The Amazing Spider-Man 2 Based on ASM2's box office and quality, was rebooting a mistake?

[DACrowe]

So what if the disease might have taken 30+ years to kill Harry. Just because it took that long for Norman doesn't mean Harry had that much time. How do we know Norman wasn't pumping himself full of experimental drugs with beneficial or even negative consequences that altered his disease?

And why would Harry wait that long? Why wouldn't a young man who just inherited a billion dollar company try to cure himself as quickly as possible?

Harry's plan when he breaks out Electro is to have Electro fight him so Harry can capture Spider-Man and take his blood. Of course he is going to show up at the end, he told us so 20 minutes before hand!

But to each their own, it really seems some people are going the extra mile to let us know we shouldn't like this movie.

If SM3, TDKR, MoS, IM3, and TDW have taught us anything, it's that there's always something to enjoy in these films, and some people are gonna like it, love it, or hate it.

I would not lump Iron Man 3 in with TASM2, much less TDKR which is actually a very good movie. In some ways TASM2 reminds me of what WB did to Batman in the mid-90s. It is nowhere near as bad as B&R, don't get me wrong. But it is a case of a studio turning a character into nothing more than a mascot for marketing future movies. And probably movies we are not going to be seeing after this weekend drop.

P.S. I was referring to this really putting a dent in the spin-offs. I fully expect The Amazing Spider-Man 3 to open in 2016. After that? I am curious.

 

[DACrowe]

edit

 

[DACrowe]

Harry was already showing signs of the disease (on his neck). He was clearly dying much quicker than his father, who had decades of gene therapy.

How did Venom drive the conflict of the climax??? Venom's appearance was extremely forced and obligatory in SM3. He's just thrown into the ending screeching and growling. He doesn't serve a purpose except to kidnap MJ which is the laziest plot device in a superhero movie considering Raimi used it for every climax of every Spider-man movie he did.

I don't see how Mary Jane being kidnapped and rescued for a third time is anywhere nearly as compelling as Gwen's death.

and unlike Harry/Gwen/Peter's relationship in ASM2, there is zero emotional investment in the characters in SM3. None of the SM3 character developments felt natural or rewarding. Gwen/GG2/Venom were all non-characters. The resolution of ASM2 paid off after building with genuine drama rather than cheesy melodrama that ultimately feels empty (I'm looking at you Topher Grace, James Franco, Bryce Dallas Howard and Kirsten Dunst).

He drove the plot as it was his plan, it was his trap, and he literally trapped Peter Parker in his web. He did not just appear after Spider-Man had defeated Sandman for a second "climax" after all the proverbial oxygen had been let out of the balloon. Venom was the big bad for the last third, even if he was rushed and obligatory. Green Goblin was rushed and obligatory, but he came off as an afterthought. He even got defeated by some falling debris. Peter never confronts Harry again after what he did!

And actually, much like Franco's Harry is a real character and not a plot device like DeHaan's, Harry's death was (sadly) more poignant and cathartic than Gwen's. I will not defend Maguire's crying in that scene, but these three characters had a trilogy of film history between them and since the whole movie built up to this point (you could say the whole trilogy) it felt genuinely earned. It is one of the few silver linings of Spider-Man 3.

In comparison, Gwen is killed as an afterthought while Orci and Kurtzman crossed off another box in the iconic scenes to ruin list.

While Emma Stone is great, I honestly did not feel anything about Gwen's death save surprise that they kept the neck snap (though it is hidden with the head hitting the ground). Otherwise, it felt as wasted as her quality performance.

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

Harry needed a cure...for a disease that would kill him in 30 to 40 years.

Shyeah, why try to cure something now when you could wait a few decades.

 

[Spiderine]

I'm thinking ASM3 will simply be the big Sinister Six group hug vs Spiderman and whatever ally he may have. And the spinoffs will be canceled. If the trend continues towards that film then Sony will likely have to rethink its entire strategy with its Spidey franchise.

 

[socool]

Was rebooting a mistake? No. I think continuing with Raimi and Co. would have been a much bigger mistake. It was clear in 3 that nobody really wanted to continue. The passion was gone (probably because Sony was beginning to stick their nose in where it didn't belong.) 4 would've been just awful.

The MISTAKE, was not taking their nose out.

TASM1 and 2 are both products of Sony forcing the license. It's clear. The first one was a forced, boring, retread of a film that was only a decade old to keep the license, and the second was an overstuffed world builder to expand the license. I keep saying this, but I'll say it again (and continue to): These movies don't work anymore because their corporate garbage. Their is little to no soul, passion, or care. They're made just to have Sony keep the rights. And until Sony decides to either give up Spider-Man or start giving a ****, things won't change. The GA is getting wise to them at this point if the box office results for TASM2 are anything to look at so maybe Sony will begin to notice. Or maybe they won't and they'll pump more garbage into these films hoping to catch some attention.

I won't say Spider-Man going back to Marvel is the path of salvation...but something needs to be done. It's just not really working at this point. And it'll only get worse. Honestly, I don't care what they do with the next one...or The Sinister Six...or the Venom movie. I just want one god damn good film again. It's been a decade since a truly good Spider-Man film has come out.

But I guess this is the path for a fanboy, eh? I have bigger fish to fry, but, yeah, I'm disappointed. And maybe a little frustrated. But there's nothing I, or any of us, can do but wait for things to change. Sucks.

 

[OcStat]

I disagree that there is no passion in the movies. Garfield is passionate about his role, and the responsibility he's carrying portraying a 50+ year old character loved by millions. Webb is passionate. They have always come across as genuine to me.

The powers that be that Webb has to answer to, yeah, they are looking to line their pockets. But isn't that always the case? Marvel Studios has a dream-come-true set up, no one to answer to but themselves. (Although i have read about some interence between them and the creatice teams also). Characters liscened out not so much. But even then great movies can be made. I think the (as much as it pains me to say) all around disappointing box office will force those powers that be to reevaluate their meddling. It has backfired on them more than once.

 

[socool]

I disagree that there is no passion in the movies. Garfield is passionate about his role, and the responsibility he's carrying portraying a 50+ year old character loved by millions. Webb is passionate. They have always cone across as genuine to me.

I agree. That's why I said "little to no." The only passion is from Garfield and Webb (Stone a little bit too but not as much.) Everything else is just bleh.

The powers that be that Webb has to answer to, yeah, they are looking to line their pockets. But isn't that always the case? Marvel Studios has a dream-come-true set up, characters liscened out not so much. But even then great movies can be made. I think the (as much as it pains me to say) all around disappointing box office will force those powers that be to reevaluate their meddling. It has backfired on them more than once.

If anything, a part of me thinks this box office thing will make things worse. Sony concocted a half-assed plan midway through TASM2's production and now they may have to scrap it and start anew? They only have so much time to make a new film before their contract with Marvel gets in the way. I feel they may get desperate and in turn get sloppier than they are now. That may not be the case, but that's how I see things going.

 

[OcStat]

Well, the spin off films are pretty far off still. I think they have time to steer the ship if need be. I don't think they will cancel any of the upcoming movies, I don't think I'd want them to either. I mean, I'm still interested in the possibilities a Venom and Sinister Six movie present.

They just have to make sure Amazing 3 is the best yet. If that movie disappoints, then Sony's in trouble.

And by best yet I mean the best Spider-Man movie period. Not just the best Amazing.

 

[TheWallCrawler]

I really really wanted to see what Marvel Studios would do with Spider-Man after the Raimi series was officially done so I kinda feel bummed that Sony didn't sell the rights back, but for what it's worth I enjoyed TASM, and totally loved TASM2. the main problem with this continuity I have is that its roots aren't that great and that they kinda wasted Lizard, my favorite Spider-man villain since I was like 4 years old

 

[Human Torch]

Shyeah, why try to cure something now when you could wait a few decades.

Yeah.This film has it's share of problems,but I don't know why people get hung up on Harry's desperation.

Norman scared the **** outta him,he was already getting the Goblin "rash" the size of a quarter on his neck and he thought he found a cure in Spider-Man.

Now,what was he supposed to do?Wait around,hoping he had as long a life as Norman did (which we're not told how long he was in seclusion.I doubt Norman looked like that for only a week before he died.) and hope there was a better cure out there eventually to be found?

And also hope Spidey wouldn't get killed/retire within the next 40 years as a "back-up plan"?

 

[Spooderman]

They could have simply had OsCorp test Spider-Man's blood to see if it was safe for the next few years, so he wouldn't have to wait 40 years, but wouldn't be so desperate to use it in a few days. Norman was healthy enough to build up a multi billion corporation, the disease probably didn't start out too bad.

 

[Human Torch]

But Spidey wouldn't give him any blood to test,hence his desperation.

And I don't think you can blame Peter too much for not giving him the blood to test,since Oscorp would find out he was Spidey.(They already seemed suspicious of him.....in the scene that wasn't in the movie.)

 

[Spooderman]

Well, Harry still had the Spider venom, so he could have had Oscorp test that instead of injecting it and going Green Goblin.

 

[Andrew Lucas]

But Spidey wouldn't give him any blood to test,hence his desperation.

And I don't think you can blame Peter too much for not giving him the blood to test,since Oscorp would find out he was Spidey.(They already seemed suspicious of him.....in the scene that wasn't in the movie.)

 

[Human Torch]

Also you have to consider the danger of Oscorp getting their hands on his blood for their own nefarious purposes.Peter already learned that from giving Connors help with his equations last film,remember? (and they say this kid never learns anything!)

The problem is none of this is communicated clearly in the film.They expect you to put it together yourself.But I suppose if they put in a ton of exposition you'd have as many people complaining about being "spoon-fed".

 

[OcStat]

Haha, ain't that the truth.

 

[AF3619]

Well, Harry still had the Spider venom, so he could have had Oscorp test that instead of injecting it and going Green Goblin.

he was "fired" he didn´t have the company anymore...maybe the money but to gather all that equpment and scientists...expensive...

 

[Slushy]

They should've just carried on with the sequel like a Bond movie. We didn't need to see Spidey's fu**ing origin again!

 

[socool]

They should've just carried on with the sequel like a Bond movie. We didn't need to see Spidey's fu**ing origin again!

100% agreed. That's what dragged the first one down. But considering how this one did, I don't know if that matters anymore...

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Can you imagine how horrible the Bond series would be if they retold Bond's origin each time the actor changed?

 

[Harley2004]

Love Gwen.
Love Peter.
Love Spider-Man.
Loved TASM.

So bottom line, I guess I'm glad they rebooted.

This. It's just too bad they went too far with this one.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

100% agreed. That's what dragged the first one down. But considering how this one did, I don't know if that matters anymore...

Oh yeah, there is a lot more wrong with this franchise than just redoing the origin. That really only affected the first film, not this second one. It looks pretty clear that the current crew just couldn't get the job done regardless.

It still doesn't mean spending half the first film redoing the same story that was already told a decade ago was a good idea.

 

[Johnny-Oh]

Also you have to consider the danger of Oscorp getting their hands on his blood for their own nefarious purposes.Peter already learned that from giving Connors help with his equations last film,remember? (and they say this kid never learns anything!)

The problem is none of this is communicated clearly in the film.They expect you to put it together yourself.But I suppose if they put in a ton of exposition you'd have as many people complaining about being "spoon-fed".

He didn't have to show up to Harry as Spiderman to say "I won't give you my blood" just to piss him off even more.

 

[Johnny-Oh]

If I made a Spider-Man movie I would like to tell the origin because Peter's transition from having no powers to become a superhero because of the death of his uncle its the most important part of the character.

However for this franchise it would have been much better if they started with him already as Spiderman since they didn't do anything new with the origin. They wouldn't have had to make Andrew an outcast/nerd because he didn't pull it off at all.