Iron Fist Iron Fist General Discussion Thread - Part 4

[The Infernal]

Shame it was just one episode. I thought Danny and Luke were great together. The action wasn't so good though. Thought it was worse than the IF series, but that's more a problem for S2 of Luke Cage overall. Needs better choreagraphy. Luckily Bushmaster wasn't a real physical threat so Danny didn't have to stick around for more lessons.

 

[kguillou]

I cannot believe one episode of Lule Cage single handedly made me excited for season 2 of IF because prior to it I was done with this character. After season one and Defenders I just couldnt stand Finn Jones in the role anymore. But Coket proved that with good writing and direction Finn CAN be a fun, charismatic Danny Rand.

 

[KevTravels]

I wish we got him for 1 more episode, but I could see how they just wanted to plant the seeds for later. This def did enough to get fans excited for Iron Fist season 2

 

[TheVileOne]

It was a good episode and one of my favorite ones for this season.

 

[eon001]

I hoped/predict that half the season would actually be heroes for hire with Danny Rand in at least 4-5 eps.

I'm so happy with seasons 2 of Luke Cage I'm happy with what they did.

I have a really good feeling about Iron Fist season 2. I mean it couldn't really get worse than season 1 anyway.

 

[Mike Murdock]

If you saw Season Two of Luke Cage, do you really think Iron Fist season two will be Heroes for Hire?

 

[TheVileOne]

No. But That episode of Luke Cage was basically a Heroes for Hire/Marvel Team-Up episode. Call it a backdoor pilot if they ever do the show or a miniseries.

Also, Finn looks better with straight hair. I never liked him having those awful curls.

 

[kguillou]

Even though I know they won't do it, a good way to build some serious hype/goodwill back is showing Danny is full costume at comic con this month. Enough with all this build up and waiting. Show Danny as the f***king Iron Fist, already. Stop cock teasing and just do it. It'll get people HYPED for season 2.

 

[TheVileOne]

Even though I know they won't do it, a good way to build some serious hype/goodwill back is showing Danny is full costume at comic con this month. Enough with all this build up and waiting. Show Danny as the f***king Iron Fist, already. Stop cock teasing and just do it. It'll get people HYPED for season 2.

So much this. Seeing him in costume would definitely get me hyped for season 2, and it was one of the biggest marks against the first season.

Look, everyone asks about the costume all the time. It's not just me. If they take anything from the criticism of season 1, maybe they can at least acknowledge the audience is trying to tell them something.

I think there's an easy justification for the costume. Just say it's the ceremonial garb of the Iron Fist. Martial artists wear certain clothes or uniforms for competition. It's like that. Say it's made out of strong spider silk for extra protection and chi manipulation, blah blah blah.

All I'm saying is, that's just off the top of my head. You can say that's stupid or silly or makes no sense, but I've seen far stupider in plenty of movies and TV shows.

Also, as a billionaire, Danny should want to keep a low profile for his vigilante activities anyway.

 

[KevTravels]

i'm hoping they up'd the budget this season. Improving the visual effects as well as the action sequences.

 

[TheVileOne]

Well, action and choreography at least. These shows aren't going to get bigger budgets or have much in the way of visual FX. They just aren't.

At least though in say Daredevil Season 2, we got that building billy club rope swing. All done in camera, and that was pretty cool. I wish we could get more stunts like that on these shows.

 

[Brian Braddock]

Definitely agree on the action/choreography. In a show about one of Marvel's premiere martial-artists, you would think that would be the one thing that they would be at pains to nail. That it would be the main draw of the show - the prospect of seeing absolutely kick-a$$, cool as all hell fighting. It absolutely baffles the mind that the martial-arts choreography was mediocre/bordering on sub-par at times. I accept that Finn isn't a martial artist, but you compensate for that by giving him rigorous, lengthy training.

Did we ever get confirmation on that story that Finn was given such a short time to prepare and that some of the choreography was literally made up on the spot? If so, that's such poor, poor planning. Amateurish even.

 

[TheVileOne]

Or shooting around him and giving him good stunt doubles who can execute all that.

I mean that's what they had to do with Daredevil. Cox said he trained hard and he could learn how to do a bit of a jumping roundhouse kick, but he couldn't do it full on. And choreography for Daredevil is far superior.

But there are ways they could get around Finn not being a martial arts or stunt expert.

As for why everything got rushed, I just got the sense Marvel TV wasn't putting the time or focus they needed to into Iron Fist. It seemed beforehand they were having trouble getting a showrunner attached. I don't know if that's true, but it seemed they couldn't get one until the last minute and everything had to get rushed into production quickly to meet deadlines for Iron Fist and Defenders. And that probably just led to everything getting rushed even more. Plus, Scott Buck is no Steven DeKnight. You can tell for Daredevil S1 that his influence played a big part in that first season's quality.

That being said, the fight choreography in Jessica Jones S1 wasn't any good either. In fact the action that was in there was sloppy and looked really bad.

 

[kguillou]

So much this. Seeing him in costume would definitely get me hyped for season 2, and it was one of the biggest marks against the first season.

Look, everyone asks about the costume all the time. It's not just me. If they take anything from the criticism of season 1, maybe they can at least acknowledge the audience is trying to tell them something.

I think there's an easy justification for the costume. Just say it's the ceremonial garb of the Iron Fist. Martial artists wear certain clothes or uniforms for competition. It's like that. Say it's made out of strong spider silk for extra protection and chi manipulation, blah blah blah.

All I'm saying is, that's just off the top of my head. You can say that's stupid or silly or makes no sense, but I've seen far stupider in plenty of movies and TV shows.

Also, as a billionaire, Danny should want to keep a low profile for his vigilante activities anyway.

My biggest ding against this whole Netflix initiative as a whole is that these shows seem to be ALL about teasing the fans and either making them wait to see what they really want or veering in the complete opposite direction of what they want. It feels like they're doing it on purpose. Why aren't Luke and Jessica together? ESPECIALLY after we've seen how good they are together as a pair. Its become clear that they have no intention of bringing those two back together again after TEASING us in JJ season 1 and seeing how well Colter and Ritter are together.

Its things like this that are frustrating and all of the shows do it. Like, how the f*** did they NOT give Danny a costume in Defenders? How? I'm even wondering if they're going to give him one at all despite the fact they know well and good the fans are begging and pleading for it.

 

[TheVileOne]

The Luke and Jessica thing doesn't bother me as much.

I mean Jessica did kill his wife. And while Luke has moved on from that and understands what happened now and genuinely made amends with Jessica in Defenders, it's sort of still kind of fresh for them to become an actual pairing. Plus they are on separate shows now. But Luke also knows that Reva was somewhat duplicitous and not the woman he thought she was.

As for the costume, I'm not holding my breath on it. I saw that Jeph Loeb Reddit Q&A, and it still doesn't convince me.

But kguillou, to take things a step further, look at The Punisher. The first five minutes basically has him quitting being The Punisher. And he doesn't even wear the skull again until the very end. So they put it off in Daredevil until the very end and then they did it againf or his own show. I mean it's supposed to be a Punisher series.

 

[kguillou]

Exactly, thats what I'm talking about. Why couldnt he just BE the Punisher in his own series after they set up him up in DD? I dont mind build up whether its in film,or tv and having a cool pay off in the end but they really seem to be overdoing it with these shows sometimes.

 

[Brian Braddock]

I'll admit, without the costume there were parts of the Punisher series where I just thought 'Bernthal may as well just be playing Paul Kersey, or the same kind of character that we've seen a thousand times, here'.

 

[TheVileOne]

I guess my main issue with Punisher (TV show) is that Punisher as a character IMO is fully dedicated to a never-ending war on crime. He's a warrior that needs a war, and he's found it with crime in general.

He wants to be a boogeyman for criminals. He's generally not seen as an ally or friend to the hero community. He plays by his own set of rules. I feel like he can't let go of it because it's all he has left. It's at war when he's in his element and he knows what to do.

The TV show just seems resistant to that idea.

 

[Random490]

I guess my main issue with Punisher (TV show) is that Punisher as a character IMO is fully dedicated to a never-ending war on crime. He's a warrior that needs a war, and he's found it with crime in general.

He wants to be a boogeyman for criminals. He's generally not seen as an ally or friend to the hero community. He plays by his own set of rules. I feel like he can't let go of it because it's all he has left. It's at war when he's in his element and he knows what to do.

The TV show just seems resistant to that idea.

I think they're saving that for next and future seasons. I found what they did gave the character more dimensions and made it more interesting than the typically "wounded anti hero goes to war".

Season one was all about exploring his past and coming to terms with his loss. It starts with him trying to avoid his issues in negative ways and ends with him confronting them in more positive. I have a feeling season two will end with him deciding to become that boogeyman.

I feel that is a strength for the Punisher, having an interesting look at Frank as a character. Unlike Iron Fist season one, Danny's journey here just isn't as developed. His motivations always seemed more shallow, inconsistent, and unfocused. It felt more like writers checking off plot point rather than really exploring the character. Really hope season two puts him on an interesting journey.

 

[TheVileOne]

I think they're saving that for next and future seasons. I found what they did gave the character more dimensions and made it more interesting than the typically "wounded anti hero goes to war".

Season one was all about exploring his past and coming to terms with his loss. It starts with him trying to avoid his issues in negative ways and ends with him confronting them in more positive. I have a feeling season two will end with him deciding to become that boogeyman.

I feel that is a strength for the Punisher, having an interesting look at Frank as a character. Unlike Iron Fist season one, Danny's journey here just isn't as developed. His motivations always seemed more shallow, inconsistent, and unfocused. It felt more like writers checking off plot point rather than really exploring the character. Really hope season two puts him on an interesting journey.

That'd be fine if it was about Frank Castle quitting and letting go of the Punisher so he can find peace and move on with his life.

IMHO that's an ending you can give a series if you want to give Frank a happy ending. I didn't necessarily need a cliffhanger. But what I really wanted was an ending where Frank has embraced his role.

Why does Frank need to fight? His reason for fighting is essentially over. The people involved with his family's murder are all dead or taken care of. Other than Russo, who he willfully let survive.

 

[Hypestyle]

I'm finally catching up with the first season. I'm almost done.

Overall my takeaway is pretty good, though not as good as the Daredevil seasons or Luke Cage season 1 (i haven't seen Jesica Jones 1 or 2 yet, nor Cage S2)..

Spoiler

I'm aware of the non-positive reviews that it got hit with early on.
I'd say that the show has suffered from not having a clear-cut main villain early on. Is it Madame Gau? Is it Harold Meachum? Is it Ward? Maybe Joy? The frenemy back and forth between them all gets a little grating at times, lol.

I'm not familiar with the early solo Iron Fist comics before the partnership with Power Man.. I also haven't read the last couple of revival series (including the "Immortal Iron Fist" run).. so there may be character references and places that are above my head.

Jessica Henwick #samuraibae is very pretty and quite enjoyable as Colleen I haven't seen her in anything else- I've read that she and Finn Jones are alums of Game of Thrones? Compared to some in fandom, I wasn't offended by the choice to make her and Danny a couple instead of him and Misty (so far)...

I was pleasantly surprised to see Clifton Davis as the Rand board member Lawrence Wilkins..nice-- I wonder how many in comics-fandom even know about his career..

As for Finn Jones himself, he does a good enough job.. again, I don't know his other work at all-- making Danny into something of a hipster millennial was I suppose, fairly par for the course.. (nice music selections on his MP3 player, lol.)

Claire Temple! #nursebae Wonderful to see her in the latter episodes, Rosario is a pleasure to watch, I hope her character continues in the shows, at least Luke's most of all.

so far, the series had kind of a slow build in the earliest episodes, not a whole lot of action, and amorphous agendas for the antagonists-- generic corporate vultures, and the Hand is, well, on hand again for nefarious... stuff..

I wonder how much more will be revealed about Madame Gao at the end. I doubt she'll meet her demise.

 

[BaronZemo]

i'm hoping they up'd the budget this season. Improving the visual effects as well as the action sequences.

i'm sick and tired having to remind everyone all the time who is in charge of marvel tv. Ike won't give one extra dollar. stop asking for bigger budgets.

 

[TheVileOne]

Well if they didn't give extra money for Defenders, why are they going to do it for Iron Fist?

 

[KevTravels]

i'm sick and tired having to remind everyone all the time who is in charge of marvel tv. Ike won't give one extra dollar. stop asking for bigger budgets.

Even now? I thought he got fired. Or maybe I'm thinking of someone else.

Damn, how can Marvel Tv be so cheap.

 

[Hypestyle]

find solid character actors to make up or the budget shortcomings.

No dragons. that should keep the budget in check somewhat.