Avengers the Initiative

Well, he was a skrull

3D Man killed Crusader last minute because he could see passed his disguise, but Crusader also had just killer the Yellowjacket skrull and saved the world
 
?? 3D Man is a dick because Crusader withheld the fact that he was a skrull
 
Yes. I'm sorry, but I wouldn't shot a person in the head if they just saved my planet. I'd kick him in the balls, giving him the chance to explain.
 
Yes. I'm sorry, but I wouldn't shot a person in the head if they just saved my planet. I'd kick him in the balls, giving him the chance to explain.

The Skrulls were sleeper cells. Most of them didnt know they were skrulls until they were activated. Thor Girl died saying "What's going on?" The situation as realistically as it gets would have played out that way unfortunately. Nick Fury took a shot at Ms Marvel without knowing for sure, and 3D actually new Crusader was a skrull.

I'm not saying he didnt **** up but I dont think hes a dick.
 
Last edited:
That's true, but the original Freedom Ring didn't understand how to use the Ring as well as Crusader understood how to use it. So maybe the Ring didn't save Freedom Ring cause, Freedom didn't will it to happen. Remember how Crusader was the one that got Freedom to walk again, Freedom didn't even realize he could do that until somebody else suggested it. Freedom didn't have the proper understanding and instict to proporly utilize the Ring. That's just the theory, not fact.
 
That's true, but the original Freedom Ring didn't understand how to use the Ring as well as Crusader understood how to use it. So maybe the Ring didn't save Freedom Ring cause, Freedom didn't will it to happen. Remember how Crusader was the one that got Freedom to walk again, Freedom didn't even realize he could do that until somebody else suggested it. Freedom didn't have the proper understanding and instict to proporly utilize the Ring. That's just the theory, not fact.
 
I'm thinking Crusaders still alive. Cause the end part showed him being beemed away. Also I think it's interesting to watch 3D man change from this noob, to a gritty war soldier. If you go back and read the secret invasion arc u can see how things change, at first he is grossed out by eating the skrull meat and he's moved on. Also is anyone going to be picking up the Skrull Krill Krew comic book? It's about how Ryder goes after all the cows.
 
But where's Riot?
Not sure, I'm sure we'll get an answer though. So did Moonstomp, Catwalk and other head die? Also did Whiz Kid die cause of that gas? They never confirmed any deaths it was quite annoying.
 
Reposting my review, with spoilers:

Dread said:
AVENGERS: THE INITIATIVE #19: November was a "skip month" for the core title, which meant that we got an annual. Or rather, a "special". The mighty Marvel strategy is to ship a random one-shot of most books that encounter a month where everyone needs 4 weeks to catch up. Sales wise, these one-shots usually sell worse than a regular issue would, but one supposes that 40k for a random "special" for November (versus about 50-60k for a typical regular issue) is better than nada. That special took place after SECRET INVASION and pretty much acted as an epilogue of sorts that ended the romance between Komodo and Hardball. It all but sacrificed Hardball as a rootable character for a stab at a twist ending. A shame.
In some ways, A:TI #19 feels like an obsolete title this month. It is a SI tie in, although SI is over and we know how it ended, and we even know the aftermath. Iron Man and the Initiative program take the fall for the invasion, and Osborn takes over everything. For much of the story, Slott & Gage, as well as Tolibao the artist (perhaps the 3rd artist of the SI arc) show us a few pages of the bunch of heroes pummeling various Skrulls to undo their doomsday plan to zap the planet (or at least a large chunk of it) into the Negative Zone out of spite. Basically, we get to see Skrull Dugan and Skrullowjacket bite it here.

But the crux of the issue is on Crusader, Kirkman's final creation in MARVEL TEAM UP who has grown quite a bit during this arc. As a former Skrull spy turned superhero (and Earth defender), naturally SECRET INVASION proved to be a good reason to flesh him out and explore his character, rather than just leaving him as "Freedom Ring's former mentor". Slott & Gage got a lot of mileage out of him and I actually grew to like him. He wasn't pefect; as paranoid about being discovered and mistrusted as he was noble and willing to defend his new home and allies. In the end, he saves the planet and the Initiative from Skrullojacket, and what is his reward? Getting his brains blown out by an overzealous 3-D Man, who discovered he didn't need his goggles to see through Skrull disguises (basically a version of SPACEBALLS' "Tha ring is BUBKISS! I found it in a Cracker Jack Box! Tha Schwartz is in You, Lonestar, it's in YOU!" only with 3-D Man). Now, one could argue that it was partly Crusader's fault for not telling anyone who he really was, but I don't blame him. In all honesty, Delroy was being overzealous. Skrull or not, the guy JUST TOOK OUT HIS DAMNED COMMANDER and saved the world. Didn't that at least warrent a pause to ask, "Hey, what the--" and so on? But maybe in a way it was a simple message about what Marvel Earth has become. It has become polarized, corrupt, paranoid, and with morals so gray that simple prejudices rule the day and acts of nobility are not as heralded as they once were (and they rarely were to begin with). At any rate, Crusader vanished with the ring, and is likely not dead. It would be a shame if he returned as a villain, but he would probably be a sympathetic one.

The new 3-D Man was a positive thing, and I liked seeing Delroy step up until that last sequence. Now all I can say is, I guess war gets everyone lost in bloodlust. Virtually every hero there was fine with slaughtering Skrulls without a second's hesitation. Desperate times and all that, but it matches the sort of sliding scale of morality the Initiative, at least as set up by Gyrich, Gauntlet, and Skrullowjacket. Kill the target first, never take prisoners, and if you get at all affected by killing someone, you're weak and need to hit the showers. Crusader's heroism at the end was all for nothing, and much like the ending of the special last month, that sort of hit me in the gut as overly bleak and depressing. Is space really the only place at Marvel that makes any sense?

That said, as usual, A:TI was chop full of the sort of cameos everyone likes, including Jocasta, who soon will be rejoining the Mighty Avengers. The art was solid for the most part, although I still miss Caselli on this title.

The next issue is the last for Slott as co-writer, where we get the big reveal for Mutant Zero, and I can't wait for that. I also can't wait to see where Gage takes things solo next year. Still a solid title, but it has become so bleak and sucked a lot of the fun and nobility out of a few characters that I might be starting to lose interest if there wasn't a big reveal ahead and a shift in the writing team coming up. A:TI is still a solid title with a lot of characters, but it could lighten up a little. Just enough where saving the world didn't earn you a slug in the back. Enough that it didn't almost earn the YOST & KYLE ON NEW X-MEN SEAL OF MISERY award. It gets hard to root for bastards every month, and hopefully A:TI won't become full of them.

I forgot to mention the little GLA sequence in AVENGERS: THE INITIATIVE #19 was cute.
 
Indeed. Like, I am sure if in the middle of World War II, if Captain America saw someone who was a Nazi in disguise all but literally punch out Hitler and then blow up a key machine, I doubt his first action would be to shoot that guy in the back of the head. That was cold and very depressing. Not saying it was without reason. They were at war with the Skrulls. And for much of the tie-in, Crusader had his chances to reveal his secret and feared doing so for, well, exactly what happened, that he'd been killed on the spot. Yeah, he's clearly not dead, but if he decides to become a villain, I obviously wouldn't blame him. Earthlings are seriously not worth defending at Marvel. Just ask Nova. ;)
 
^^^But if the Nazi in disguise punching Hitler was one of many nazis in disguise who were so disguised they didnt even know they were Nazis until they were activated and then they became super Nazis (this part of the metaphor doesnt really work as well with ideology compared to shapeshifting aliens but i think you get the gist). Thats not what Crusader actually was but from 3D Man's POV thats what it seemed like
 
Last edited:
I'm just glad Crusader ain't dead. I think it'd be pretty cool to see a Skrull on an Avengers team :up:
 
Indeed. Like, I am sure if in the middle of World War II, if Captain America saw someone who was a Nazi in disguise all but literally punch out Hitler and then blow up a key machine, I doubt his first action would be to shoot that guy in the back of the head. That was cold and very depressing. Not saying it was without reason. They were at war with the Skrulls. And for much of the tie-in, Crusader had his chances to reveal his secret and feared doing so for, well, exactly what happened, that he'd been killed on the spot. Yeah, he's clearly not dead, but if he decides to become a villain, I obviously wouldn't blame him. Earthlings are seriously not worth defending at Marvel. Just ask Nova. ;)

You're assuming that Delroy was even watching Crusader fight the whole time.
 
My issue isn't with 3D Man not noticing Crusader's a good Skrull. That's an easy mistake to make. My issue is with the fact that he pretty much murdered Crusader in cold blood. He could've taken Crusader down without blowing a hole in the back of his head. Apparently his short time with the Kill Krew has taken Delroy from the idealistic hero he was as Triathlon to a vicious murderer who'll shoot nonthreatening single opponents from behind.
 
I really hated the way the issue ended, with 3D Mans almost sitcom smile and shrug after killing him.

Reminded me of "I didn't do it" from Simpsons.
 
"What? He was a damn, dirty Skrull, his life is forfeit because I've arbitrarily decided that genocide is heroic."

:o
 
I just figured he was in bloodlust. Good men slaughter when caught up in a war, it's not that big a streach really.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Staff online

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
202,296
Messages
22,082,045
Members
45,881
Latest member
lucindaschatz
Back
Top
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"