Has the Kingpin's empire been permanently destroyed?

[The Overlord]

Has the Kingpin's empire been permanently destroyed? Fisk is now in prison, with no resources, no influence and not many allies left, surrounded by enemies and he has been shot, how can the Kingpin recover from all that?

 

[The Question]

Simple. Break bones and take lives until people of the criminal persuasion respect him again, and rebuild.

 

[The Overlord]

Simple. Break bones and take lives until people of the criminal persuasion respect him again, and rebuild.

Not simple, first he has to get out of prison and not break out, he has to beat the charges, then has deal with several crime bosses who now have far more men and resources than him and an underworld that has become increasing hostile towards him (see Hardcore) and has do that before DD shuts him before he can get really started (again also seen in Hardcore).

 

[ampersand]

Simple. Break bones and take lives until people of the criminal persuasion respect him again, and rebuild.

Wow, you make it seem like such an easy thing, building a criminal empire.

 

[The Question]

Of course it isn't easy, but it would basically be retracing old steps with Fisk. He's got enough of a reputation to get enough people to fall into line. And he's ruthless enough to hold hostages, murder children, and otherwise do what's necessairy to insure that no one tries to take his territory. It's not like he's some fresh face in the underworld.

 

[PhotoJones]

Not simple, first he has to get out of prison and not break out, he has to beat the charges, then has deal with several crime bosses who now have far more men and resources than him and an underworld that has become increasing hostile towards him (see Hardcore) and has do that before DD shuts him before he can get really started (again also seen in Hardcore).

for someone like the kingpin, nothing is out of reach.

he's lost his empire before. if i remember correctly, he once became "too hot" to work here in the states and relocated to japan, involving himself in the spice trade. that is, until he built enough capital and was able to reassume control over new york's underworld.

 

[The Overlord]

for someone like the kingpin, nothing is out of reach.

he's lost his empire before. if i remember correctly, he once became "too hot" to work here in the states and relocated to japan, involving himself in the spice trade. that is, until he built enough capital and was able to reassume control over new york's underworld.

He moved because his wife wanted him to quit his criminal life, so he did and moved to Japan, was forced back into the crime business by his old mob lieutenants. He has rebuilt his empire before (though his empire has never fully covered from the damage inflicted upon it in the Last Rites arc) but he is never bheen in such a weak position before, he is wounded, in jail, his wife has taken all of his money, and he has no allies or influence left, how is he supposed to recover from that?

 

[The Question]

He has the one thing that matters most in the underworld. His reputation. He's gained an almost mythic status as New York's capo di tutti capi.d take a good deal of work, but he could recover.

 

[The Overlord]

Of course it isn't easy, but it would basically be retracing old steps with Fisk. He's got enough of a reputation to get enough people to fall into line. And he's ruthless enough to hold hostages, murder children, and otherwise do what's necessairy to insure that no one tries to take his territory. It's not like he's some fresh face in the underworld.

I think his rep would have been destroyed after DD beat him up, strapped him to a car and drove through Hell's Kitchen and then drove the car through Josie' Bar, with DD declaring himself the new Kingpin, which is what happened in the Hardcore arc. After that display, unless Fisk killed DD, he could never really regain the respect from the mobs.

Also most of the city's other crime bosses may not be as clever him, but they just as ruthless, a lot of them are psychopaths who have no family and don't care about anyone but themsleves, so taking hostages and murdering children is going to do jack to them (I never seen Jigsaw or the Owl, for example, care about anyone besides themselves.) Not mention these crime bosses would already have their turf etablished when Fisk and DD were in prison, they would have superior resources and man power to what Fisk could scrap up if he gets out of jail. Fisk would have to do something amazing to regain his position (unless the writers use plot devicing writing to have him regain his position, which would be a lame cop out.)

 

[The Leaguer]

I hope it's permanently destroyed. I'm so f***ing sick of that guy.

 

[The Overlord]

He has the one thing that matters most in the underworld. His reputation. He's gained an almost mythic status as New York's capo di tutti capi.d take a good deal of work, but he could recover.

Which was destroyed when DD strapped him to a car, drove through Hell's Kitchen, crashed into Josie's bar and told everyone that he would be the Kingpin, he more or less put Kingpin's battered body on display before a bunch of low lives, how is his rep supposed to recover from that?

 

[KevanG]

I thought the Kingpins wife died... or did she get better off-panel? Geez, death must be on vacation in the marvel universe most of the time :P

 

[Anubis]

Last time I saw her she put a bullet in her son's head.

Anyway, Kingpin could just as easily run the show from a jail cell. He did it in Spider-Girl. But I'd like to see a new syndicate take over. And I think the guy to do it is Norman Osborne. It's time to abandon this Spidey fixation and take up crime on a world wide scale. Time to make him a real threat to the Marvel Universe. Or at least all the street level heros. His professional career is ruined, so he may as well take on a career as criminal mastermind. I mean, wasn't that what he originally wanted anyway?

 

[The Overlord]

I thought the Kingpins wife died... or did she get better off-panel? Geez, death must be on vacation in the marvel universe most of the time :P

No his wife never died, she still alive, she took all of her husband money, killed her son and moved to Europe, she never died.

 

[The Overlord]

Last time I saw her she put a bullet in her son's head.

Anyway, Kingpin could just as easily run the show from a jail cell. He did it in Spider-Girl. But I'd like to see a new syndicate take over. And I think the guy to do it is Norman Osborne. It's time to abandon this Spidey fixation and take up crime on a world wide scale. Time to make him a real threat to the Marvel Universe. Or at least all the street level heros. His professional career is ruined, so he may as well take on a career as criminal mastermind. I mean, wasn't that what he originally wanted anyway?

Osborn's too insane too take over the kingpin's role and at this point his obession with Spider-Man is far too important to simply abandon at this point his clashes with Spider-Man are the only thing that brining meaning to his life, that's not something changes over night. Osborn's too choatic to run a Kingpin style organization, look at Osaorp, it likely went down the toliet when Gobby was revealed to be Osborn.

No someone more low key would work better, I was thinking perhaps a new Masked Marauder (perhaps just like the Marauder this time). It would be good to give DD a mysterious foe, the only problem is how to keep him interesting after his ID is revealed.

 

[Harlekin]

Last time I saw her she put a bullet in her son's head.

Anyway, Kingpin could just as easily run the show from a jail cell. He did it in Spider-Girl. But I'd like to see a new syndicate take over. And I think the guy to do it is Norman Osborne. It's time to abandon this Spidey fixation and take up crime on a world wide scale. Time to make him a real threat to the Marvel Universe. Or at least all the street level heros. His professional career is ruined, so he may as well take on a career as criminal mastermind. I mean, wasn't that what he originally wanted anyway?

Meh, I'm sick of Norman Osborn. Kingpin can rot in jail for a while too.

 

[Willowhugger]

Yeah, in Marvel, realism occasionally takes a backseat. Kingpin will be back.

 

[dmor173]

wasnt kingpin already virtually in the gutter during 'guardian devil'? or at least by his standards. i remember a quote where mysterio says something like it once would have cost you a million dollars for an audience with the kingpin, but when a man has fallen its amazing how far 50,000 will get you.

But i hope he comes back. his main weapon is his rep. if some guy walks in and says hes taking over your drug business, you;d probaly shoot him, but if the kingpin walked in and said it, you never know what else is going on.

So i can see him coming back pretty easily. He doesnt even really need to be exonerated, he makes a living by breaking the law. Why does he even give a **** about how he looks? I like him being a known crook, who no cop will touch because the kingpin owns all the judges and the such.

 

[Willowhugger]

On some level though, I honestly wish that Richard Fisk would take over. I really love the Rose and he's always an effective villain (even when the identity was "borrowed" by the fake Rose under Don Fortuna). I hate that Vanessa killed him.

 

[The Overlord]

wasnt kingpin already virtually in the gutter during 'guardian devil'? or at least by his standards. i remember a quote where mysterio says something like it once would have cost you a million dollars for an audience with the kingpin, but when a man has fallen its amazing how far 50,000 will get you.

But i hope he comes back. his main weapon is his rep. if some guy walks in and says hes taking over your drug business, you;d probaly shoot him, but if the kingpin walked in and said it, you never know what else is going on.

So i can see him coming back pretty easily. He doesnt even really need to be exonerated, he makes a living by breaking the law. Why does he even give a **** about how he looks? I like him being a known crook, who no cop will touch because the kingpin owns all the judges and the such.

How can Kingpin own the judges, when most of his money and influence is now gone?