Interstellar - Part 8

[kvz5]

A handful that I can recall:

Spoiler

They were led to NASA by a probe they found, all the bookshelf and dust message stuff was new.

I believe I recall TARS and CASE being humanoid.

There were aliens that joined together to form larger organisms. On the ice planet, if memory serves.

There was no Dr. Mann. The...I can't recall if it was a person or robot, but the person/robot they found there was from an old Chinese mission with this same purpose. They had conflict with it as well.

Rather than the whole bookshelf thing, Cooper sent the probe from earlier to Earth.

There was a sex scene between Cooper and Brand.

Murph was a boy and had a smaller role.

I don't believe that Caine's Brand had that reveal, seeing as Murph had a reduced role.

Pretty sure I remember Cooper meeting not Murph or Tom but one of their children at the end of their life. I think that was it...can't recall exactly, the last act is where things get fuzzy for me with the differences.

The love stuff wasn't really present.

I seem to remember the ending being just Cooper and TARS going out for adventure rather than going back to Brand on the planet...not so sure about that though, as I said, my memory gets fuzzy as it gets to the end of the script.

RE: Script/Film Differences -

You got most right but IIRC

Spoiler

the implication at the end in the script was also that Cooper was going to find Brand. Brand made him promise to go look for her when they were about to part ways. Or at least that's what I remembered. The script and the film are blending together in my head now.

And yeah... Cooper only met his great, great grandson.

The ones helping out/sending messages in the wormhole are aliens.

Personally, I thought Brand was more emotional/erratic in the film. Also, the way the other crew members died changed.

 

[IncognitoWalrus]

[BLACKOUT]

[BLACKOUT]But how is that going to happen if that needs to have happened already in order for those future people to still exist so they can send the wormhole back so past people can save humanity.[/BLACKOUT] It doesn't work.

Spoiler

That concept is something theoretical physicists still argue about. I wouldn't rule it out as impossible.

However, I do think this theory is easier to swallow: the humans survive first without the intervention of their future selves, and what we see in the movie is them affecting the past to save more of their species.

 

[terry78]

****ing paradoxes.

 

[X Knight]

well, got back from seeing it.

it was good. if not a bit too long.

and the "twist" was interesting and thought provoking.

I did tear up during certain scenes.

biggest complaint was the background music. in some parts it was too LOUD and made it hard to hear the dialogue.

 

[Anita18]

Spoiler

That concept is something theoretical physicists still argue about. I wouldn't rule it out as impossible.

However, I do think this theory is easier to swallow: the humans survive first without the intervention of their future selves, and what we see in the movie is them affecting the past to save more of their species.

I liked that theory too, that someone mentioned before.

Spoiler

That it's Brand's colony on Edmunds' planet that grows to be so advanced, they can make wormholes. And they look back and want to save the humans on earth. Technically, with Plan B, Cooper doesn't exactly need to save humanity all by his lonesome by going through the black hole.

I think the [blackout]time loop[/blackout] also goes back thematically with the movie's definition of Murphy's law. "Whatever CAN happen, WILL happen." And in the film, that's exactly what they show.

 

[jmc]

[BLACKOUT]Cooper surviving the Black Hole[/BLACKOUT] didn't bother me because you can just chalk it up to [BLACKOUT]the future evolved people used their advanced mumbo jumbo to allow that to happen.[/BLACKOUT]

I also have no issue with the concept of humans [BLACKOUT]evolving into 5 dimensions[/BLACKOUT] or whatever stuff they were selling in this movie.

[BLACKOUT]But how is that going to happen if that needs to have happened already in order for those future people to still exist so they can send the wormhole back so past people can save humanity.[/BLACKOUT] It doesn't work.

The Bill and Ted example you brought up actually isn't too far removed from what happens here, [BLACKOUT]events are triggered to essentially fulfill the future's path. Some russian dude figured out a plausible trajectory you could do whereby you don't run into paradoxes, essentially a close loop whereby something from the future sent through a wormhole at a specific angle affects something from the past which then proceeds to create the the very same future. I think the basic concept is that you can't change the past in any form because whatever changes you make were always what was going to happen. [/BLACKOUT] Yeah, this **** is crazy lol.

 

[IncognitoWalrus]

Spoiler

That it's Brand's colony on Edmunds' planet that grows to be so advanced, they can make wormholes. And they look back and want to save the humans on earth. Technically, with Plan B, Cooper doesn't exactly need to save humanity all by his lonesome by going through the black hole.

I really like that idea!

 

[jmc]

Here's an example I think fits with Interstellar.

Spoiler

An example would be if someone wanted to go back in time and kill Hitler before he came to power, there's no possible way for them to succeed because whatever they attempted in past didn't work and Hitler rose to power regardless, whatever the time traveller attempted he/she failed to accomplish. With Interstellar future humans created a situation whereby they were laying the foundations for their own future, there was no chance of the plan failing in Interstellar because the plan already succeeded before the story even began.

 

[Anita18]

I really like that idea!

I do think it ends up being self-prophesizing and in their own self-interest too, but yeah, it's a nice idea.

Spoiler

Without getting Cooper behind the black hole and giving himself the NASA coordinates, they wouldn't have gotten him to pilot the Endurance to seed the colony in the first place. But they do allow him to finish sending the quantum data for Murph (and save earth's population) before disassembling that space and putting him back into the wormhole.

So it was kind of a bonus, haha.

 

[Jumpman]

Just walked out of the Digital IMAX. Completely and utterly stunned! The 9th Symphony of Christopher Nolan.

Just...flabbergasted.

 

[kedrell]

The only way this can make sense as I see it is if the

Spoiler

future people caused the entire scenario in the first place. They caused the blight which caused the humans to have to create the NASA program and find the wormhole the future people left so they would leave Earth and speed up human progress to eventually reach the point where the future people are, evolutionarily speaking. Perhaps it took a billion years to get to the point where the future people are and looking back from their 5th dimensional space they concluded that this took too long and the human race spent too much time essentially twiddling their thumbs and the future people wanted to change that as the universe is not going to last forever and wasting a billion years is a big problem. That way humanity was always going to survive to insure the future people's existence and extinction was never in the cards even though the past people didn't know that.

That's just a theory.

 

[jmc]

Ah here it is!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novikov_self-consistency_principle

Pretty much goes into detail about resolving paradoxes.

 

[Longshot777]

The only way this can make sense as I see it is if the

Spoiler

future people caused the entire scenario in the first place. They caused the blight which caused the humans to have to create the NASA program and find the wormhole the future people left so they would leave Earth and speed up human progress to eventually reach the point where the future people are, evolutionarily speaking. Perhaps it took a billion years to get to the point where the future people are and looking back from their 5th dimensional space they concluded that this took too long and the human race spent too much time essentially twiddling their thumbs and the future people wanted to change that as the universe is not going to last forever and wasting a billion years is a big problem. That way humanity was always going to survive to insure the future people's existence and extinction was never in the cards even though the past people didn't know that.

That's just a theory.

But Cooper wasn't really sure if it's future humans or it could be powerful aliens or God itself. Unless I missed something.

 

[kedrell]

Better spoiler tag that stuff.

Of course this is all assuming he was right. If he was wrong then we're back at square one.

 

[Anita18]

But Cooper wasn't really sure if it's [BLACKOUT]future humans or it could be powerful aliens or God itself[/BLACKOUT]. Unless I missed something.

He says it pretty concretely, so at least he's convinced that's what it is.

I don't agree with kedrell's theory though.

Spoiler

For one, it's shown that Cooper cannot communicate with the 3D world in the black hole, besides using gravity. Murphy doesn't see him, old him doesn't see himself. He can't make himself heard. He can only affect gravity. So in the film, it's established that the future humans can only affect gravity, hence just presenting the wormhole and trusting that the present humans will take the bait.

Blight of crops has nothing to do with gravity. (Plants will adjust to gravitational changes.) So "time-traveling" humans wouldn't have caused the blight. I think the wormhole is just a solution to the problem they had, which was how to escape a dying earth. That's all.

 

[Victarion]

The movie features

Spoiler

time travel? I see paradoxes mentioned here, so I was wondering. No more spoilers than a yes or no, please.

 

[jmc]

It depends on your definition. lol

 

[Mysteryman]

well, got back from seeing it.

it was good. if not a bit too long.

and the "twist" was interesting and thought provoking.

I did tear up during certain scenes.

biggest complaint was the background music. in some parts it was too LOUD and made it hard to hear the dialogue.

I saw it today, too.
I agree with your assessment.
And I definitely agree about the loudness of the music .
I saw it in 70mm IMAX and it was visually stunning .
But , the sound mix was so loud the floor was vibrating.

 

[Anita18]

It depends on your definition. lol

I'm with the "kinda sorta" camp.

 

[kedrell]

Spoiler

For one, it's shown that Cooper cannot communicate with the 3D world in the black hole, besides using gravity. Murphy doesn't see him, old him doesn't see himself. He can't make himself heard. He can only affect gravity. So in the film, it's established that the future humans can only affect gravity, hence just presenting the wormhole and trusting that the present humans will take the bait.


Blight of crops has nothing to do with gravity. (Plants will adjust to gravitational changes.) So "time-traveling" humans wouldn't have caused the blight. I think the wormhole is just a solution to the problem they had, which was how to escape a dying earth. That's all.

Spoiler

Concluding Cooper's limitations are the same for the 5th dimensional beings is a leap. There's nothing to say that's all they can do. That's never established. It's not really difficult to imagine that beings so far advanced beyond us could create a virus which slowly would destroy Earth's ability to sustain human life. In fact ultimately it would mirror the trick Caine's character felt he had to pull on everyone in a way. Perhaps the 5-D beings are limited to gravity but they can manipulate it to far greater effect and that's how they caused the present circumstance.

 

[Mysteryman]

He says it pretty concretely, so at least he's convinced that's what it is.

I don't agree with kedrell's theory though.

Spoiler

For one, it's shown that Cooper cannot communicate with the 3D world in the black hole, besides using gravity. Murphy doesn't see him, old him doesn't see himself. He can't make himself heard. He can only affect gravity. So in the film, it's established that the future humans can only affect gravity, hence just presenting the wormhole and trusting that the present humans will take the bait.

Blight of crops has nothing to do with gravity. (Plants will adjust to gravitational changes.) So "time-traveling" humans wouldn't have caused the blight. I think the wormhole is just a solution to the problem they had, which was how to escape a dying earth. That's all.

Thats what I took from it, too.

 

[Anita18]

Spoiler

Concluding Cooper's limitations are the same for the 5th dimensional beings is a leap. There's nothing to say that's all they can do. That's never established. It's not really difficult to imagine that beings so far advanced beyond us could create a virus which slowly would destroy Earth's ability to sustain human life. In fact ultimately it would mirror the trick Caine's character felt he had to pull on everyone in a way.

But what proof do you have that that happened? John Lithgow's character says that [BLACKOUT]Earth can't sustain 6 billion people.[/BLACKOUT] That's all the reasoning the movie needs, not that there's an uber-deus ex machina controlling absolutely ALL the strings.

The film explicitly shows the physical limitations, by what we see of Cooper's capabilities.

Spoiler

Amelia says quite plainly, that you can't turn time backwards. Cooper kiiind of did, but not in a very concrete time-traveling way. Due to the relationship between gravity and time established scientifically and in the movie, if you "time travel," you can only affect gravity.

You can't "send back" a virus if it doesn't already exist in the time you want to use it in. Maaaaybe a researcher had a vial of this dangerous blight pathogen sitting above farmland and the future humans just pushed it over and it hit a tractor and shattered. But you know, Occam's Razor, and there's absolutely nothing in the film that establishes this.

If those beings can affect more than gravity, why did they just make a wormhole and trust the humans would come to check it out and know what it was for? Surely they would have dropped more hints if they were able to. Seems like a lot of work just to put it there and then sit back and hope it all works.

 

[Deserana]

Jeez. Thank god for the spoiler tag. This has to be the thread with the most.

 

[Drizzle]

biggest complaint was the background music. in some parts it was too LOUD and made it hard to hear the dialogue.

I found that to be the case as well. As amazing as the soundtrack was, it drowned out some of the dialogue, particularly a lot of TARS's lines. I thought it was just the IMAX sound mix.

 

[Anita18]

Jeez. Thank god for the spoiler tag. This has to be the thread with the most.

LOL I'm thinking Inception must have had a similar number when it came out.