Gymrats & Stalkers: "I Was Assaulted In A Public Restroom"

[Marx]

In short, it didn't go too badly Joe.

Jason was extremely nervous when we pulled up to the church. He was quiet all morning and didn't even eat breakfast because he said his stomach was upset (I think it's wrong that any religion has enough power to make any person sick like that). Even his hands were sweating.

Anyway, when we got there I was like, "I'll wait for you out here." But he insisted that I go with him. I told him this really wasn't my thing, but he was like please so I went into the joint with him. Interestingly enough, the place was completely devoid of any people...and to be honest it was a little creepy in there because it was so dark with the high ceilings and stain glassed windows. I didn't like the vibe I got from there at all.

Jason wanted me out of earshot as he gave his confession so I don't know how that went. But when he was ready to meet with the priest he motioned me to follow him up these steps to this office off to the side of the podium. The priest was a man in his 70s I'd say. Very friendly and certainly he has a great repore (sp?) with Jason...been knowing him since he was a little boy. Apparently Jase's family went to church a lot when he was younger and then they all just kinda...fell off. I stood by the door behind Jason as he sat down in front of the priest at his desk.

Anyway, when the priest asked Jase why he had asked to meet with him it took Jase like...a full 3 or 4 minutes to speak up. Like literally. I was like, "This guy is never gonna say it." But then Jase took a deep breath and finally blurted out that he and I had been involved sexually and that he couldn't see himself living out the rest of his days without me involved in his life. It probably wasn't the most tactful way of putting it, but at least he kept it real. And the part about living out the rest of his days...that really got me. Jason never talks like that...I mean, he has his moments, but he stays away from the corny mushy stuff. But when he was talking to this priest it was as if he was talking to his father--and I wasn't even in the room.

The priest was noticeably serious/disturbed by what Jason was telling him. He kept looking me up and down and that made me uncomfortable. He started to reach for his Bible and I just shot him the look of death like "You better f***ing NOT damn him". He looked at me and I think he got my memo because he just patted the Bible and kept listening. The more Jason kept talking the more I realized how important this was to him. Then he started wiping back tears and he kept saying "Sorry", or "Excuse Me", but the tears just kept coming. Both the priest and I gave him kleenex at the same time, but I let the priest be the actual one to give it to him.

Jase wanted to know if God still loved him. And the priest said that He did. He then said that God hates what we're doing but that His love for us will always be unconditional. This latter part confused the...ahem, hell...out of me because if God hates what we're doing, then how can his love be without conditions?

Anyway, Jason seemed to be very relieved at the moment the priest said he was still loved by God. It was as if he blanked out and ignored the rest. He smiled a bit, almost in relief. He asked if the priest would marry us. At that point I was like "WTF!?!?!?!" But then Jason qualified the statement by saying hypothetically. In other words, did the church believe in Gay marriage or would it perform those types of unions. The priest said no, but that if we were committed in our hearts that was all we needed.

Jason shook his hand and left, and I just walked out after him. I thought about it and poked my head back through the door and mouthed "Thank you" to the priest and he nodded back. When we came out we realized that the service would be starting soon, because people were filing in. So we stayed for the service which was boring as ever. But afterward, Jason said he felt a lot better. He said that maybe we should get back together because he couldn't think of a better person to burn in hell with than me. He laughed at this, but I was deeply insulted even though I knew he was joking.

We just got back in from taking a walk around the neighborhood and we've talked some things through. I think we might get back together, but I think he still needs some time. Nothing should be powerful to break us up aside from us ourselves--not the Church. And the fact that he can give them that kind of authority over his life deeply disturbs me.

At any rate, I'm moving out Saturday.

...

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

Which part of my report are you ing at?

 

[Marx]

Which part of my report are you ing at?

The whole thing pretty much leaves me speechless...but it makes me sick that those who have such a dedicated faith in God (like priests and pastors) are the first to cast judgement and look down upon others.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

The whole thing pretty much leaves me speechless...but it makes me sick that those who have such a dedicated faith in God (like priests and pastors) are the first to cast judgement and look down upon others.

Like I said, I think that if I hadn't been present the priest would've really made Jason's ears bleed. I wonder if that's why Jase insisted that I go with him? He could've gone alone.

 

[TheDreamMaster]

Man, after all the triumph this has become a very melancholy thread. I'm sorry it's back and forth right now LS, I wish Jason would come around for you. I'd really love to see you leave this thread happily, but as is life, it may not end up as such. I'm thinking of you LS, and really hoping things change for the ebtter for you and Jason.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

Thanks DM. It really has been a rollercoaster. It's funny too because Jason kinda saved my life when I got attacked in that restroom in a physical way. Now I'm trying to save his life in a spiritual one. It's crazy how things turn out.

 

[Hound55]

In short, it didn't go too badly Joe.

Jason was extremely nervous when we pulled up to the church. He was quiet all morning and didn't even eat breakfast because he said his stomach was upset (I think it's wrong that any religion has enough power to make any person sick like that). Even his hands were sweating.

Anyway, when we got there I was like, "I'll wait for you out here." But he insisted that I go with him. I told him this really wasn't my thing, but he was like please so I went into the joint with him. Interestingly enough, the place was completely devoid of any people...and to be honest it was a little creepy in there because it was so dark with the high ceilings and stain glassed windows. I didn't like the vibe I got from there at all.

Jason wanted me out of earshot as he gave his confession so I don't know how that went. But when he was ready to meet with the priest he motioned me to follow him up these steps to this office off to the side of the podium. The priest was a man in his 70s I'd say. Very friendly and certainly he has a great repore (sp?) with Jason...been knowing him since he was a little boy. Apparently Jase's family went to church a lot when he was younger and then they all just kinda...fell off. I stood by the door behind Jason as he sat down in front of the priest at his desk.

Anyway, when the priest asked Jase why he had asked to meet with him it took Jase like...a full 3 or 4 minutes to speak up. Like literally. I was like, "This guy is never gonna say it." But then Jase took a deep breath and finally blurted out that he and I had been involved sexually and that he couldn't see himself living out the rest of his days without me involved in his life. It probably wasn't the most tactful way of putting it, but at least he kept it real. And the part about living out the rest of his days...that really got me. Jason never talks like that...I mean, he has his moments, but he stays away from the corny mushy stuff. But when he was talking to this priest it was as if he was talking to his father--and I wasn't even in the room.

The priest was noticeably serious/disturbed by what Jason was telling him. He kept looking me up and down and that made me uncomfortable. He started to reach for his Bible and I just shot him the look of death like "You better f***ing NOT damn him". He looked at me and I think he got my memo because he just patted the Bible and kept listening. The more Jason kept talking the more I realized how important this was to him. Then he started wiping back tears and he kept saying "Sorry", or "Excuse Me", but the tears just kept coming. Both the priest and I gave him kleenex at the same time, but I let the priest be the actual one to give it to him.

Jase wanted to know if God still loved him. And the priest said that He did. He then said that God hates what we're doing but that His love for us will always be unconditional. This latter part confused the...ahem, hell...out of me because if God hates what we're doing, then how can his love be without conditions?

Anyway, Jason seemed to be very relieved at the moment the priest said he was still loved by God. It was as if he blanked out and ignored the rest. He smiled a bit, almost in relief. He asked if the priest would marry us. At that point I was like "WTF!?!?!?!" But then Jason qualified the statement by saying hypothetically. In other words, did the church believe in Gay marriage or would it perform those types of unions. The priest said no, but that if we were committed in our hearts that was all we needed.

Jason shook his hand and left, and I just walked out after him. I thought about it and poked my head back through the door and mouthed "Thank you" to the priest and he nodded back. When we came out we realized that the service would be starting soon, because people were filing in. So we stayed for the service which was boring as ever. But afterward, Jason said he felt a lot better. He said that maybe we should get back together because he couldn't think of a better person to burn in hell with than me. He laughed at this, but I was deeply insulted even though I knew he was joking.

We just got back in from taking a walk around the neighborhood and we've talked some things through. I think we might get back together, but I think he still needs some time. Nothing should be powerful to break us up aside from us ourselves--not the Church. And the fact that he can give them that kind of authority over his life deeply disturbs me.

At any rate, I'm moving out Saturday.

None of that is PARTICULARLY surprising.

As I said before, a conversation with the priest was always going to be a better option than just a straight confession.

That way the priest, whom Jason has known long term is more likely to address multiple aspects of your situation rather than just "Here's your punishment."

As for the bit in bold... that's about what I'd have hoped he'd have been saying... its about as liberal as you could hope from the Catholic church from what I know of them. Although I think it was a poor choice of words to explain their view (from what I can ascertain) of the situation.

Why?

Well, I think he was meaning "Unconditional" in the terms that EVERYONE is capable of receiving God's love no matter what they've done, but its not unconditional because there are conditions to it... Yes, they're capable of being under God's love but they have to seek repentance for their sins. So even a mass-murderer would still be capable of falling under the being under God's love if they take the right actions and repent for those transgressions.

And he doesn't have the power to damn you either... sure he could fling some holy water around, screaming "The power of Christ compels you!" (its what happens when teachers realise detention and corporal punishment don't work...) but the final word isn't really in his court on that one...

Also, for future reference, it's rapport, mate. Keep us posted!

 

[AndThePickles]

The whole thing pretty much leaves me speechless...but it makes me sick that those who have such a dedicated faith in God (like priests and pastors) are the first to cast judgement and look down upon others.

That's a lot of why I stopped going to church...full of some of the most judgmental people I've ever seen, but meanwhile they were going around having affairs within the church congregation and keeping their own sins secret.

 

[Colossal Spoons]

The whole thing pretty much leaves me speechless...but it makes me sick that those who have such a dedicated faith in God (like priests and pastors) are the first to cast judgement and look down upon others.

Who in LS' story was being judgmental; the priest? Or do you just mean in general?

 

[Cuyan]

This story is long and wordy. Can someone sum it up into bullet points? Some of us have short attentio

 

[Marx]

That's a lot of why I stopped going to church...full of some of the most judgmental people I've ever seen, but meanwhile they were going around having affairs within the church congregation and keeping their own sins secret.

When I was very young, I attended church with a friend and his family. (I can't remember what denomination the church was.) There was point in the service where everyone was asked to put their head down and discreetly raise their hand if they had something they wanted to ask forgiveness for. My friend dared me to raise my hand, so I did. The nun came up to me and asked me to go with her. She never asked me what I wanted forgiveness for she just said 'let's pray'. I very honestly told her that I didn't know how to...instead of being comforting and understanding, the woman chose to ridicule me in front of the church. That experience, combined with the hypocritical and judgemental actions of the overly religious have really turned me off churches.

I am strongly of the belief that you do not have to attend chuch to be religious or spiritual.

Who in LS' story was being judgmental; the priest? Or do you just mean in general?

I meant it more as a general statement.

 

[amazingfantasy15]

Like I said, I think that if I hadn't been present the priest would've really made Jason's ears bleed. I wonder if that's why Jase insisted that I go with him? He could've gone alone.

It could've also been that he wanted you there because this was a trial run for telling his family. If the guy is a C&E (Christmas and Easter) Catholic his faith doesn't mean nearly as much to him as he's letting on. I really think he's just testing the waters in terms of coming out to friends and family. Not taking into account the short break you took, you two are getting to the point in most relationships where you'd start introducing each other to friends and family and this has got to be really scaring Jason because introducing you also means coming out.

 

[mrvlknight21]

I am strongly of the belief that you do not have to attend chuch to be religious or spiritual.



The priest...

I agree with the first part, I think that is obvious.

However, I dont see how the priest is being judgmental. He went by the book that governs the religion. He told Jason that God still loves him, but hates the sin.

 

[Matt]

The whole thing pretty much leaves me speechless...but it makes me sick that those who have such a dedicated faith in God (like priests and pastors) are the first to cast judgement and look down upon others.

It doesn't seem to me like he was being judgemental at all.

Like I said, I think that if I hadn't been present the priest would've really made Jason's ears bleed. I wonder if that's why Jase insisted that I go with him? He could've gone alone.

You give yourself too much credit. The priest would've said the same damn thing. We're (Catholics) are not baptists. Only extremists try to brainwash people or change them. Priests are not stern, evil, old men. They are humans and most of the ones I meant are incredibly compassionate and kind. Kind and compassionate enough to dedicate themselves to a celibate life style of helping others. They are not looking to make anyone's "ears bleed." They are there to help. I owe a lot to the one who helped me get through some personal issues last year.

I agree with the first part, I think that is obvious.

However, I dont see how the priest is being judgmental. He went by the book that governs the religion. He told Jason that God still loves him, but hates the sin.

I agree. I don't see what is judgemental about it. Its like LS, Marx, and a few others are saying the priest was judgemental for stating his beliefs (when asked about them by Jason no less), yet then they turn around and condemn the beliefs. Isn't that being just as judgemental?

 

[AndThePickles]

Ah, I took Marx's statement as a blanket one. So now I'm curious, too...Marx, what specifically do you think he did that was judgmental? It seems to me that anything really judgmental is just what LS hypothesized that he would say if he had Jason alone. While I certainly agree that there are a lot of judgmental religious people out there, it seems that this particular priest was pretty kind about the whole thing.

 

[Marx]

I meant it as a more general statement.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

It could've also been that he wanted you there because this was a trial run for telling his family. If the guy is a C&E (Christmas and Easter) Catholic his faith doesn't mean nearly as much to him as he's letting on. I really think he's just testing the waters in terms of coming out to friends and family. Not taking into account the short break you took, you two are getting to the point in most relationships where you'd start introducing each other to friends and family and this has got to be really scaring Jason because introducing you also means coming out.

Good point.

Although I have a hard time imagining Jason introducing me to his family as his significant other. I asked him today if his experience with the priest yesterday encouraged him to come forward to his family and friends. And he said that he just needed to get it straight with God and me--not anyone else. He used the priest to get it straight with God. Now he's waiting for my answer on whether we are going to go forward with this relationship.

I agree with you: I doubt that Jason is this super holy religious person. He says his faith "means everything" yet up until now he's never said much about his faith. He wears a cross around his neck but aside from that...meh. He strikes me as the type that turns to God only when he is in trouble and needs His help...like on a deathbed or something. I know that family is important to him though. Maybe not the same level as David (Italians are the most passionate family people I have ever seen--nothing is thicker than their blood), but he's close to them nonetheless.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

Like I said, I think that if I hadn't been present the priest would've really made Jason's ears bleed. I wonder if that's why Jase insisted that I go with him? He could've gone alone.

He also probably views you as his support. =l

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

He also probably views you as his support. =l

Yeah. And I do support him. I love him (obviously). He's mad at me that I'm moving out which is weird because before we took our "break" he was all for me getting this brownstone in the Heights.

You give yourself too much credit. The priest would've said the same damn thing. We're (Catholics) are not baptists. Only extremists try to brainwash people or change them.

Really? I dunno. He was reaching for his Bible like he was getting ready to show Jase that what we are doing is condemned by God. When I gave him a look like "Please don't go there" I also shook my head. I think that signal made him think differently because I could tell by the shaking and quavering in Jason's voice that he was close to tears. When the priest also saw that he was getting emotional it was at that point that he left the Bible alone and simply said God still loves you.

I think he was getting ready to damn him with the Bible.

 

[AndThePickles]

He clearly didn't want to break up in the first place. The man is all kinds of crazy for you!

 

[Darthphere]

Really? I dunno. He was reaching for his Bible like he was getting ready to show Jase that what we are doing is condemned by God. When I gave him a look like "Please don't go there" I also shook my head. I think that signal made him think differently because I could tell by the shaking and quavering in Jason's voice that he was close to tears. When the priest also saw that he was getting emotional it was at that point that he left the Bible alone and simply said God still loves you.

I think he was getting ready to damn him with the Bible.

Well, that's kind of why he's there. You guys went to him, it's not like he was roaming the streets throwing judgment lightning bolts at gay couples he saw. His job is to preach the word of God. And unfortunately, the word of God states pretty clearly his stance on homosexuality.

 

[mrvlknight21]

I meant it as a more general statement.

Marx, I see you edited your original statement in regards to that. You originally said "the priest."

Really? I dunno. He was reaching for his Bible like he was getting ready to show Jase that what we are doing is condemned by God. When I gave him a look like "Please don't go there" I also shook my head. I think that signal made him think differently because I could tell by the shaking and quavering in Jason's voice that he was close to tears. When the priest also saw that he was getting emotional it was at that point that he left the Bible alone and simply said God still loves you.

I think he was getting ready to damn him with the Bible.

Maybe he was going to read him the Bible passages that show where God condemns homosexuality AND that God loves the sinner regardless.

 

[piccolo]

Whoa.

Dont take this the wrong way, but this is intense and dramatic in a way a hetero relationship could never be. Or at least that i've heard of or experienced. Like some real "i'm fighting for my soul" ****.

Its too bad that this is what gay guys have to go through. Crazy. And also dont take this the wrong way but this is also making me glad i'm straight. This is some insane ****. I dont think i'm made of the stuff to deal with this the way you are. I dont think im strong enough to be gay. haha

Rooting for you guys btw.

 

[Marx]

Marx, I see you edited your original statement in regards to that. You originally said "the priest".

Originally, I did say that. What I meant to say and what I said didn't match up. It's not the first time that people have corrected what they said.

As far as the priest goes, I do think it was judgemental for the priest to look LS up and down in disdain.

 

[amazingfantasy15]

Good point.

Although I have a hard time imagining Jason introducing me to his family as his significant other. I asked him today if his experience with the priest yesterday encouraged him to come forward to his family and friends. And he said that he just needed to get it straight with God and me--not anyone else. He used the priest to get it straight with God. Now he's waiting for my answer on whether we are going to go forward with this relationship.

I agree with you: I doubt that Jason is this super holy religious person. He says his faith "means everything" yet up until now he's never said much about his faith. He wears a cross around his neck but aside from that...meh. He strikes me as the type that turns to God only when he is in trouble and needs His help...like on a deathbed or something. I know that family is important to him though. Maybe not the same level as David (Italians are the most passionate family people I have ever seen--nothing is thicker than their blood), but he's close to them nonetheless.

Well you also had a hard time imagining him going to the gay club, hell you had a hard time imagining he was gay or bi at first. The guy is taking steps and if you do stay together sooner or later his friends and family will find out.