Game of Thrones General (Non-Book Related) Discussion Thread - Part 1

[JimThompson]

Do people really think Jon's the victim here? Most of the people I talked to or watched/read reviews about all felt Dany was the tragic hero/victim/villain while nobody really cared for, or neutral at best, the rest of Jon's arc afterwards. I think people cared more about Drogon than for Jon really at that point.

Dany is the most tragic figure after all is said and done, I think. Jon just sort of looked weak this season.

 

[Drizzle]

Maybe they are holding back to provide more new material to the Documentary. When is that airing anyway?

Sunday 5/26 at 9PM.

 

[Roose Bolton]

The stuff with Ghost...eesh that’s embarrassing

 

[MaceB]

Dany is the most tragic figure after all is said and done, I think. Jon just sort of looked weak this season.

As a whole... Dany had a more triumphant beginning and a more tragic end, while Jon had a more tragic beginning and a more triumphant end..... eh... sorta. The show gave a lot of love to Dany in the first few seasons. Jon has never gotten much love honestly. It's been a hard road for him, from beginning to end. Jon is the archetypical tragic figure of this show, IMO.

 

[JimThompson]

As a whole... Dany had a more triumphant beginning and a more tragic end, while Jon had a more tragic beginning and a more triumphant end..... eh... sorta. The show gave a lot of love to Dany in the first few seasons. Jon has never gotten much love honestly. It's been a hard road for him, from beginning to end. Jon is the archetypical tragic figure of this show, IMO.

Jon certainly had a tough road, I agree. He really never caught a break. That said, he looked really indecisive for a lot of this season, and I personally thought that hurt his story.

 

[MaceB]

Jon certainly had a tough road, I agree. He really never caught a break. That said, he looked really indecisive for a lot of this season, and I personally thought that hurt his story.

You've got to forgive Jon. It took me a while to appreciate that it was intentional... but it seems like they really did want to depict Jon as sort of this naive, gullible fool who was brave, and honorable, with a heart of gold. The guy just isn't that bright I guess.

 

[Pink Ranger]

I found it sad. All of the Stark kids (including Jon) who used to love eachother in the beginning, are now going their separate ways, probably to never see eachother again. Also, unless Jon violates his agreement of not fathering any children, all the great houses are now gone after this generation except for the Baratheons and maybe the Tullys.

I'd like to think that any child born of Sansa Stark would carry the Stark name; I think male tradition is out the window in the north. Ditto for Yara. Sweet Robin's foiyne as hell now, so the Arryn line will continue. Tyrion can still make babies.

 

[BatLobster]

You've got to forgive Jon. It took me a while to appreciate that it was intentional... but it seems like they really did want to depict Jon as sort of this naive, gullible fool who was brave, and honorable, with a heart of gold. The guy just isn't that bright I guess.

Yeah. I've always seem him as a bit of a lovable dope.

 

[MadVillainy]

Stolen from Twitter

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

 

[Marvolo]

First off Dany is a mass murderer that killed thousands of civilians and surrendered troops and she did it in less than 30 minutes. That is why she was killed. It was justice. She is no more a victim than Nazis that were executed for their war crimes.

Jon on the other hand is in fact a victim. He loved Dany, he believed in her, he risked himself and his people and family for her. And she betrayed him. She made him an accomplice in mass murder on a scale unseen in Westerosi history. She then tried to frame her heinous actions as liberation. But even after that he still loved her and wanted to believe she could turn back from her bloodlust, and he gave her a chance, and she made it clear she wouldnt turn back. For her crimes and to stop further brutality he executed her. Rather than just setting aside her actions to be with her he did what was needed and what was right. He chose the people and Westeros over the woman he loved. So yeah, he IS a victim regardless of the fact he has a penis.

Edit: It could be argued that Dany is a victim of circumstance, the choices of people around her, and her own mistakes, and I can certainly agree in that regard that she is a victim, but she isnt a victim for Jon executing her. When you do something like Dany did you dont get to play the victim card when someone kills you for it.

 

[Manasrepublic]

They should have stabbed each other. Dany and Jon at the same time.

That sad Bran says the most useless vague things many times. I don’t see him being a good king. More like a vague poor communicator.

They should also train him in combat for the sequel series. Develop a unique fighting style so he can go around asking people “what’s your shtoyle??!” Have him become a vicious bone breaking bad ass. Bran the Bro. I really would enjoy seeing him kick ass.

Obviously the last paragraph is a joke. I think this season has such massive potential, but things were too rushed. They needed more eps to develop and fully realize the story. The overall arcs were very promising but they rushed to the end result and it’s left a super bad hairy sweaty smegma crusted balls kind of taste in people’s mouths

 

[MaceB]

I'm watching it again, and I just can't believe they didn't finish the 'Honeycomb and the Jacka$$' joke. They even brought up the opening pitch again. Like guys... the ending of a show is about payoff. You can't even payoff this joke for us?

 

[Legendver2]

That marketing is on point lol

 

[Donner]

First off Dany is a mass murderer that killed thousands of civilians and surrendered troops and she did it in less than 30 minutes. That is why she was killed. It was justice. She is no more a victim than Nazis that were executed for their war crimes.

Jon on the other hand is in fact a victim. He loved Dany, he believed in her, he risked himself and his people and family for her. And she betrayed him. She made him an accomplice in mass murder on a scale unseen in Westerosi history. She then tried to frame her heinous actions as liberation. But even after that he still loved her and wanted to believe she could turn back from her bloodlust, and he gave her a chance, and she made it clear she wouldnt turn back. For her crimes and to stop further brutality he executed her. Rather than just setting aside her actions to be with her he did what was needed and what was right. He chose the people and Westeros over the woman he loved. So yeah, he IS a victim regardless of the fact he has a penis.

Edit: It could be argued that Dany is a victim of circumstance, the choices of people around her, and her own mistakes, and I can certainly agree in that regard that she is a victim, but she isnt a victim for Jon executing her. When you do something like Dany did you dont get to play the victim card when someone kills you for it.

First of all, cut the condescending crap. It wasn't my tweet. Secondly, no one is embracing Nazis and stabbing them in the heart. The problem with the way this was done is that Dany wasn't killed after being found guilty of murder and being sentenced to death. Jon embraced her and then killed her, like a coward would. If you can't see the difference between a justified death after a sentencing and a man killing his lover after hugging her, then you have bigger problems.

The point isn't that she should have been allowed to live. The point is that she was killed in a pathetic sneak attack and he's being hailed as a hero.

 

[FunkMiller]

I’m still stunned that this stupid, stupid season made absolutely zero effort to outline the Night King’s motivations.

Zero. None.

The main villain of Game Of Thrones was given no development whatsoever.

‘I want to kill Bran’. That’s it. Nothing else. No reason for it. No explanation. No motivation. Nothing.

All of that build up. All of that foreshadowing. All of that story... for nothing.

Unbelievable.

 

[MaceB]

It really is insane what they did with the Night King saga. Unforgivable, honestly... it completely ruins it.

All the other stuff... rushed King's landing and what not... I can more or less be cool with. But the battle of the dead was 2 dimensional, and cast aside as meaningless spectacle... like, there's no way they couldn't know it'd be controversial. It was designed to be controversial.

 

[Lencho01]

George RR Martin Writes About the ‘Real’ Ending of ‘Game of Thrones’ – and His Progress on the Last 2 Books

 

[Lencho01]

 

[FunkMiller]

It really is insane what they did with the Night King saga. Unforgivable, honestly... it completely ruins it.

All the other stuff... rushed King's landing and what not... I can more or less be cool with. But the battle of the dead was 2 dimensional, and cast aside as meaningless spectacle... like, there's no way they couldn't know it'd be controversial. It was designed to be controversial.

Also, the whole three headed raven aspect. Pointless. Never went anywhere. No attempt to consolidate, explain, expand on, or give a satisfactory conclusion to either storyline.

Utterly dumbfounding.

 

[FunkMiller]

George RR Martin Writes About the ‘Real’ Ending of ‘Game of Thrones’ – and His Progress on the Last 2 Books

Well, I now have far more interest in reading the books to get a hopefully more satisfactory conclusion, so I guess there’s that.

Not going to do so before he finishes both though. By then the bad taste this appalling ending has left will have gone!

 

[Mani-Man]

First off Dany is a mass murderer that killed thousands of civilians and surrendered troops and she did it in less than 30 minutes. That is why she was killed. It was justice. She is no more a victim than Nazis that were executed for their war crimes.

Jon on the other hand is in fact a victim. He loved Dany, he believed in her, he risked himself and his people and family for her. And she betrayed him. She made him an accomplice in mass murder on a scale unseen in Westerosi history. She then tried to frame her heinous actions as liberation. But even after that he still loved her and wanted to believe she could turn back from her bloodlust, and he gave her a chance, and she made it clear she wouldnt turn back. For her crimes and to stop further brutality he executed her. Rather than just setting aside her actions to be with her he did what was needed and what was right. He chose the people and Westeros over the woman he loved. So yeah, he IS a victim regardless of the fact he has a penis.

Edit: It could be argued that Dany is a victim of circumstance, the choices of people around her, and her own mistakes, and I can certainly agree in that regard that she is a victim, but she isnt a victim for Jon executing her. When you do something like Dany did you dont get to play the victim card when someone kills you for it.

In terms of the story they told...yeah thats the angle that works.
But the story is **** and stupidly written so there is that.
In the bubble where this badly written season 8 walks, what Jon did was "fine", it was necessary and probably the only solution.

That its on all kinds of levels garbage outside that bubble, shouldnt even need to be said.
Alone that they really gone with this incredible dumb "lovers embrace before one kills the other" trope is amateur work.

That whole final scene between Daenerys and Jon was in general bad done all around.
The way it was shot, the dialogue, the effects, lightning and so on...it felt so weird.

It really is insane what they did with the Night King saga. Unforgivable, honestly... it completely ruins it.

All the other stuff... rushed King's landing and what not... I can more or less be cool with. But the battle of the dead was 2 dimensional, and cast aside as meaningless spectacle... like, there's no way they couldn't know it'd be controversial. It was designed to be controversial.

Yeah, hell they even used the "Winter is coming" phrase that the starks have to promote the hell out of the white walkers and night king story.
I have a hard time believing that they always planned it to be this underwhelming or if the decision to end with season 8 turned it into this.

 

[flickchick85]

Not going to do so before he finishes both though. By then the bad taste this appalling ending has left will have gone!

And you'll have more reading time in your nursing home!

 

[ludovica]

Perfection.

 

[Roose Bolton]

First of all, cut the condescending crap. It wasn't my tweet. Secondly, no one is embracing Nazis and stabbing them in the heart. The problem with the way this was done is that Dany wasn't killed after being found guilty of murder and being sentenced to death. Jon embraced her and then killed her, like a coward would. If you can't see the difference between a justified death after a sentencing and a man killing his lover after hugging her, then you have bigger problems.

The point isn't that she should have been allowed to live. The point is that she was killed in a pathetic sneak attack and he's being hailed as a hero.

I mean...what was he supposed to do exactly? He couldn’t arrest her and try her for crimes against humanity. She had what was tantamount to a nuclear weapon at her beck and call, not to mention an army of highly trained automations completely loyal to her. For all intents and purposes she’s untouchable. There’s no situation where she gets brought to justice, it had to be an assassination to end the threat as quickly as possible with the least amount of human life lost.