I Am Doom....discuss me [merged-2]

[Head>On<Collider]

There is something to get over. That Doom being ruined is just your opinion...it isn't a fact.

It's not just an opinion any more when you get this many people making note of how bad they ruined him.

 

[Rex Calibur]

I've never read the Ultimates comics, but I've seen some of the artwork, and for sure the outfits were based on the Ultimates.

Well the Ultimate costumes look a lot like 616 Ff anyway.. your point?

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

For someone who uses the words crystal ball as much as you do, you really do a good job of overlooking the simple factor that no matter how much planning and organizing and editing and board meeting, and staging every step taken in producing any film, there's no absolute recipe for making a blockbuster hit. If it were any way different, the use of a crystal ball would indeed be a factor when the production companies here in Hollywood are at work.... if anything, history mixed with some good old common sense should show that the least risk would be in sticking with something that has already been proven to be good and profitable. The Fantastic Four has already been established to be a good franchise in it's own right. Bringing them to the big screen the way they were originally written, would only bring that same greatness to a greater scale...

And this is true.

So tell me: When mapping out what appeals to demographics WORLDWIDE upon theatrical release--who's crystal ball is going to be cloudier?

A.) The folks that do this thing everyday for a business and have a successful track record at launching various franchises

Or

B.) Some comic-book fanboys like us--who think we know it all from our limited perspectives on our local library PCs?

 

[Hunter Rider]

How did i know everyone would ignore my suggestion as it isnt condusive to continuing argument

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

It's not just an opinion any more when you get this many people making note of how bad they ruined him.

This many people??? What...the 10 people on this thread that don't like what they did with him makes it a fact that Doom was ruined? Now I can just see that your delusional or just really pissed if you are trying to turn an opinion into a fact.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

It's not just an opinion any more when you get this many people making note of how bad they ruined him.

*This many*????

Where? I can count on 1.5 hands how many fans here are actually b1tching about this thing every chance they get. It's a handful at best. Now, granted, that number may grow after July 8th...but then again, it very well might not.

The vast majority of fans here and elsewhere either could care less about Doom or are interested in seeing him on-screen. It's those two extremes. The bulk of the focus is on the FF--not Doom.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

Could've fooled me, I'm not the one protecting Fox and Marvel regarding this F4 movie at all costs no matter how weak the motivation to do so is...

Well, that greatly depends on who's determining if the motivation is "weak" or not.

Truth is--I determine that for myself...always have...and always will.

 

[Milkman95]

Both DC and Marvel as of late have dropped the ball - and I'm talking recently. No use in bringing up anything before 2000's X-Men, that's when the craze started back up again, at least IMO. I agree Marvel shouldn't be releasing every damn character, but if they want to keep shoving out properties for a dime, so be it. Saturation can be a problem, sure, but if it's a quality film, it should do fine. The last 4 releases, not counting Spidey 2 of course, have been CINO, Elektra, Punisher, and Blade III. NONE OF THEM DID WELL. Why? Because they were terrible films. In fact, they all pretty much bombed. DVD sales saved their ass........

Avi can be really good, but then really bad - it's hard to explain. If FF and every other comic book film released is good, it will do fine. I'm sure Doom will be okay for everybody.........There are negatives with every film. If they get the FF right and Doom half-right, then we should be fine. To me, getting the FF right is more important anyway.....

 

[Head>On<Collider]

And this is true.

So tell me: When mapping out what appeals to demographis WORLDWIDE upon theatrical release--who's crystal ball is going to be cloudier:

A.) The folks that do this thing everyday for a business and have a successful track record at launching various franchises

Or

B.) Some comic-book fanboys like us--who think we know it all from our limited perspectives on our local library PCs?

Observe your own words:

A.) The folks that do this thing everyday for a business and have a successful track record at launching various franchises

Are you actually saying that these "folks" you speak of doing this everyday for a business ACTUALLY HAVE a track record at launching various franchises? Successfull ones? If so, where did the word "flop" originate from? Where did the word "bomb" come from regarding movies? Why do some movies go straight to DVD? Were all the box office failures ever made planned? Did these "folks" really INTEND to make a bad fil? Think about it..... even better, think about it from an HONEST, UNBIASED mind....

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

I can see where the Doom guys a re coming from as they want to see their favourite character brought to life onscreen in the faithful way as the LOTR characters have been,The way i look at though is elseworlds,i don't know if any of you have read many of them but they take classic characters and repackage them a bit like movie doom,so if you could step back a minute you might find this is still a good villain just not the classic one from the original comics

Good post.

But here's another angle of the problem:

We have a laity on this board.

We have fans who feel that since they've read these books for so long that if others do not adopt the purist view of Doom, they are somehow less-than real fans, or their opinions "are full of holes". These same ones don't even entertain the option of giving this adaptation of Doom a chance. And those of us who want to give it a chance are brandished as ______[insert title here]_________.

And as one who has an intimate 24-year long knowledge of this material I'll be damned if someone is going to tell me that I'm ___[insert title here]______ simply because my opinion doesn't align with theirs.

Closemindedness is an ugly thing. And that's why fanboys have such a hard rap in the media and with studios because we can be so unyielding that we come across childish and ignorant.

I understand some of the nature of this business. And I certainly understand what the term movie adaptation is. Some of these folks do not and it shows. This is not going to be Sin City...there will be changes. And whining about them will not make them suddenly go away. Does that make the changes right?

Only time will tell. And that's all I'm holding out for.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

Good post.

But here's another angle of the problem:

We have a laity on this board.

We have fans who feel that since they've read these books for so long that if others do not adopt the purist view of Doom, they are somehow less-than real fans, or their opinions "are full of holes". These same ones don't even entertain the option of giving this adaptation of Doom a chance. And those of us who want to give it a chance are brandished as ______[insert title here]_________.

And as one who has an intimate 24-year long knowledge of this material I'll be damned if someone is going to tell me that I'm ___[insert title here]______ simply because my opinion doesn't align with theirs.

Closemindedness is an ugly thing. And that's why fanboys have such a hard rap in the media and with studios because we can be so unyielding that we come across childish and ignorant.

I understand some of the nature of this business. And I certainly understand what the term movie adaptation is. Some of these folks do not and it shows. This is not going to be Sin City...there will be changes. And whining about them will not make them suddenly go away. Does that make the changes right?

Only time will tell. And that's all I'm holding out for.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

Observe your own words:

Are you actually saying that these "folks" you speak of doing this everyday for a business ACTUALLY HAVE a track record at launching various franchises? Successfull ones? If so, where did the word "flop" originate from? Where did the word "bomb" come from regarding movies? Why do some movies go straight to DVD? Were all the box office failures ever made planned? Did these "folks" really INTEND to make a bad fil? Think about it..... even better, think about it from an HONEST, UNBIASED mind....

There is plenty of info out that shows that much of what makes Doom, Doom IS intact for this film. His Latverian heritage, the armor in his office, his quest for bettering himself, his influence on a global scale, his personal and professional ambitions--all of that is THERE from what we know. He will be set up perfectly for Latverian domination in the sequel (if there is one). The question is--are these details enough for certain fans? That's up to them to decide. But if they do or do not agree with it, that certainly doesn't make the film a flop or failure. It boils down to opinion and truth is--90% of moviegoers don't give a HOOT about Dr. Doom or his origin.

And that's the truth.

Now, do studios go into production planning a failure? I hope not. I think Catwoman was an excellent example of what happens when studios stray too far from the source material. But one cannot even equate the details we know of Dr. Doom with Patience Phillips. Are there changes? Yes. Are there examples of faithfulness? Yes.

Are they dealbreakers? I don't know...yet.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Good post.

But here's another angle of the problem:

We have a laity on this board.

We have fans who feel that since they've read these books for so long that if others do not adopt the purist view of Doom, they are somehow less-than real fans, or their opinions "are full of holes". These same ones don't even entertain the option of giving this adaptation of Doom a chance. And those of us who want to give it a chance are brandished as ______[insert title here]_________.

And as one who has an intimate 24-year long knowledge of this material I'll be damned if someone is going to tell me that I'm ___[insert title here]______ simply because my opinion doesn't align with theirs.

Closemindedness is an ugly thing. And that's why fanboys have such a hard rap in the media and with studios because we can be so unyielding that we come across childish and ignorant.

I understand some of the nature of this business. And I certainly understand what the term movie adaptation is. Some of these folks do not and it shows. This is not going to be Sin City...there will be changes. And whining about them will not make them suddenly go away. Does that make the changes right?

Only time will tell. And that's all I'm holding out for.

I see what you mean,the terms you wouldve used are often leveled at the movie fan due to their like of the movies direction.
as you say time will twll on a lot of things

 

[Head>On<Collider]

This many people??? What...the 10 people on this thread that don't like what they did with him makes it a fact that Doom was ruined? Now I can just see that your delusional or just really pissed if you are trying to turn an opinion into a fact.

One of the biggest concerns mentioned about this film on every site talking about this film is specifically about the treatment given to Doom, so which one of us is being delusional?

*This many*????

Where? I can count on 1.5 hands how many fans here are actually b1tching about this thing every chance they get. It's a handful at best. Now, granted, that number may grow after July 8th...but then again, it very well might not.

The vast majority of fans here and elsewhere either could care less about Doom or are interested in seeing him on-screen. It's those two extremes. The bulk of the focus is on the FF--not Doom.

If so few people are "b1tching" as you put it, then why the need to defend it so much?

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

I see what you mean,the terms you wouldve used are often leveled at the movie fan due to their like of the movies direction.
as you say time will twll on a lot of things

Yep. Time will tell.

And that's why I'm not adding my voice in either direction for Doom except, "Let's give him a chance to prove himself on screen." Because if he sucks, I'll certainly say so. And if he's good, I'll certainly say so. Either way, in two weeks I'll voice my official thoughts on him.

Why not now? Because there is a lot I like about this movie adaptation, and a lot I don't like at the same time. Although a few here won't acknowledge it, Tim has made a lot of effort to get a lot of Doom right. So, I'm just keeping my fingers crossed and going into this film with an open mind--and with no predisposed agendas (as in "Here we go, this is going to rock/suck!")

That's not me. I've got to be reasonable here...and objective.

And that's all I've got to say on the subject.


Next thread.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

There is plenty of info out that shows that much of what makes Doom, Doom IS intact for this film. His Latverian heritage, the armor in his office, his quest for bettering himself, his influence on a global scale, his personal and professional ambitions--all of that is THERE from what we know. He will be set up perfectly for Latverian domination in the sequel (if there is one). The question is--are these details enough for certain fans? That's up to them to decide. But if they do or do not agree with it, that certainly doesn't make the film a flop or failure. It boils down to opinion and truth is--90% of moviegoers don't give a HOOT about Dr. Doom or his origin.

And that's the truth.

Now, do studios go into production planning a failure? I hope not. I think Catwoman was an excellent example of what happens when studios stray too far from the source material. But one cannot even equate the details we know of Dr. Doom with Patience Phillips. Are there changes? Yes. Are there examples of faithfulness? Yes.

Are they dealbreakers? I don't know...yet.

Wow. You never cease to amaze me. You seriously are pulling thoughts running around in my head and putting them much better than I can. Thanks Lightning for your genius. Bravo.

 

[Kelly]

good lord...this is becoming a "i know you are, but what am i" mentality....

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

One of the biggest concerns mentioned about this film on every site talking about this film is specifically about the treatment given to Doom, so which one of us is being delusional? If so few people are &quot;b1tching&quot; as you put it, then why the need to defend it so much?

It is a big concern among many FF fans...true. Does that make it more than just an opinion?...Nope sorry. I think Doom has not been ruined. Doom being ruined by Fox has NEVER been a fact. Cheers.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

good lord...this is becoming a "i know you are, but what am i" mentality....

Hey you got to hand it to me though. I made a pretty damn good debate thread.

 

[Kelly]

Hey you got to hand it to me though. I made a pretty damn good debate thread.

No....its just a rehash of the "i am doom" thread....nothing new here...

 

[Hunter Rider]

Yep. Time will tell.

And that's why I'm not adding my voice in either direction for Doom except, "Let's give him a chance to prove himself on screen." Because if he sucks, I'll certainly say so. And if he's good, I'll certainly say so. Either way, in two weeks I'll voice my official thoughts on him.

Why not now? Because there is a lot I like about this movie adaptation, and a lot I don't like at the same time. Although a few here won't acknowledge it, Tim has made a lot of effort to get a lot of Doom right. So, I'm just keeping my fingers crossed and going into this film with an open mind--and with no predisposed agendas (as in "Here we go, this is going to rock/suck!")

That's not me. I've got to be reasonable here...and objective.

And that's all I've got to say on the subject.


Next thread.

i agree,i want to see how he plays in the entire movie not just a couple of snippets from a trailer,i think there are some touches that will allude to his past and the ending should set up some very interesting possibilities for a sequel

 

[Kurosawa]

If the movie tanks, it'll be mostly due to Klytus' character.

Who I'll really feel bad for is Julian McMahon. It's like they could have given him the keys to a Rolls Royce but instead he got a Yugo with a blown motor.

I just hope the incredible lameness of Klytus doesn't hurt his career. Even if Klytus wasn't masqurading as Dr. Doom, he'd still be the lamest villian ever.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

No....its just a rehash of the "i am doom" thread....nothing new here...

Didn't claim it was new but yeah...it is a sequel to the I Am Doom thread.

 

[Dragon]

It boils down to opinion and truth is--90% of moviegoers don't give a HOOT about Dr. Doom or his origin.

And that's the truth.

But they give a hoot about good movies.

And when it comes to Doom:

Comic origin = Good movie

Doom as Donald Trump/ Norman Osborn wannabe = Bad movie.

It has nothing to do with what appeared where, or why. If the comic origin wasn't good, they'd have been justified in jettisoning it.

Now, do studios go into production planning a failure? I hope not. I think Catwoman was an excellent example of what happens when studios stray too far from the source material. But one cannot even equate the details we know of Dr. Doom with Patience Phillips. Are there changes? Yes. Are there examples of faithfulness? Yes.

Are they dealbreakers? I don't know...yet.

Actually you can equate the changes.

Catwoman: Altered origin, altered persona, ridiculous powers,lousy costume.

Doom: Altered origin, altered persona, ridiculous powers, lousy costume.

Check, check, check & mate.

 

[Hunter Rider]

But they give a hoot about good movies.

And when it comes to Doom:

Comic origin = Good movie

Doom as Donald Trump/ Norman Osborn wannabe = Bad movie.

.

thats still just an opinion