Dr. Lecter Invites you to Dinner. The ''Hannibal'' Thread - Part 2

[Schlosser85]

Matt, do you think Hannibal would do better if it'd been on HBO?

 

[Matt]

Matt, do you think Hannibal would do better if it'd been on HBO?

Undoubtedly so. If for no other reason, because Hannibal seems to be a show that gets a lot of secondary viewing, that is online, OnDemand, DVR, etc. Those numbers don't matter to basic networks because their revenue is generated through advertising. HBO doesn't play by those rules. Their revenue is generated through subscribers. Meaning if people are paying for HBO, to watch a program like Hannibal, it is profitable, no matter how they watch it (online, DVRed, OnDemand, etc...they still have to pay for the subscription to watch it). And 2 million viewers is a perfectly sufficient number for HBO. Sure, it isn't Game of Thrones...but it doesn't have to be.

 

[Eddie Dean]

Was I the only one who thought the episode kinda felt like [BLACKOUT]proto-The Silence of the Lambs?[/BLACKOUT]

ManBearPig crashing through the window reminded me of Manhunter.

 

[slimshady247]

I don't know, is there some issue you have with people talking about it? I think it's fine, since it's a part of the show, as long as no one over does it. And I seem to see just as many talking about the latest episode when it airs than that, so I don't really see the problem.

It was a legitimate question. It wasn't a knock on the people who are worrying about it, as I'm included among those people. I don't exactly go about insulting myself. I just wanted to know what was new, I guess. It wasn't the best phrasing, admittedly.

Not sure how I feel about Will's newfound interest in murder. I wish it were just a ploy to make Hannibal think Will is coming over to the "dark side".

Except that's totally what it is.

Yeah, I don't see the issue with discussing it either. The fact is, this show is probably going to be on the bubble for as long as it is on the air. 2 million viewers isn't good enough for network TV. The show stays on the air (for now), despite that, because NBC is in such a wretched state. Eventually NBC is going to cut their losses and move on, because NBC will try something to save their brand. So yeah, this conversation is going to be tied to the show for the entirety of its run.

That said, Slim, your latest post almost seemed like you were trying to pick a fight over it when no one else was even talking about it.

Nah, I was actually trying to ask a legitimate question, haha. I was curious as to whether there was any news on it or whatever else. I realize now that the phrasing of the question was very poor.

I wouldn't consider us talking about it just a page or two before as being a time in which "no one was talking about it." You literally wrote an entire page attempting to convince me that the show will die if NBC drops it just the page before. It wasn't an irrelevant question.

 

[squeekness]

ManBearPig crashing through the window reminded me of Manhunter.

I was thinking that myself, only minus the Iron Butterfly goodness to go along with it...

 

[jonathancrane]

Last night's episode was excellent. It asked some interesting questions about monstrosity and the management of it. Of course, I was amused about the hydraulic apparatus Lecter's former patient used. In the screenplay I was writing, the character used a similar contraption; however, since Fuller & Co. beat me to the punch, I have to go back to square one and retool the character to avoid similarities. I know how Guillermo del Toro felt when he watched the second Pirates of the Caribbean film and discovered the design team had beat him to the punch with the design of Davey Jones.

 

[The Shape]

Undoubtedly so. If for no other reason, because Hannibal seems to be a show that gets a lot of secondary viewing, that is online, OnDemand, DVR, etc. Those numbers don't matter to basic networks because their revenue is generated through advertising. HBO doesn't play by those rules. Their revenue is generated through subscribers. Meaning if people are paying for HBO, to watch a program like Hannibal, it is profitable, no matter how they watch it (online, DVRed, OnDemand, etc...they still have to pay for the subscription to watch it). And 2 million viewers is a perfectly sufficient number for HBO. Sure, it isn't Game of Thrones...but it doesn't have to be.

To add to this, HBO generally airs more adult programming that "pushes the envelope", as Hannibal does. It would have found a much stronger audience on HBO, period. It would fit in well with their overall schedule. They could have used a cerebral horror/thriller show on their network.

 

[Sawyer]

Then HBO should've bid on the show in the first place.

 

[The Shape]

Then HBO should've bid on the show in the first place.

I agree, although I'm niot sure that they even had the opportunity to do so.

 

[kvz5]

I think this would fare like Dexter (Showtime) if it was on HBO. Maaaybe even a bit better.

Really enjoyed last night's episode. Much better than last week's. You do NOT mess with Will's dogs. Will and Margot's chat was a also a highlight for me.

 

[slimshady247]

Yeah, last night's episode was pretty great. Particularly the reveal of the fact that

Spoiler

Hannibal has groomed some of his other patients to be killers.

That was fascinating.

So last night's episode had 2.8 million viewers. Good times?

 

[Matt]

I agree, although I'm niot sure that they even had the opportunity to do so.

I think the fact that this show landed at NBC is a reflection of how little faith anyone had in it. Keep in mind, when development began on this, the state of the franchise was pretty dire. Dino DeLaurentis had basically just forced development of a ****** prequel, that nobody wanted, that essentially turned the character into a tool for torture porn. A prestige network like HBO or AMC wasn't going to touch a tv adaptation of that character.

 

[jonathancrane]

I am happy that the show was not picked up by AMC, as they probably would have driven Fuller away by the end of season 1. They're jerks to creative personnel.

 

[Bruce Banner]

I am happy that the show was not picked up by AMC, as they probably would have driven Fuller away by the end of season 1. They're jerks to creative personnel.

^This. Very much so.
I've always been thankful that they dodged that bullet.

 

[Shifty]

I think the fact that this show landed at NBC is a reflection of how little faith anyone had in it. Keep in mind, when development began on this, the state of the franchise was pretty dire. Dino DeLaurentis had basically just forced development of a ****** prequel, that nobody wanted, that essentially turned the character into a tool for torture porn. A prestige network like HBO or AMC wasn't going to touch a tv adaptation of that character.

If we go back to the the original posts in this thread we see that Gaumont Television was able to lure Fuller then shopped the project around. NBC won the bidding by offering a 13 episode full season order based off the pilot script (that wasn't written yet). Deadline reveals that the head of Gaumont TV used to work at NBC as head of drama and had worked with Fuller and was outbid for Pushing Daisies. Work with people you know and like to work with, I guess. Also Gaumont was going to fund the project based off international sales of the show. So NBC couldn't turn down a package like that, they only had to pay advertising costs and didn't have to pay for production.

This has been happening more and more with networks offering straight to series with just the pilot script or even without a pilot script. Just an idea and someone attached to write it. Netflix stole House of Cards from HBO and AMC by offering 2 seasons whereas HBO may have offered 1 and AMC a shorter episode count. Netflix could take the risk, AMC likely couldn't. NBC got burned by the Michael J. Fox Show which had no script.

In fall 2011 when it was being shopped, Showtime wasn't going to pick up Hannibal because they had Dexter. AMC just had the first season of The Killing end and had The Walking Dead as well. So the crime/horror genres were covered plus they had a full drama slate. FX was about to debut American Horror Story and they may have been interested but they like working on scripts, they weren't going to offer a first season with just Fuller attached. Same with HBO. They already had True Blood (horror), Boardwalk Empire, Treme and Game of Thrones plus The Newsroom in development and Luck premiering soon. Their drama slate was full and one that fit the horror genre.

Now last year if they were bringing Hannibal around, HBO may have had more interest with True Blood, Boardwalk and The Newsroom ending this year.

Maybe if Ridley Scott or another big name was attached to direct the pilot and another name with a better track record than Fuller was going to be the showrunner FX or HBO could get on board for a direct to series order. There was probably interest because Hannibal was an established name and Gaumont was going to pay for it but most cable networks already had a full drama slate and at least one show in the crime/horror/thriller genre.

NBC was desperate for a hit or at the very least one that would get them some Emmy noms and not be terrible in the ratings. They thought the solution was to get a cable show that followed the cable model. Add in the established name, the previous working relationship between Fuller, NBC and Gaumont it makes sense this is how the deal went down. We all groaned when it was announced that Hannibal found a home on NBC and it probably would've been better in terms of long term security if a cable net landed the show. But at the time, there was very few places that were going to take on Hannibal and NBC just outbid everyone.

 

[Tron Bonne]

I am happy that the show was not picked up by AMC, as they probably would have driven Fuller away by the end of season 1. They're jerks to creative personnel.

Based on what?

 

[Sawyer]

Based on what?

The Walking Dead and Hell on Wheels both.

 

[slimshady247]

Based on what?

3 words: The Walking Dead

Need you further evidence?

 

[Tron Bonne]

I didn't/don't watch or follow either. I mostly know them from Mad Men and Breaking Bad. And, from most of what I know, their hasn't been a huge amount of turmoil with either from a creative standpoint. Mad Men had a lot of negotiations that made it skip a year, but I think that was more an issue with talent. Breaking Bad had a rough time getting that last season finally greenlit, but more financial. But I don't know, never heard much more about that.

 

[slimshady247]

The Walking Dead has had, I think, 3 showrunners total now? It's pretty bad.

I don't know about Hell on Wheels, but I wouldn't be surprised if that show was/has been having issues, too.

 

[flickchick85]

I didn't/don't watch or follow either. I mostly know them from Mad Men and Breaking Bad. And, from most of what I know, their hasn't been a huge amount of turmoil with either from a creative standpoint. Mad Men had a lot of negotiations that made it skip a year, but I think that was more an issue with talent. Breaking Bad had a rough time getting that last season finally greenlit, but more financial. But I don't know, never heard much more about that.

The Mad Men issue was Matthew Weiner (the showrunner) vs. the network. Basically, after Mad Men essentially put AMC on the map in the first place, AMC wanted to cut some of their budget in the later seasons to invest in new shows and cut their episode lengths by 2-minutes to make room for more ads, and Matthew Weiner was having none of it, suggesting it would fundamentally change the show. That stand-off lasted a while, and he even "quit" at one point. So yeah, that's another one for the "AMC Not Getting Along with the Showrunner" column. The only showrunner they seemed to have a smooth and successful relationship with to the end was Vince Gilligan (as far as I know).

 

[insider1970]

Hey, don't argue! Seems good news t:

Fuller gave an interview, you can hear it here http://radio.securenetsystems.net/v4/index.cfm?stationCallSign=TDPS

And said among other things (personal note:I haven't heard it yet, so some mistakes may be going on, I just found a little transcript online):

-Since Game of Thrones people are giving a lot more *beep* about novels adapted into series and so a lot of networks want to grab Hannibal when NBC drops it more everyday
-They're already planning S03 and the beginning is going to be really action packed and it's going to get even darker than now fast.

Some other tidbits (I will spoiler-tag one because it's about Chilton):

-

Spoiler

Chilton survives! Fuller didn't consider let Chilton survive until he saw how much Raúl stole his scenes, also some vague comment about injuries. He'll have an impressive scar.

-There's a dish where people eat stuffed sheep vaginas and Fuller says they're considering using it on Hannibal except that obviously it won't be sheep
-Fuller would rather eat his school teachers than his dog
-A very complicated thing about Hannibal sound, they mention they're gonna get weirder every season so expect a lot of BRRRR BNNNRRRR in the next seasons

 

[Tron Bonne]

The Mad Men issue was Matthew Weiner (the showrunner) vs. the network. Basically, after Mad Men essentially put AMC on the map in the first place, AMC wanted to cut some of their budget in the later seasons to invest in new shows and cut their episode lengths by 2-minutes to make room for more ads, and Matthew Weiner was having none of it, suggesting it would fundamentally change the show. That stand-off lasted a while, and he even "quit" at one point. So yeah, that's another one for the "AMC Not Getting Along with the Showrunner" column. The only showrunner they seemed to have a smooth and successful relationship with to the end was Vince Gilligan (as far as I know).

Oh well, I wasn't aware of that. I always thought it was a dispute about talent salaries. I stand corrected there then.

 

[flickchick85]

Oh well, I wasn't aware of that. I always thought it was a dispute about talent salaries. I stand corrected there then.

Well to be fair, I'm pretty sure the budget they wanted to cut from was the "cast budget" so it makes sense that you'd think that because I'm sure salaries were involved, but yeah, there was also more to it than that.

 

[slimshady247]

Hey, don't argue! Seems good news t:

Fuller gave an interview, you can hear it here http://radio.securenetsystems.net/v4/index.cfm?stationCallSign=TDPS

And said among other things (personal note:I haven't heard it yet, so some mistakes may be going on, I just found a little transcript online):



Some other tidbits (I will spoiler-tag one because it's about Chilton):

Oooh, interesting. Thanks for sharing!