The Dark Knight Harvey Dent/Two Face Thread

[I Am The Knight]

Ok I just watched this again. Pay very close attention to the second shot of Two-Face lying on the ground in the end, particularly his stomach. There is definitely a slight pulse or breathing motion going on there. I'm 100% certain.

Now I don't know if this is an indication that Two-Face is in fact alive or whether it's a flaw in Eckhart's performance, but he is definitely breathing.

Look for it.

Edit: Damn it, I posted in the wrong thread.

I hope you're right.

 

[jsf]

I hope you're right.

yeah when I went to see it for the 2nd time, I was looking for that... but you can't really see anything. It's just mainly the motion of the camera and the lighting, etc.

 

[GhostPoet]

Of course he was breathing...the actor wasn't dead. =P Just playing it. heheh

 

[Mdizzle]

I kinda feel the same way too, especially with Two-Face. I wouldn't want him to become a standard, cliche bad guy. Now I'm sure if Ledger were alive, Nolan and co. could've probably written an awesome extension of his character in a third film...but with him gone, it would feel too forced in bring in another actor...it would also stretch the suspension of disbelief that the Joker could continue to terrorize the city unstopped after already being apprehended by Batman. Imo, a better idea for the third film would be to bring in fresh villains...with may be a passing reference or nod to the Joker being locked in Arkham, and/or prosecuted.

I agree with this. And after Heath's stellar turn as the Joker, I would certainly appreciate the third movie mentioning a little something about him. A bit of closure to a plot/storyline that will never truly be concluded...

 

[Keyser Soze]

I agree with this. And after Heath's stellar turn as the Joker, I would certainly appreciate the third movie mentioning a little something about him. A bit of closure to a plot/storyline that will never truly be concluded...

If "The Dark Knight" showed us anything, it's that Nolan isn't going to cover the same ground in his sequels. As a result, I'd probably expect the third Batman film (if there is one) to be as different to "The Dark Knight" as "The Dark Knight" is different to "Batman Begins". Different feel, different pace, and yes...different antagonists.

If Heath Ledger was alive, most likely his appearance s The Joker in the third film would be a continuity-maintaining cameo, in the vein of Crane in TDK, before promptly moving on to the new antagonists.

 

[Mdizzle]

If "The Dark Knight" showed us anything, it's that Nolan isn't going to cover the same ground in his sequels. As a result, I'd probably expect the third Batman film (if there is one) to be as different to "The Dark Knight" as "The Dark Knight" is different to "Batman Begins". Different feel, different pace, and yes...different antagonists.

If Heath Ledger was alive, most likely his appearance s The Joker in the third film would be a continuity-maintaining cameo, in the vein of Crane in TDK, before promptly moving on to the new antagonists.

I agree with that, but what I'm saying is that I'd appreciate the nod to the Joker, an acknowledgment so to speak. I don't expect the third film to continue in the same direction as TDK necessarily or at all; however I think even a brief mention of the Joker would be a nice touch. I think having that mention would act the part of closure for the fans...especially knowing that, in all likelihood, it wouldn't even be possible to continue the Joker's storyline without Heath.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Saying something about Joker being at Arkham would be a nice touch

 

[Mdizzle]

Exactly.

 

[Keyser Soze]

I agree with that, but what I'm saying is that I'd appreciate the nod to the Joker, an acknowledgment so to speak. I don't expect the third film to continue in the same direction as TDK necessarily or at all; however I think even a brief mention of the Joker would be a nice touch. I think having that mention would act the part of closure for the fans...especially knowing that, in all likelihood, it wouldn't even be possible to continue the Joker's storyline without Heath.

Absolutely, I was agreeing with you. I was saying that a recast is not only unlikely, but also unnecessary, as a couple of lines referring to him being in Arkham - as you suggest - would largely fulfil the same purpose as such a Joker cameo would have.

 

[Mdizzle]

Oh right, heh. I was just so blown away by what we were given in TDK...it would be too hard to top that.

I was also definitely drawn in by Eckhart/Dent's charisma...coupled with a hint of vulnerability. Good stuff all around...which is likely why I can't stop posting about it

 

[CristiMAN]

I do believe Harvey will be the backbone of the third. He is not dead. To me his funeral is staged to make him a martir and a white knight for real. And locked deep. Batman has now to deal with a city that not only fears him: it hates him. And a Villain that has some personal business to deal with him.

 

[chetdenim]

Dent was amazing in the movie and Two-Face was class as well. I also thought the way he was scarred was great, it threw of those of us expecting the good old court room scene.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

If "The Dark Knight" showed us anything, it's that Nolan isn't going to cover the same ground in his sequels. As a result, I'd probably expect the third Batman film (if there is one) to be as different to "The Dark Knight" as "The Dark Knight" is different to "Batman Begins". Different feel, different pace, and yes...different antagonists.

If Heath Ledger was alive, most likely his appearance s The Joker in the third film would be a continuity-maintaining cameo, in the vein of Crane in TDK, before promptly moving on to the new antagonists.

I doubt it. If Ledger were alive, to entertain that notion, it's not quite the same as Crane in Begins. Scarecrow was a side character to begin with, a lackey for the League of Shadows, and a filler for when Batman finally had his final showdown with Ra's Al Ghul. The difference between Ra's and the Joker/Two-Face is Ra's was strictly an origin centric villain. He was tried to the movie through Bruce's training to be Batman. Now that Bruce is Batman, that storyline is immaterial.

Batman, however, lives and works out of Gotham mostly, so unless the next movie will take him somewhere away from that setting it's not unreasonable to surmise that Joker and any of the other Gotham familiars would be kicking around. Unlike Scarecrow though, you have a legitimate and much more compelling and thematic threat with either Harvey Dent or the Joker. They aren't just idle throwaways. You can't have Joker try to knock over some bank, just to be caught by Batman; it would directly go against the grand nature of the character they set up.

It would be not unlike bringing back Lex Luthor in a Superman movie and not doing something major with him, or doing an X-Men film with Magneto and having him be a throwaway villain. It simply wouldn't fly.

 

[CristiMAN]

I believe Aaron did sign for two films. Correct me, but remember reading in these foruns a year ago...

Two face is the main villain in the third. As it should be.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

I believe Aaron did sign for two films. Correct me, but remember reading in these foruns a year ago...

Two face is the main villain in the third. As it should be.

He did sign on for two, back when he was cast. That may mean nothing though, as several dead franchise villains and heroes have signed for multiple movie in the past.

 

[David Rice]

I do believe Harvey will be the backbone of the third. He is not dead. To me his funeral is staged to make him a martir and a white knight for real. And locked deep. Batman has now to deal with a city that not only fears him: it hates him. And a Villain that has some personal business to deal with him.

Sorry to burst your bubble man, but he's dead. I wish he wasn't, but he is.

I believe Aaron did sign for two films. Correct me, but remember reading in these foruns a year ago...

Two face is the main villain in the third. As it should be.

That doesn't really mean anything. I'm willing to bet that we will not see Two Face again.

 

[David Rice]

How could two face even be casual about walking around with wounds that bad? IMO Not possible.

He didn't care!

A.Two Face is missing all of his left cheek and the majority of his left lips. With injuries like that there is no way possible that he wouldn't have a speech impediment.

B.Two Face only has one eyelid. Without an eyelid his left eye in about a minute it would start to cause him harm over time he would go blind in that eye and the actual eyeball would begin to deform.

C.Some movements Two Face makes are physically impossible to make with the missing muscles/injuries he has.

Are you a doctor? And so what if you're right, who cares? He was awesome! t:

 

[LastSunrise1981]

I have a question for everyone.

Spoiler

Did anyone jump when he shot Batman? When he flipped the coin I was expecting him to say something, but the gunshot just happened so quick, and on top of that it was VERY loud. I definitely jumped when he shot Batman in the stomach.

 

[DACrowe]

I don't intend to get much into the Dent is dead/alive debate. There is a thread that is revolving in an endless circle for that already.

But I will say that it is worth noting that Nolan doesn't like to repeat himself. He cut to the meat and deepest stuff of Two-Face's character and motivation in the Dark Knight. He needs convincing to do this one at a time and that is why a third movie isn't even set in stone. I imagine if he does one he'll want to it to at least be something new, fresh and original, even if he cannot top TDK.

That is another reason why I don't think we'll see Two-Face again. He wants to move on.

With that said Eckhart was simply amazing in this movie. I agree he (and Oldman and Bale as well) are being completely overlooked because of Ledger's amazing turn. While I think at this point Ledger DESERVES an Oscar for what he did with JOker, Echart's Dent should be nominated. Though there is no chance of that. But Dent is the emotional centerpiece of this movie and his arc from hero to villain and from Batman's idol-almost to needed martyr is all very fascinating. Echart played the part so well there is an enormous sense of sadness seeing what he is reduced to and still at the end when he is holding a gun to a child's head much of the sympathy has faded in way of a truly pathetic and selfish villain. Yet his "death," when Batman turns his head to the good side is still very moving, poignant and the symbolic point of the movie. That is the main reason I don't want to see Two-Face back. It was so wel ldone and I think in those final five minutes said everything that needed to be said.

With that said, sorry, I'd like to see a cameo for Joker in the third movie. Just Batman going to Arkham some reason (maybe seek advice reluctantly from Dr. Crane) and on the way to his room he passes The Joker's, which is marked unnamed or unknown. When he passes we get a shot from the inside of a figure with green hair perched in a shadowy corner giggling "Why so serious" to Batman who ignores him as walks by.

Just my little idea.

 

[DACrowe]

I have a question for everyone.

Spoiler

Did anyone jump when he shot Batman? When he flipped the coin I was expecting him to say something, but the gunshot just happened so quick, and on top of that it was VERY loud. I definitely jumped when he shot Batman in the stomach.

I did (I also jumped at "say it" and when the fake Batman hit the window).

Anyway that reminds me, did Batman's armor stop the bullet? Because in BB Fox says the armor can stop anything but a straight shot, and he downgraded for more flexibility and speed/agility into this suit that surely couldn't have taken a straight shot. So if he has a bullet in his gut, how did he survive? Much less a fall and escape police chasing him, get back to his penthouse and get medical attention discretely? And if he was bleeding then Bruce Wayne's blood dripped when they were chasing Batman through a crime scene.

Am I overthinking this?

 

[David Rice]

I don't intend to get much into the Dent is dead/alive debate. There is a thread that is revolving in an endless circle for that already.

But I will say that it is worth noting that Nolan doesn't like to repeat himself. He cut to the meat and deepest stuff of Two-Face's character and motivation in the Dark Knight. He needs convincing to do this one at a time and that is why a third movie isn't even set in stone. I imagine if he does one he'll want to it to at least be something new, fresh and original, even if he cannot top TDK.

That is another reason why I don't think we'll see Two-Face again. He wants to move on.

With that said Eckhart was simply amazing in this movie. I agree he (and Oldman and Bale as well) are being completely overlooked because of Ledger's amazing turn. While I think at this point Ledger DESERVES an Oscar for what he did with JOker, Echart's Dent should be nominated. Though there is no chance of that. But Dent is the emotional centerpiece of this movie and his arc from hero to villain and from Batman's idol-almost to needed martyr is all very fascinating. Echart played the part so well there is an enormous sense of sadness seeing what he is reduced to and still at the end when he is holding a gun to a child's head much of the sympathy has faded in way of a truly pathetic and selfish villain. Yet his "death," when Batman turns his head to the good side is still very moving, poignant and the symbolic point of the movie. That is the main reason I don't want to see Two-Face back. It was so wel ldone and I think in those final five minutes said everything that needed to be said.

With that said, sorry, I'd like to see a cameo for Joker in the third movie. Just Batman going to Arkham some reason (maybe seek advice reluctantly from Dr. Crane) and on the way to his room he passes The Joker's, which is marked unnamed or unknown. When he passes we get a shot from the inside of a figure with green hair perched in a shadowy corner giggling "Why so serious" to Batman who ignores him as walks by.

Just my little idea.

Nice, I couldn't agree more. Send your ideas to Nolan!

 

[David Rice]

I did (I also jumped at "say it" and when the fake Batman hit the window).

Anyway that reminds me, did Batman's armor stop the bullet? Because in BB Fox says the armor can stop anything but a straight shot, and he downgraded for more flexibility and speed/agility into this suit that surely couldn't have taken a straight shot. So if he has a bullet in his gut, how did he survive? Much less a fall and escape police chasing him, get back to his penthouse and get medical attention discretely? And if he was bleeding then Bruce Wayne's blood dripped when they were chasing Batman through a crime scene.

Am I overthinking this?

I think the Kevlar parts would stop the bullet. If those parts are removed then he would be screwed.

 

[TDK86]

I don't intend to get much into the Dent is dead/alive debate. There is a thread that is revolving in an endless circle for that already.

But I will say that it is worth noting that Nolan doesn't like to repeat himself. He cut to the meat and deepest stuff of Two-Face's character and motivation in the Dark Knight. He needs convincing to do this one at a time and that is why a third movie isn't even set in stone. I imagine if he does one he'll want to it to at least be something new, fresh and original, even if he cannot top TDK.

That is another reason why I don't think we'll see Two-Face again. He wants to move on.

With that said Eckhart was simply amazing in this movie. I agree he (and Oldman and Bale as well) are being completely overlooked because of Ledger's amazing turn. While I think at this point Ledger DESERVES an Oscar for what he did with JOker, Echart's Dent should be nominated. Though there is no chance of that. But Dent is the emotional centerpiece of this movie and his arc from hero to villain and from Batman's idol-almost to needed martyr is all very fascinating. Echart played the part so well there is an enormous sense of sadness seeing what he is reduced to and still at the end when he is holding a gun to a child's head much of the sympathy has faded in way of a truly pathetic and selfish villain. Yet his "death," when Batman turns his head to the good side is still very moving, poignant and the symbolic point of the movie. That is the main reason I don't want to see Two-Face back. It was so wel ldone and I think in those final five minutes said everything that needed to be said.

With that said, sorry, I'd like to see a cameo for Joker in the third movie. Just Batman going to Arkham some reason (maybe seek advice reluctantly from Dr. Crane) and on the way to his room he passes The Joker's, which is marked unnamed or unknown. When he passes we get a shot from the inside of a figure with green hair perched in a shadowy corner giggling "Why so serious" to Batman who ignores him as walks by.

Just my little idea.

Agreed

 

[LastSunrise1981]

I did (I also jumped at "say it" and when the fake Batman hit the window).

Anyway that reminds me, did Batman's armor stop the bullet? Because in BB Fox says the armor can stop anything but a straight shot, and he downgraded for more flexibility and speed/agility into this suit that surely couldn't have taken a straight shot. So if he has a bullet in his gut, how did he survive? Much less a fall and escape police chasing him, get back to his penthouse and get medical attention discretely? And if he was bleeding then Bruce Wayne's blood dripped when they were chasing Batman through a crime scene.

Am I overthinking this?

I'm sure he had some extra armor underneath the suit.

Spoiler

I jumped at the "SAY IT!!!" line too. But Batman getting shot by Two-Face after the coin toss caught me off guard.

 

[Marx]

I'm sure he had some extra armor underneath the suit.

Spoiler

I jumped at the "SAY IT!!!" line too. But Batman getting shot by Two-Face after the coin toss caught me off guard.

Spoiler

I jumped when the fake batman hit the window, the "SAY IT" line, and when Two-Face shot Batman.