HBO's True Detective - Part 2

[Doctor Jones]

This season I sense is kind of Temple of Doom-ing it. Completely different from it's previous praised story but gets a mixed response. And like Raiders, season one was lightening in a bottle that really struck a chord. I just hope Pizzolatto doesn't do what Spielberg did in Last Crusade and return to the familiarity and comfort of what people liked originally. I want him to be just as bold the next season as he does it here. Not cater to people who just want season one again because this season didn't quite click with everybody. It's fine people don't care for this season as much, just don't do things for the wrong reasons. He should just stick to his guns.

This season is like Chinatown meets L.A. Confidential meets Mulholland Drive.

What I'm hankering for is that I haven't heard Pizzolatto talk about these episodes yet. Goddammit, I need to know. It's probably for the sake of keeping the mystery this season whereas last season since it was its first it seemed kind of obligatory. But I just loved listening to what Pizzolatto had to say.

 

[Man in the Suit]

This season I sense is kind of Temple of Doom-ing it. Completely different from it's previous praised story but gets a mixed response. And like Raiders, season one was lightening in a bottle that really struck a chord. I just hope Pizzolatto doesn't do what Spielberg did in Last Crusade and return to the familiarity and comfort of what people liked originally. I want him to be just as bold the next season as he does it here. Not cater to people who just want season one again because this season didn't quite click with everybody. It's fine people don't care for this season as much, just don't do things for the wrong reasons. He should just stick to his guns.

This season is like Chinatown meets L.A. Confidential meets Mulholland Drive.

What I'm hankering for is that I haven't heard Pizzolatto talk about these episodes yet. Goddammit, I need to know. It's probably for the sake of keeping the mystery this season whereas last season since it was its first it seemed kind of obligatory. But I just loved listening to what Pizzolatto had to say.

Agreed. I'm loving this season.

It's weird that professional critics (Sepinwall) were confused why Ray, Ani, and Paul were ambushed with a gunfight. Did they not see the ominous Vinci people watching them as they left to pick that guy up? It's was an obvious setup and it's laughable that critics are overthinking it (just like when people thought Lovecraftian monsters were going to appear in the S1 finale).

 

[kedrell]

Not necessarily that he's the killer maybe. But him being involved somehow? I can see that. They keep bringing up this Black Mountain stuff. Certainly with the number of possibilities available to them many of said possibilities are probably red herrings. But not all of them I bet.

 

[Doctor Jones]

Agreed. I'm loving this season.

It's weird that professional critics (Sepinwall) were confused why Ray, Ani, and Paul were ambushed with a gunfight. Did they not see the ominous Vinci people watching them as they left to pick that guy up? It's was an obvious setup and it's laughable that critics are overthinking it (just like when people thought Lovecraftian monsters were going to appear in the S1 finale).

See I never caught on that it could be a set up. If it is, that would completely change the dynamic compared to last season. They really walked into a ****storm. Now if they were set up, were they meant to remain alive or expected to be causalities too?

I think sometimes we often got ahead of ourselves that more external supernatural forces were going to come to play in the finale. But in hindsight, the ethereal elements were more ambiguous and it was always more real world and philosophical based.

This season I don't think is any different. I'm surprised though. The naked woman floating in the milk and the scarred bar matron were more surreal things. And we haven't really gone back to that kind of stuff. Granted we've seen the bar matron many times now and her scarring is less prominent but it's weird she's always more concealed in the darkness when Ray isn't looking at her.

I had a theory that Ray was similar to Rust where both saw things and maybe there is a connection between them, that in this world, certain people are "touched" with seeing things others don't but what they see depends on the psychological state of the individual. But that's just how one would interpret just how much these otherworldly elements are actually real. Or they're just continued elements Pizzolatto likes to explore with no connection whatsoever yet.

Not necessarily that he's the killer maybe. But him being involved somehow? I can see that. They keep bringing up this Black Mountain stuff. Certainly with the number of possibilities available to them many of said possibilities are probably red herrings. But not all of them I bet.

Maybe. Paul is still the cypher of this season though so I feel Pizzolatto is holding him back for a reason. He's getting to the point where he might even feel like a superfluous character but if Pizzolatto put him here for a reason, then I trust why he's here.

Even if he has sex with men, I'm still not 100% that he's a homosexual. It was still ambiguous if whether or not he got a blow job. And he has mommy issues. Or he's bisexual. You don't see bisexuals tackled in television often so if this were the case that'd be cool. If not though, fine either way. I don't know, Paul is still the biggest mystery out of the four (I'd say as large as the main mystery itself) and I really like that.

 

[kedrell]

It's just that when I saw him wake up with no memory of the recent past of what he had done, that was a huge red flag right there.

 

[Doctor Jones]

It's just that when I saw him wake up with no memory of the recent past of what he had done, that was a huge red flag right there.

I mean for now we could say that from the previous episode and he was getting drunk at the club he went back to his comrade and they ****ed. Or this is a side to Paul that's been going on for a while that we've just seen for the first time. But yeah, I hope Paul plays a more integral role as time goes on and we find out why Pizzolatto has been executing him this way.

At first I thought Velcoro was the ticking time bomb. Now I'm starting to think Paul is like this Travis Bickle type who might just snap.

I have a feeling things might get all Eyes Wide Shut near the end of this show. Each episode keeps talking about these parties in every other scene. You know that's coming up and we're finally going to see it.

Anyway for next season I wouldn't mind a Heat scenario where it just focuses on one detective trying to take down a major criminal. It makes things simpler but it's also a new and unique way for the show that doesn't mean pandering for the sake of what's expected and comfortable. Plus it would be better than Heat. Pizzolatto did say he wouldn't mind doing more of a farce Big Lebowski type of story.

 

[Smilodon]

I thought what Ani's father said of Velcoro having a large aura was really interesting. It might've been played up for laughs and could be nothing more than some kind of simple foreshadowing or perhaps some introduction of a color motif like yellow was least season, but it did catch my attention when I first heard it.

 

[Doctor Jones]

I thought what Ani's father said of Velcoro having a large aura was really interesting. It might've been played up for laughs and could be nothing more than some kind of simple foreshadowing or perhaps some introduction of a color motif like yellow was least season, but it did catch my attention when I first heard it.

For humor but it also has meaning. It fits into what Pizzolatto's writing in these past two seasons. That ethereal quality that's ambiguous as to whether or not there are really otherworldly forces at work. Maybe Ani's father isn't full of ****. Or it's just more of his hippie ****. If not, then what Rust saw in Form and Void was real. It's all consistent with what has been going on. It's connected but it's not.

 

[BestGirl]

Scenes like that just make me appreciate McConaughey and Harrelson more. The two of them can pull off Nic Pizzolatto's weird dialogue and make it work.

At times some of Pizzolatto's lines have come off sounding bad from certain characters in this season.

I don't think even MM could make Frank's dialog work. And yeah, everyone's had the occasional clunker line but Vaughn's been hit harder than most.

I enjoy Vaughn's character Frank but I don't find him remotely threatening. I don't feel Vaughn has a particular intimidating presence to him.

At least not in this he doesn't.

 

[Doctor Jones]

I actually think Frank is really well written but even I'll admit, you could have gotten someone better than Vaughn. That cavity line is very noir, but I feel like it would have been delivered in a more charming way than threatening.

 

[Harry_Lime02]

This is the sort of role I've always wanted to see Vince Vaughn in, but he's not really pulling it off.

 

[P Supreme]

Vince Vaughn is the only reason I'm watching and he has been great

 

[Kane52630]

I think they've all been great, problem is that there's no balance between the cast. Everyone is on that same depressed level for the most part.

 

[Lencho01]

I think they've all been great, problem is that there's no balance between the cast. Everyone is on that same depressed level for the most part.

At least one character has to be a bit more upbeat. Like how Martin balanced Rust.

 

[TheBat812]

The 'problem' with this season is it focuses more on the drama of the characters than the mystery they're exploring. We also have very little reason to care about the case as it was to a person we don't like or care about instead of innocent women. So it's really just lacking that feeling of 'needing to know' that made the first season something you just had to keep watching. It's also much more subtle in the supernatural and existential tone that really made season 1 unique.

I still really like this season, but it's the characters that are keeping me watching. I find them all interesting and want to see them overcome their personal trials and tribulations. It's much more about the detectives than it is about the case. Season 1 wove the two together in an incredible way, in this one the case feels more tangential.

 

[Uptown Finest]

I mean for now we could say that from the previous episode and he was getting drunk at the club he went back to his comrade and they ****ed. Or this is a side to Paul that's been going on for a while that we've just seen for the first time. But yeah, I hope Paul plays a more integral role as time goes on and we find out why Pizzolatto has been executing him this way.

At first I thought Velcoro was the ticking time bomb. Now I'm starting to think Paul is like this Travis Bickle type who might just snap.

I have a feeling things might get all Eyes Wide Shut near the end of this show. Each episode keeps talking about these parties in every other scene. You know that's coming up and we're finally going to see it.

Anyway for next season I wouldn't mind a Heat scenario where it just focuses on one detective trying to take down a major criminal. It makes things simpler but it's also a new and unique way for the show that doesn't mean pandering for the sake of what's expected and comfortable. Plus it would be better than Heat. Pizzolatto did say he wouldn't mind doing more of a farce Big Lebowski type of story.

Which would be about what? And the heat concept is cool, however I would like next season to change from homicide related case to narcotics related with narc detectives solving a murder connected to the drug game.

 

[BestGirl]

I actually think Frank is really well written but even I'll admit, you could have gotten someone better than Vaughn. That cavity line is very noir, but I feel like it would have been delivered in a more charming way than threatening.

I think they've all been great, problem is that there's no balance between the cast. Everyone is on that same depressed level for the most part.

At least one character has to be a bit more upbeat. Like how Martin balanced Rust.

I said something like this a page or two ago. A fair amount of the dialog has been over-the-top and would be better if delivered with a smile or tongue-in-cheek manner. Instead, everyone is so damned serious when they this stuff, they sound ridiculous. Even if their dialog had been perfectly normal, their relentless dourness would be a bit of a drag anyway. Given that there's four people in the cast, there's no reason one of them couldn't've been funny, even in a dark kind of way. We need more scenes like the one where Ray beat up Ass Pen's dad, which managed to be uncomfortable and humorous at the same time.

 

[Sawyer]

Vince Vaughn is the only reason I'm watching and he has been great

.......... sure.

 

[Doctor Jones]

I said something like this a page or two ago. A fair amount of the dialog has been over-the-top and would be better if delivered with a smile or tongue-in-cheek manner. Instead, everyone is so damned serious when they this stuff, they sound ridiculous. Even if their dialog had been perfectly normal, their relentless dourness would be a bit of a drag anyway. Given that there's four people in the cast, there's no reason one of them couldn't've been funny, even in a dark kind of way. We need more scenes like the one where Ray beat up Ass Pen's dad, which managed to be uncomfortable and humorous at the same time.

I think out of all of them, Ray is the funniest to me and is the one who provides the humor despite his dark nature.

I don't know if I was the only one laughing my ass off when I saw his glove box. Stuff like Ray's aurora from Ani's dad is great too.

[/B]
Which would be about what? And the heat concept is cool, however I would like next season to change from homicide related case to narcotics related with narc detectives solving a murder connected to the drug game.

I've no idea. But I like the narc idea quite a bit.

 

[Uptown Finest]

I think out of all of them, Ray is the funniest to me and is the one who provides the humor despite his dark nature.

I don't know if I was the only one laughing my ass off when I saw his glove box. Stuff like Ray's aurora from Ani's dad is great too.



I've no idea. But I like the narc idea quite a bit.

Yeah the narc idea came from Rust talking about his narc days a season ago. Just got me interesting in seeing a season focused on narcotics and not homicide, but still keeping the cult/supernatural theme. And I would have next season go back to the south, this time in Miami.

 

[Kane52630]

.......... sure.

Sawyer...criticizing something?

 

[Sawyer]

Sawyer...criticizing something?

 

[Doctor Jones]

Yeah the narc idea came from Rust talking about his narc days a season ago. Just got me interesting in seeing a season focused on narcotics and not homicide, but still keeping the cult/supernatural theme. And I would have next season go back to the south, this time in Miami.

I actually think it should go east. We've been south and west, I wouldn't mind a place like upstate New York. Ever been to Buffalo? Once once of the greatest cities in the world now it fits into the degradation that Pizzolatto's locations deal in.

And does anyone else notice that whereas each ending of the first four episodes in the first season, Rust and Marty were always one big step ahead into finding the killer whereas this season these past four episodes have ended the opposite where instead of a step ahead in the case they seem to go backwards and are no closer to finding the murderer? If anything they're right back where they started.

If this pattern keeps up, this season could end where the killer gets away and instead we're watching these characters implode. Because the characters and the mysteries of themselves have a greater focus than the actual murder itself, it would be consistent.

 

[nite-owl]

My problem with the second season is that I miss the weirdness from the first season.

 

[Uptown Finest]

I actually think it should go east. We've been south and west, I wouldn't mind a place like upstate New York. Ever been to Buffalo? Once once of the greatest cities in the world now it fits into the degradation that Pizzolatto's locations deal in.

And does anyone else notice that whereas each ending of the first four episodes in the first season, Rust and Marty were always one big step ahead into finding the killer whereas this season these past four episodes have ended the opposite where instead of a step ahead in the case they seem to go backwards and are no closer to finding the murderer? If anything they're right back where they started.

If this pattern keeps up, this season could end where the killer gets away and instead we're watching these characters implode. Because the characters and the mysteries of themselves have a greater focus than the actual murder itself, it would be consistent.

If they go east I like it to focus on my hometown of Philadelphia. If they go NY, do NYC as that's more entertaining to me than Buffalo.