Birds of Prey comics).

PS. I don't think that people blame Cassidy for Laurel being lame. I think we all get that it's a scripting issue. (doesn't matter how well you can act if your writers give you nothing to work with. Cassidy pulled off the whiny time wasting character that the writers gave her perfectly)

Yeah,I never had a problem with Katie.When others were hating on her,I didn't see it as her fault the character was so bad.

 

[Herolee10]

Oh yeah, I never really had a issue with Katie; she exhibited way more personality and life in her role on Supernatural than mos of her time in Arrow, and that's mainly because (IMHO) she had better material to work with on that show.

Heck, for someone that is the female lead in the eyes of the CW, she sure as hell wasn't portrayed as such in the Second Season.

Just look at the Second Season's Main Poster of the cast...she was placed all the way in the far left corner of the poster and looked more like a villain than a "hero" in the making.

Fact of the matter is....Season 2 really damaged her character in front of a lot of people. The producers are really going to have to work out of their asses if they want to make her likable to a lot of people again.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

It's like I said, the writers should have been ashamed of themelves for being so neglectful and baffled about where to take Laurel.

 

[DJ_KiDDvIcIOUs]

Just caught the episode last night on my DVR. It was freaking awesome! They know what they are about and do a damn good job executing it. That ending threw me off, I was totally caught off guard. Did not expect that to happen so soon. I love the pace they set. Can't wait till next week

 

[dude stannis]

Of course they killed the wrong Lance sister (Then again, I will not be surprised if she's brought back via lazarus pit, her girlfriend is Ra's Al Ghul's daughter), besides the obvious annoyance of making Laurel Black Canary, we're now right back to emoville.

Amell is great in the role, but I was really liking how more fun Ollie was with his big grin in the Flash pilot and throughout the whole episode, much like the Green Arrow of the comics. Now we'll be back to broody sad Oliver again.

 

[Kar]

I personally think it was Thea or Komodo. Had to be someone she knew and didn't see this happening from. Thea would definitely be unexpected. Maybe Malcolm trained her to thinking Sara was a criminal and responsible for--I don't know, something that happened to her in Season 1/2.

If it wasn't for the death at the end the episode would have been a pretty basic premiere. The New Count <<<<<<

Loved the Roy and Ollie team up. Good to see Roy isn't up to par with the Arrow but I like how he can keep up. All in all the episode was average. But I'm looking forward to this season definitely.

 

[Loki882]

IDK, Thea may have gone with Merlyn. But I kind of have a hard time believing that she'd be willing to cold-bloodedly execute someone who she's BARELY interacted with THIS soon after she left. It'd take some damn good writing to make me buy that.

 

[Kar]

IDK, Thea may have gone with Merlyn. But I kind of have a hard time believing that she'd be willing to cold-bloodedly execute someone who she's BARELY interacted with THIS soon after she left. It'd take some damn good writing to make me buy that.

Maybe not. They managed to convince us that Slade wanted Ollie and his whole family dead for stealing his WCW.

Maybe Thea's been really broken these past 5 months.

 

[Loki882]

Yes... that's what happens when you are off guard. You don't guard. That's why it's called off guard.

Sometimes, we sort of deify fighting skills and forget that skills are still in the package of a human being, a human being who has emotions, who can be taken advantage of. If Ra's Al Ghul shows up in your hometown, and you know who he is, you have too much WTF in your head to go into defense mode for a second, if you're a human being instead of a fighting robot. Fighting robots don't have WTF moments. Fighting robots don't get caught off guard, not really. People do though.

I think to see this as "bad writing" or "not understandable" you'd have to believe that these people are fighting robots, whose fighting "programming" overrides any and every other thought no matter what, even though we saw Oliver off guard by Sara just moments ago, and she very well could have killed him if she had so desired. It's sad, to me, that this segment of the audience downplays the human aspects of these characters just because they're badasses. It's the human part that makes them interesting, being badasses just makes them fun.



Remember, Sara's death isn't all about Laurel, it's a plot thread that fires up for everyone. Laurel is the hardest hit, but little things like the LoA and this Arrow guy are going to be very much driven by it as well. Based on the Calm, they have her doing what she should have been doing the whole time, and based on her workout regiment, they have her doing what everyone expects from her... I don't think the mis-handling is going to be much more concern. It's tempting to see it as an exchange of the butt kicking Sara for the alcoholic Laurel, but the reality is both are part of a tapestry.

No, it's called common sense. Hey this person shows up unexpectedly to confront me, and they're armed. We're the only two people around, jeez I wonder if maybe I AM his/her target. Sorry, but I'm just not buying that scene and it's STILL an incredibly lame way to kill off such a cool character, disrespectful even. And so instead of dying to further ANOTHER character's story, she dies to further EVERYONE'S story BUT her own. Yeah, not only does that not make the fridging any better, it makes it WORSE!

 

[Loki882]

Maybe not. They managed to convince us that Slade wanted Ollie and his whole family dead for stealing his WCW.

Maybe Thea's been really broken these past 5 months.

Umm not really. I've seen A LOT of people who commented on how underwhelming/lame Slade's actual motivation was. The ONLY reason why they tolerated it at all was because Manu Bennett's performance was so good, and even then they wished that he had better motives for going all genocidally nuts.

 

[Kar]

Oh no I agree. I was one of the main ones that hated his whole motivation, but after a while it was just like "eh, whatever". I'm saying I can see the same happening for Thea, maybe.

I dunno, I just want it to be her. It being Komodo would just be anticlimactic to me. I feel like it's no reason to keeping his identity a secret. They could have shown him. Either way it wouldn't have been a big shocker at the identity, whereas with Thea (or even Malcolm or Ra's) it would've been like "oh ****!"

 

[Delwin]

I am surprised how weak was this episode - comparing to Season 1 and 2. Actually everything with exception of Ray Palmer introduction. Killing Sara so quickly and easily, "Olicity", HK scenes. It does not look good...

 

[Guy-on-Couch]

so excited for Arrow to be back....can't wait to see what happens...I was shocked with the ending but I suppose it was needed to pass the mantle onto Laurel.....

 

[Human Torch]

Of course they killed the wrong Lance sister (Then again, I will not be surprised if she's brought back via lazarus pit, her girlfriend is Ra's Al Ghul's daughter), besides the obvious annoyance of making Laurel Black Canary, we're now right back to emoville.

Amell is great in the role, but I was really liking how more fun Ollie was with his big grin in the Flash pilot and throughout the whole episode, much like the Green Arrow of the comics. Now we'll be back to broody sad Oliver again.

Agree with all of that.

It would be cool (and there would be justification for it) if Nyssa brought Sara back via Lazarus Pit.By then,Laurel would be BC,and Sara could take a new Identity.But I don't see it happening since:

A.They still won't want competition for Cassidy with another (potentially better)female hero kicking butt every week.

B.Supposedly,the scuttlebutt is they are resisting the "Fantastical" for Arrow and saving them for Flash

C. I'm still putting my money on Tommy's eventual revival.I seriously doubt they want to cheapen deaths to the extreme by having every character that died come back.One is probably the limit and it'll be Tommy.

 

[Arrowshieldfan]

the kill was done by the killer POV so we might see Sara point of view at some point

 

[Guy-on-Couch]

some people have said it in this thread and I agree...I'm going with Komodo being the killer.....

 

[Seb]

The problem with bringing Tommy back would be the resulting choice. Since he's a Merlyn, there is no way that he doesn't end up a villain, and there can only be one so they'd have to kill Barrowman (which we all know is impossible.)

I'll continue dreaming of Sara getting resurrected and my Birds of Prey spin off dream becoming reality.

(On a side note, I guess they will be doing a big flashback episode with Sara and Tommy and Moira and all the nostalgia at some point this season.)

 

[Mikelus]

No, it's called common sense. Hey this person shows up unexpectedly to confront me, and they're armed. We're the only two people around, jeez I wonder if maybe I AM his/her target. Sorry, but I'm just not buying that scene and it's STILL an incredibly lame way to kill off such a cool character, disrespectful even.

And common sense says that when you don't have all the proper facts, you stop judging in such a premature way. Besides, we got your point, how many times are you going to repeat it? Are you going to stop watching? No? Then good luck with the rest of the season.

On Thea being the killer, that would be atrocious for the character and silly if she was also the one who talked to Sara since it was a male voice. When Sara used the voice modifier in S2, she sounded female, so if they want to be consistent, then the killer should be a man, unless he just talked to Sara to distract her while his acolyte shot her. Anyway, the idea of your sister killing your ex-lover and the sister of your other former lover and friend would be too much, this is not Game of Thrones. And since Thea is Speedy, she's not supposed to be another psycho, they have plenty of those already.

Regarding Tommy, he is dead, he's only returning for some flashbacks. He died as a hero, there's no need to ruin the character as a villain just because some people can't let go.