Captain Marvel General Discussion and Speculation - Part 2

[Mike5575]

I still cant get over how much Marvel is ruining her in the books when now is the time to be giving her a push that puts her in a favorable light. Any fan that may have checked out the books bc of the recent CW movie would likely hate her if thats their first exposure of the character

I hate Bendis so much. The least he could do is do something to at least show her motivations and reasons. This event is so one-sided. Can Carol Danvers' reputation in the comics even be saved after this? How could Marvel let Bendis get away with this?

 

[NotNickFury]

That might depend on the reader, since I doubt anyone who saw that one issue where Cap said "Hail Hydra," or followed the news about it, even if it was a ploy, had their opinions soured on Chris Evans' interpretation of the character.

 

[Havok83]

I hate Bendis so much. The least he could do is do something to at least show her motivations and reasons. This event is so one-sided. Can Carol Danvers' reputation in the comics even be saved after this? How could Marvel let Bendis get away with this?

He did the same thing to Scarlet Witch and it took her years to recover. To me and other fans she never did and is forever ruined. I really hope it doesnt get that bad for Carol but he has 3 issues to prove me wrong

 

[Mike5575]

That might depend on the reader, since I doubt anyone who saw that one issue where Cap said "Hail Hydra," or followed the news about it, even if it was a ploy, had their opinions soured on Chris Evans' interpretation of the character.

This website is obviously more about comic book movies than comic books, but I was referring to the comics only. How many people will end up skipping her relaunch in December even though its being written by a novelist?

 

[Havok83]

That might depend on the reader, since I doubt anyone who saw that one issue where Cap said "Hail Hydra," or followed the news about it, even if it was a ploy, had their opinions soured on Chris Evans' interpretation of the character.

Im talking about the comics, not movie. And plenty of people were screaming that Cap was ruined after that. The difference is that we have since learned that he is being manipulated and that "retcon" isnt actually a retcon. Besides Chris Evan's Cap has been around for years before any of this happened so people already have an opinion on him that they love. Carol has yet to debut so she is an unknown who's most notable highly publicized story in years is centerstage of the MU and its ruining her character. Not a good look

 

[Abudefduf]

Also... I want something like this on the soundtrack... Just cuz:

Spoiler

[YT]m9m1Or9D67g[/YT]

Never heard of the band before but the song is pretty cool. Unfortunately, as this is a MCU movie I have no expectations for the soundtrack... I wish we could get a theme that's at least half as good as the Wonder Woman's one, but I'm not raising my hopes.

And speaking of music... In a perfect world, Marvel would hire a decent female rock star (preferably one who can act) to sing - and maybe even compose, why not - a few tracks for this movie's score, and then have her show up in the sequel as Lila Cheney to meet Carol.

That would be so meta, brah. And also a waste of time and money, probably.

 

[coluanprime]

Cool interview with Victoria Alonso, mentioning Carol:
http://www.themarysue.com/interview-victoria-alonso-marvel/

 

[MbJ]

Can Carol Danvers' reputation in the comics even be saved after this? How could Marvel let Bendis get away with this?

The same reason they let Mark Millar drag Tony Stark kicking and screaming through the mud in Civil War. They thought the story was nuanced and presented both sides as equally valid and positive, when, in reality, Steve came off like am unambiguous hero and Tony came off like a violent fascist. I'm sure nobody went into this actively wanting to wreck Carol, just once again, they seemed to think her arguments and actions would seem more reasonable and agreeable than they actually did.

And just like Iron Man, her movie will save her reputation, I'm sure.t:

 

[Abudefduf]

The movie is still three years away though... I'm so not looking forward to three years of Captain Marvel being a controversial figure, both in-universe and among the fans.

Grrr, superhero vs. superhero stories... who the heck likes them anyway. I'll never understand how could anyone enjoy seeing lovable characters beat each other up. This year alone I've been forced to see 2 of my top 3 favorite superheroes being turned into unreasonable morons because of this stupid premise.

Cool interview with Victoria Alonso, mentioning Carol:

How do you think Marvel is doing in terms of diversity and female representation, and what would be your goal for the future?

I think we have a lot of work to do. I think this is a good beginning, we’re chipping at it but it’s a big mountain and I feel like we’re a little behind in our chipping. So all hands on deck to make sure we continue to make an impact, we continue to empower women and we empower diversity and we empower all kinds of people because everyone has the inner strength to become a superhero. I will not rest until we have the first female superhero movie on the screen and I hope it’s the first of many to come.

Movies? Didn't she get the memo? Nobody wants movies anymore. All people seem to want nowadays is more Netflix shows.

 

[MbJ]

Grrr, superhero vs. superhero stories... who the heck likes them anyway.

Most people. It's a pretty basic desire.

Movies? Didn't she get the memo? Nobody wants movies anymore. All people seem to want nowadays is more Netflix shows.

Well, they are the most consistently great things about the franchise...

 

[metaphysician]

I still cant get over how much Marvel is ruining her in the books when now is the time to be giving her a push that puts her in a favorable light. Any fan that may have checked out the books bc of the recent CW movie would likely hate her if thats their first exposure of the character

Its their way of staying true to the Civil War brand. If its not turning one of the main leads into a villain, its not Civil War.

 

[Abudefduf]

Most people. It's a pretty basic desire.

Then most people are wrong.

Joking aside, I already talked about this in the Unpopular Film Opinions thread so I'm not gonna bog down this one with more of my ramblings... let's just say that it's a desire that I completely and utterly fail to understand. It's against everything superheroes are supposed to be all about (imo), and that's why stories based on this premise usually only work thanks to contrived and/or flat-out lazy and bad writing; case in point, Civil War II.

I sure am not gonna pretend to be unhappy about the mixed reception received by both BvS and CW II... Batman and Captain Marvel (again, 2 of my top 3 favorite superheroes) deserve so much better than being turned into two irrational, villainous buffoons.

And yes, I know... first world problems and all that.

 

[MbJ]

Eh. People liked Civil War the movie just fine. Again, it's a pretty basic desire people have when you're watching something about people whose primary mode of solving problems is fighting.

 

[Abudefduf]

Eh. People liked Civil War the movie just fine.

So did I, but that's because CA:CW was a superhero vs superhero story done right; and even then, I wouldn't say that the fight between Tony and Cap was enjoyable to watch... but at least it made sense, and it's not like they were fighting to the death anyway. Bucky is an anti-villain so what Tony or T'Challa tried to do to him doesn't matter, he's fair game as far as I'm concerned.

Long story short, I'm not saying superheroes should never fight... I'm just saying that their fights shouldn't go too far - because most superheroes wouldn't allow for that to happen - and if they do, then the writers better be prepared to give me one hell of a good justification for it.

Based on what I'm hearing, Bendis has failed to do that, and now we're stuck with a Captain Marvel in need of redemption... great.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Conflict IS a major part of drama, super hero stories or not. And within comic books, hero vs. hero tales are neither new, or novel. One could even argue that such match ups are a key part of the appeal to our adolescent selves, the one hiding inside our adult bodies. If one wants to praise the supposed "accuracy" of any given popular CBM in translating the many tropes of the printed page versions to live action, well you have to accept they aren't all going to be the ones you like only.

 

[flickchick85]

I'm rarely a fan of hero vs. hero stories anyway myself, but any way you slice it, Bendis is botching this one big time, imo.

 

[InCali]

Hey Kevin. The equinox was last week. You know what that means? It means that summer is over and it's fall now.

Where's my frelling director!?!?!? t:

 

[Iceman]

Then most people are wrong.

Joking aside, I already talked about this in the Unpopular Film Opinions thread so I'm not gonna bog down this one with more of my ramblings... let's just say that it's a desire that I completely and utterly fail to understand. It's against everything superheroes are supposed to be all about (imo), and that's why stories based on this premise usually only work thanks to contrived and/or flat-out lazy and bad writing; case in point, Civil War II.

I sure am not gonna pretend to be unhappy about the mixed reception received by both BvS and CW II... Batman and Captain Marvel (again, 2 of my top 3 favorite superheroes) deserve so much better than being turned into two irrational, villainous buffoons.

And yes, I know... first world problems and all that.

I agree. Villain Vs Villain fine. Or just a tech demo CGI fight between 2 heroes showing their abilities and who wins, cool. But in a film where we are getting to know the characters, the heroes fighting, especially when too intensely or more than once, makes at least one of them slightly less heroic or slightly more dumb than they should have been.

 

[DarthMuppet]

I think I would rather Jessica be saved for a sequel. Make her someone Carol meets as a fellow super I say. What I want is a meaty rivalry between Carol and Moonstone. As such... I think developing the villain is more important than building up the support cast/friends.

Also... I want something like this on the soundtrack... Just cuz:

Spoiler

[YT]m9m1Or9D67g[/YT]

Also... Here's an AMV showcasing Carol alongside other more well known to the GA female supers:

Spoiler

[YT]uzlwg_vWYbA[/YT]

I don't have any idea why, but some reason, over the last few years I always think of Carol when listening to Black Rebel Motorcycle Club. Maybe it has something to do with their current drummer being a woman(the total badass Leah Shapiro... look her up, she's been through a lot). Maybe it's the lyrics... maybe it's just the sound. Like I said, I really don't know why. Having said that, I'd go crazy if one of these songs popped up in the movie anywhere. Especially the last one(Rifles), as the lyrics there do make me think of Carol.

Spoiler

[YT]jdTmk-YyUKg[/YT]

Spoiler

[YT]VfnszUQrobQ[/YT]

Spoiler

[YT]wxnfC4Qig_Q[/YT]

 

[MbJ]

Hey Kevin. The equinox was last week. You know what that means? It means that summer is over and it's fall now.

Where's my frelling director!?!?!? t:

On the toilet.

 

[InCali]

On the toilet.

Where do you get this quality of "inside" information?

Latino Review? birthmoviesdeath?

 

[Mike5575]

Hey Kevin. The equinox was last week. You know what that means? It means that summer is over and it's fall now.

Where's my frelling director!?!?!? t:

HE LIED TO US!

Why does Kevin Feige and Marvel HATE their fans?

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

I hope the approach to the action in this by the director is substantially different to what GOTG was. That was more in line with standard Sci Fi stuff. Here, we have a character who is her own star fighter as it were. Less ship to ship stuff, more Carol flying through the hulls of capitol ships and using her own powers to decimate squadrons of smaller ships.

 

[Mike5575]

Based on what I'm hearing, Bendis has failed to do that, and now we're stuck with a Captain Marvel in need of redemption... great.

Redemption stories can be quite good, though. It would give Margaret Stohl a compelling arc to work with when Captain Marvel's book is relaunched for the umpteenth time.

I'm rarely a fan of hero vs. hero stories anyway myself, but any way you slice it, Bendis is botching this one big time, imo.

I know. This event is so one-sided. I'm curious as to how Bendis is going to turn things around in the final three issues since Captain Marvel is supposed to emerge as "the most popular hero" in her relaunch. The least Bendis could do is have Carol defend her side of the argument by telling Tony that she's saved thousands of lives using Ulysses' visions. But, we only get that from her solo book and not the main book.

Hmmm....

 

[Abudefduf]

Marquez's Cap looks so badass with her awesomely silly hairdo... it's too bad she's trapped in such a s****y story.

And someone should totally make Larson read Civil War II. That's right girl, you're playing this *****e now.

I agree. Villain Vs Villain fine. Or just a tech demo CGI fight between 2 heroes showing their abilities and who wins, cool. But in a film where we are getting to know the characters, the heroes fighting, especially when too intensely or more than once, makes at least one of them slightly less heroic or slightly more dumb than they should have been.

I know, right? And not only that. It also makes them look irresponsible. What kind of heroes (no matter how angry they might be at each other) would risk their lives and the integrity of their teams in what are ultimately counter-productive fights, when the Earth is already chock-full of dangerous supervillains far more deserving of attention, and the universe keeps throwing at them genocidal gods and alien invaders every other day?

Again, that just makes them look irresponsible and egocentrical, and we know most of them are better than that, or at least they try to be. They're not called superheroes just because they can fly and shoot lasers and embiggen themselves.

Look, I admit I may have a very old-fashioned, narrow view of what superheroes are supposed to be like, but as I already said, between BvS and CWII this year has really soured me on this awful trope. I just want to see muh heroes be awesome and selfless and inspiring, that's all.

End of my digression and back to the movie.

I hope the approach to the action in this by the director is substantially different to what GOTG was. That was more in line with standard Sci Fi stuff. Here, we have a character who is her own star fighter as it were. Less ship to ship stuff, more Carol flying through the hulls of capitol ships and using her own powers to decimate squadrons of smaller ships.

Yeah, that would be cool.

Speaking of action scenes, I hope whoever directs the solo movie can provide us with some satisfying, over-the-top displays of Carol's powers because I'm not sure if I trust the Russos to deliver in that department. Civil War gave me the impression that they don't really know what to do with superpowered characters.