I'm Not Messing Around, I'm Doing Important Stuff in The Superhero Cinematic Civil War Thread - Part 61

[Shinobi Shaw]

If Superman is a strong success, I’d hope that they wouldn’t screw it up with adding Batman to the mix.

Shared universes are such a tired gimmick right now…

I feel you, but I love the shared universe gimmick. It’s different from what we got decades prior, but there’s an art to it.

These Hollywood execs need to learn that you can do solo films and still build a shared universe. Just throw in some connective tissue to establish everyone coexists, but you don’t have to have a full on guest star like Batman in it to drive it home.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

Shared universes can work but I'd prefer it to be... Pretty nominal? No real links between movies, totally divergent styles, so little crossover that you don't have to worry about maintaining much continuity. Just oh this Superman and this Batman are cool characters therefore it is fun to see them interact on a special occasion.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I feel you, but I love the shared universe gimmick. It’s different from what we got decades prior, but there’s an art to it.

These Hollywood execs need to learn that you can do solo films and still build a shared universe. Just throw in some connective tissue to establish everyone coexists, but you don’t have to have a full on guest star like Batman in it to drive it home.

I love the shared universe concept, when done well. The problem is studios are now chasing that billion dollar crossover as opposed to telling good stories and using the crossovers when they make sense.

Also, in regard to the notion of Superman getting a trilogy on top of the WF movie and such. I heard that same plan when BvS was announced. We would get MoS2 later. Then BvS underperformed, WB panics, and we all know what happened. What happens if World's Finest turns out mid, it does $800 mil or less? Then we sacrificed a Superman sequel to the alter of Batman, again, and get burned. I'd rather we just do this entire thing slowly and responsibly. Not chase Justice League. We already did this!

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

I love the shared universe concept, when done well. The problem is studios are now chasing that billion dollar crossover as opposed to telling good stories and using the crossovers when they make sense.

Also, in regard to the notion of Superman getting a trilogy on top of the WF movie and such. I heard that same plan when BvS was announced. We would get MoS2 later. Then BvS underperformed, WB panics, and we all know what happened. What happens if World's Finest turns out mid, it does $800 mil or less? Then we sacrificed a Superman sequel to the alter of Batman, again, and get burned. I'd rather we just do this entire thing slowly and responsibly. Not chase Justice League. We already did this!

Of course.

And then you know how a company like WB is, if this Superman reboot really takes off, they’re gonna cram Batman into it just to make the same creative mistakes they did ages ago.

Doesn’t help either when you have someone like Gunn at the helm with them who is just as reactive.

All a good Supes sequel needs is either Brainiac or Metallo and call it a day.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Of course.

And then you know how a company like WB is, if this Superman reboot really takes off, they’re gonna cram Batman into it just to make the same creative mistakes they did ages ago.

Doesn’t help either when you have someone like Gunn at the helm with them who is just as reactive.

All a good Supes sequel needs is either Brainiac or Metallo and call it a day.

Another factor I don't think anyone at WB is considering is, World's Finest won't have the novelty of being the 1st Batman/Superman team-up movie. World's Finest is going to live in a world where BvS exists, so while we may say "It's Batman and Superman, BOX OFFICE!!!!" Your average movie goers who maybe even liked Superman, may instead feel "They're doing this again?' And then lose interest. Hence why I feel like it's better to take extra time before doing this again

 

[Ninjablade]

I'm over the whole shared universe thing as it currently constitutes. Makes everything so monotonous. That's not to say I don't want to see heroes interacting with one another, I like seeing the world feel lived in in Superman, but I'm bored by how these studios are pushing the singular style on everything. It's okay to have diversity. That's the whole appeal of comic books.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

Ultimately all roads feel like they lead to Batman to me. If Superman performs really well, they'll see the dollar signs of how much more money it could make if Batman was there. If it underperforms, they'll press the Batman panic button. World's Finest instead of a normal sequel feels almost inevitable.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I'm over the whole shared universe thing as it currently constitutes. Makes everything so monotonous. That's not to say I don't want to see heroes interacting with one another, I like seeing the world feel lived in in Superman, but I'm bored by how these studios are pushing the singular style on everything. It's okay to have diversity. That's the whole appeal of comic books.

I think we need to go back to a Superman or Spider-Man or whatever movie is about that character. Then every few years, they meet in JL or The Avengers or whatever random event name movie you make and thats your team up where they interact. That's just me. I think when we are looking to add Batman or RDJ or whoever back just to make a billion dollars on 1 major payday, then you're not prioritizing telling good stories and eventually that well will dry up.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

All I’m saying is, you have a solo movie, pop in some Easter eggs and references to events/heroes in other movies and keep it moving.

Then when the time is right, cross them over. But don’t do it in the hero’s first sequel that should be a solo.

Comic books have been doing it since the beginning of forever.

 

[Lily Adler]

All I’m saying is, you have a solo movie, pop in some Easter eggs and references to events/heroes in other movies and keep it moving.

Then when the time is right, cross them over. But don’t do it in the hero’s first sequel that should be a solo.

Comic books have been doing it since the beginning of forever.

Throw in a Batusi TikTok dance video.

 

[OtherwiseKnownAs]

I really think the success of a World’s Finest movie depends on how people react to Superman, and how they react to whoever Batman will be in Brave and the Bold. If you’ve got a Superman people like, and a Batman people like the audience is already going to respond better to it then BVS.

Side-note, I think this may be one of the reasons the higher-ups at WB might be pushing for Pattinson to be the DCU Batman. If you’ve already got something people like why introduce an X factor?

 

[SwordOfMorning]

Existential dread at World's Finest inevitably being shot by Henry Braham both because Superman looks like dogwater to me visually and he is demonstrably the absolute worst at shooting Batman. Superman doesn't look quite as bad as The Flash - close, but what does look as bad as The Flash? - but its sufficiently of a piece that its easy to predict what Batman would look like in this style and it ain't pretty.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

I really think the success of a World’s Finest movie depends on how people react to Superman, and how they react to whoever Batman will be in Brave and the Bold. If you’ve got a Superman people like, and a Batman people like the audience is already going to respond better to it then BVS.

Side-note, I think this may be one of the reasons the higher-ups at WB might be pushing for Pattinson to be the DCU Batman. If you’ve already got something people like why introduce an X factor?

Yeah, if Superman is a hit and people fall for Corenswet then him crossing over with Pattinson is such an instantaneous win. In the current landscape I don't think you can take their Batman being an automatic success because its Batman for granted - especially because I highly suspect that what people care about with Batman is it reminding them of The Dark Knight. I'm all for fantastical silly Batman, but I think people might be underestimating how much the GAs affection for Batman actually is rooted in the transparently silly take that he's better than other superheroes because he's gritty and realistic.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Existential dread at World's Finest inevitably being shot by Henry Braham both because Superman looks like dogwater to me visually and he is demonstrably the absolute worst at shooting Batman. Superman doesn't look quite as bad as The Flash - close, but what does look as bad as The Flash? - but its sufficiently of a piece that its easy to predict what Batman would look like in this style and it ain't pretty.

We live in a world where people see Dune and Superman and say they look "close enough".

The, "it's a comic book movie. It can look like a comic book." is so weird to me. Because that just registers as cheap and bad. Which none of my favorite comic books look. TDKT is very comic book. It also looks pretty darn great. Same with The Batman.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

We live in a world where people see Dune and Superman and say they look "close enough".

The, "it's a comic book movie. It can look like a comic book." is so weird to me. Because that just registers as cheap and bad. Which none of my favorite comic books look. TDKT is very comic book. It also looks pretty darn great. Same with The Batman.

It absolutely does not look like a comic book. It has comic book imagery. In a comic it'd be portrayed with fun, beautiful artwork and nice colours - Superman is the equivalent of a comic book with very bad art.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I really think the success of a World’s Finest movie depends on how people react to Superman, and how they react to whoever Batman will be in Brave and the Bold. If you’ve got a Superman people like, and a Batman people like the audience is already going to respond better to it then BVS.

Side-note, I think this may be one of the reasons the higher-ups at WB might be pushing for Pattinson to be the DCU Batman. If you’ve already got something people like why introduce an X factor?

I do think there is probably a push to use Pattinson in the broader DCU internally. Which, I can live with. Just don't mention the other stuff in his movies. See, I am of the mind that we can let people go nuts with their slice of a DCU and have unique styles of their own, focus on their own characters and such, be self contained, etc. Then just have those people end up in a JL movie together without making it overtly complicated. But I can see Gunn wanting his own Batman. To which I say, do whatever you think makes good movies

 

[SwordOfMorning]

Battinson in the DCU should just depend on what Pattinson wants to do. As much as I care about Reeves's wants and his story, ultimately the call should be Pattinson's if its an option on the table.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Battinson in the DCU should just depend on what Pattinson wants to do. As much as I care about Reeves's wants and his story, ultimately the call should be Pattinson's if its an option on the table.

Ultimately, it would end up being Pattinson's call. Even if the Producers want him, he would have to probably agree to it. Unless he signed an old school 3 movie studio deal as the Batman character. But if he signed on for 3 Batman movies, then World's Finest or anything else would require a new deal. So he'd get final say in the end

 

[SwordOfMorning]

Ultimately, it would end up being Pattinson's call. Even if the Producers want him, he would have to probably agree to it. Unless he signed an old school 3 movie studio deal as the Batman character. But if he signed on for 3 Batman movies, then World's Finest or anything else would require a new deal. So he'd get final say in the end

Oh, for sure. I know they can't force him into the DCU. My statement was more that he shouldn't be forced to not join by the Reeves side of things - even though I, obviously, am a huge Reeves fan and totally disinterested in the DCU. Which seems to be an unpopular opinion in The Batman corner of fandom.

 

[Lily Adler]

Yeah if Rob wants to be the DCU Batman after the Reeves films. Cool

 

[Lily Adler]

Yeah if Rob wants to be the DCU Batman after the Reeves films. Cool

 

[Spider-Fan]

Oh, for sure. I know they can't force him into the DCU. My statement was more that he shouldn't be forced to not join by the Reeves side of things - even though I, obviously, am a huge Reeves fan and totally disinterested in the DCU. Which seems to be an unpopular opinion in The Batman corner of fandom.

I am so burnt out on Batman as a whole. The Reeves Batman movies are the only Batman I currently have any interest in. Even if Pattinson were in World's Finest, it wouldn't make me more excited to see it honestly. I have just....had my fill of Batman. For a long time lol

 

[SwordOfMorning]

I am so burnt out on Batman as a whole. The Reeves Batman movies are the only Batman I currently have any interest in. Even if Pattinson were in World's Finest, it wouldn't make me more excited to see it honestly. I have just....had my fill of Batman. For a long time lol

I think every major iconic franchise needs to die for the sake of the future so I feel that lol. Batman is one of the things I'll always be a little excited for out of habit, but I find it impossible to imagine being excited about seeing IP on screen for the most part- I love Superman but even if this was a movie that didn't look utterly unappealing to me I don't think there would be any spark of novelty anymore. He's not even an overexposed character, just the whole idea of being excited to see something you recognized was rendered meaningless a long time ago.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

I want to see the Bat Family in live action. Wanted that for a long time.

But they’re giving us Damian and that is NOT the way.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

I'm a diehard Damian fan - Morrison's Batman is the greatest superhero story ever told - but I can very easily imagine how Gunn will write Damian and its very, very bad. Feel like it'll just turn into PG-13 Kick-Ass.