Cinematic Civil War (Galactic Edition): MCU vs Star Wars

[writer0327]

Clearly Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back are superior to anything Marvel has ever done. At the same time The Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones are worse.

My understanding was that this thread is specifically about the Disney Era Star Wars movies.

The OP stated this: "So lets compare the MCU with another well established franchise."

So I'm going with the entirety of the SW universe.

MCU has better films overall from top to bottom. SW very top heavy with ANH and ESB, but has the terrible prequels. MCU has a better even keel of films and more films overall.

MCU currently would win this battle IMO.

 

[AlluAllu]

I, like many others, discovered Star Wars when I was just a little boy. When I think of children 20 years into the future, I see MCU being more popular.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

I, like many others, discovered Star Wars when I was just a little boy. When I think of children 20 years into the future, I see MCU being more popular.

After a decade of no new Star Wars movie we got one that eclipsed the highest grossing MCU movie 8 years in, I expect to see the older film franchise continue to be more popular.

 

[AlluAllu]

Fair enough. Let me try again:

I imagine future kids being more excited about discovering MCU for the first time than discovering Star Wars for the first time.

Admittedly John Williams' score is better at inducing jumping on sofa.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

I agree with AlluAllu assuming one thing, that the MCU continues to be good and it's first conclusive arc (Avengers 3 and 4) ends with a bang.

I think in the far future (20-30 years from now) people won't be able to differentiate the good episodes of Star Wars with the bad quite so easily. And they might watch them 1-9 and those first few will set the tone for the entire franchise. And once they hit 7 theyll see things rehashed and the "nostalgia" factor won't have any affect it'll just look like a direct carbon copy.

My overall point is that I think MCU is a far better series, Star Wars has a couple top-notch standalone films.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

Clearly Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back are superior to anything Marvel has ever done. At the same time The Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones are worse.

My understanding was that this thread is specifically about the Disney Era Star Wars movies.

What is the point of that though? There has been two Star Wars movies sine Disney bought them.

Also I'd take TPM over The Dark World. RotS and AotC would be the bottom of the complete list imo.

Talk about whatever you want. Disney era Star Wars are the only ones we'll be able to debate going forward. But it's all part of one cinematic universe and thats the point.

I would disagree with the point that ANH and ESB are "clearly better" than anything Marvel has done. I think that, having been 30 years earlier, they certainly deserve hearty praise and as a trilogy they are near perfect, but they have a lot of issues. Acting prowess of main characters and writing issues to name just a couple things.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Talk about whatever you want. Disney era Star Wars are the only ones we'll be able to debate going forward. But it's all part of one cinematic universe and thats the point.

I would disagree with the point that ANH and ESB are "clearly better" than anything Marvel has done. I think that, having been 30 years earlier, they certainly deserve hearty praise and as a trilogy they are near perfect, but they have a lot of issues. Acting prowess of main characters and writing issues to name just a couple things.

Whose acting is the a problem? Because the big three were all great in Star Wars and Empire imo.

I have one problem with Star Wars. The droids wandering in the desert is a tad bit long. Outside of that, I think it is one of the great adventure films. Maybe the best. Empire is utter perfection imo. Great storytelling, great characters, great performances, great direction, great music, great editing, graet everything.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

Specifically I'm referring to Luke. In essence the *main* character. Now, I should clarify I don't think Mark Hamill is a bad actor, but his novice certainly shows and the writing doesn't help. As a stand alone, ANH is actually still my favorite. But when you put them all together, ESB is assuredly the best act, I agree.

The unfortunate thing is, I give a leg up to the MCU for how much cohesive content there is. And maybe that's not fair, but there's so much character development for the core cast (at least Tony Stark, Steve Rogers, Bucky, Thor/Loki, Romanoff and Fury) in between the best of the tentpoles (Avengers and Civil War) that I know all their motivations and passions to a very focused degree long before they get into the dangerous situations.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

The acting in the original trilogy is interesting because in the original film, Hamill is the worst and Ford the best of the leads. In ROTJ, Hamill is the best and Ford the worst.

 

[DACrowe]

Fair enough. Let me try again:

I imagine future kids being more excited about discovering MCU for the first time than discovering Star Wars for the first time.

Admittedly John Williams' score is better at inducing jumping on sofa.

I will argue otherwise. I mean who really knows on this point, but Star Wars has a clean narrative through line that you can jump into. At least for now, maybe in 20 years, that won't be the case of Disney cranking out one every Christmas. But it just invites easy excitement. The Marvel Universe is becoming so dense and convoluted from an outsider's vantage that I imagine it will one day be like how comics or older shows (say, Star Trek?) are perceived now: a high bar for entry and will attract the nerdier type, but it won't have a universal appeal.

Again Star Wars went 30 years without a good movie and another 10 while being dormant and the MCU built its kingdom. Then The Force Awakens made more money than any Marvel film by introducing its simplicity and epic quality to a new generation with ease.

 

[Ivan Drago]

The acting in the original trilogy is interesting because in the original film, Hamill is the worst and Ford the best of the leads. In ROTJ, Hamill is the best and Ford the worst.

Haha yeah, Ford was definitely phoning it in a bit in ROTJ.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Spoiler

I will argue otherwise. I mean who really knows on this point, but Star Wars has a clean narrative through line that you can jump into. At least for now, maybe in 20 years, that won't be the case of Disney cranking out one every Christmas. But it just invites easy excitement. The Marvel Universe is becoming so dense and convoluted from an outsider's vantage that I imagine it will one day be like how comics or older shows (say, Star Trek?) are perceived now: a high bar for entry and will attract the nerdier type, but it won't have a universal appeal.

Again Star Wars went 30 years without a good movie and another 10 while being dormant and the MCU built its kingdom. Then The Force Awakens made more money than any Marvel film by introducing its simplicity and epic quality to a new generation with ease.

Very well said.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

I will argue otherwise. I mean who really knows on this point, but Star Wars has a clean narrative through line that you can jump into. At least for now, maybe in 20 years, that won't be the case of Disney cranking out one every Christmas. But it just invites easy excitement. The Marvel Universe is becoming so dense and convoluted from an outsider's vantage that I imagine it will one day be like how comics or older shows (say, Star Trek?) are perceived now: a high bar for entry and will attract the nerdier type, but it won't have a universal appeal.

Again Star Wars went 30 years without a good movie and another 10 while being dormant and the MCU built its kingdom. Then The Force Awakens made more money than any Marvel film by introducing its simplicity and epic quality to a new generation with ease.

Star Wars is the franchise to end all franchises. Nothing is bigger. At least in North America.

A side story spin-off just did $530 million domestic. That's almost as much as The Dark Knight.

 

[DACrowe]

Well... yeah. That is why I do not buy arguments that Marvel Studios and their brand is going to supplant Star Wars now or in twenty years.

 

[ernesth100]

Star Wars is leagues ahead of Marvel. Then again they've been around longer. So the experience on what works and what doesnt is evident.

 

[flickchick85]

To me, saying any other franchise is going to supplant Star Wars is like saying some new popular soda will supplant Coca-Cola. Sure, something else may become popular and have staying power, and it may even taste better, but it will always be compared to Coke, because Coke is Coke, ever present in our minds and part of the very fabric of our everyday lives. Just ask Pepsi.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

The acting in the original trilogy is interesting because in the original film, Hamill is the worst and Ford the best of the leads. In ROTJ, Hamill is the best and Ford the worst.

This is very accurate in my opinion as well.

Just for the sake of argument, Fisher may have been the best in ESB. But they all had their moments. Luke spent most of the film interacting with a puppet and then a dude in a mask (less facial expression than the puppet). That certainly takes some acting skill.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Edit.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Specifically I'm referring to Luke. In essence the *main* character. Now, I should clarify I don't think Mark Hamill is a bad actor, but his novice certainly shows and the writing doesn't help. As a stand alone, ANH is actually still my favorite. But when you put them all together, ESB is assuredly the best act, I agree.

The unfortunate thing is, I give a leg up to the MCU for how much cohesive content there is. And maybe that's not fair, but there's so much character development for the core cast (at least Tony Stark, Steve Rogers, Bucky, Thor/Loki, Romanoff and Fury) in between the best of the tentpoles (Avengers and Civil War) that I know all their motivations and passions to a very focused degree long before they get into the dangerous situations.

But Luke is a novice, so it fits well. It also plays beautifully with the evolution of his character. The naive farmboy to the wisest Jedi knight.

 

[First Avenger]

As much as I love the MCU,nothing can touch A New Hope and The Empire Strikes Back. Timeless classics people will still see in 50 years time.

 

[Xrated48]

Nothing beats Star Wars not even Marvel as much as I love there films.

 

[writer0327]

From a cultural phenomenon standpoint, it's not even close. Star Wars movies have been around for 40 years. MCU films have been around for 9.

However, just on a film by film basis, MCU makes a compelling case. We have 14 MCU films to 8 SW films. For me personally, if I were to rank the 22 films in order:

1. The Empire Strikes Back
2. Star Wars
3. CA: TWS
4. The Avengers
5. Guardians of the Galaxy
6. CA:CW
7. Iron Man
8. The Force Awakens
9. Dr. Strange
10. Return of the Jedi
11. Rogue One
12. CA:TFA
13. Thor
14. Iron Man 3
15. Ant-Man
16. A:AoU
17. Revenge of the Sith
18. The Incredible Hulk
19. Thor: TDW
20. Iron Man 2
21. The Phantom Menace
22. Attack of the Clones

Marvel has a lot of strong films. Those top 5 MCU films are just as good as anything else out there with the exception of the first two SW films. And like I said earlier, the prequels seriously hurt the SW brand, making The Force Awakens get a lot better reception than it probably deserved. Not to say that it wasn't a good film, but people were eager to wash the taste of the prequels out of their mouth.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

My mouth still tastes like the prequels. Force Awakens was like a breath mint after eating garlic. Mouth still tastes like garlic, just... minty garlic.

 

[Infinight888]

Based purely on the quality of the franchise, Marvel wins hands down. I would argue that their best are at the same level as the ANH and ESB. Meanwhile, not a single one of their 14 films has ever been as bad as Phantom Menace or Attack of the Clones. At the same time, the series as a whole is just more cohesive. It's too clear that Lucas didn't know where he was going with the franchise, and was just making it up as he went along. He had Luke make out with his sister for Ashla's sake. And the continuity broke down even more with the prequels. Through 14 films and five series (for a total of 10 seasons), the MCU manages to have less contradictions and contrivances than Star Wars had in only six.

 

[Mjölnir]

It's very possible that nothing will ever be as big as Star Wars was when it came, as there's just more and more competition all the time, and standing out as revolutionary is harder.

I'm someone that grew up on Star Wars and loves the old trilogy, but I do think that ANH on it's own isn't nearly as strong as it became with the sequels when I look back at it with the spoiled eyes of today (not talking effects though). ESB did so much for Vader (who barely does anything in the first movie) and the Empire, which increased the value of those things in ANH for me. I think there are many movies with a richer set of story and characters than ANH, without becoming overly complicated, but the trilogy as a whole is just fantastic.

I do think the MCU can measure up in quality, as it has better actors and some really good stories as well, but the comparison will always halt a bit since Star Wars was best over the first three movies and then dipped a lot, and the MCU is strong enough to be used as a whole when you compare.