Mass Effect 3

[Donut]

Oh, and Bioware's response to the outcry has been various producers, writers and staffers making several ominous/suggestive tweets, message board posts, etc.

If I'm going to criticize Bioware for anything, it is this. They're basically egging it on at this point. If you have something to announce, announce it. Otherwise, just shut up and let the fanboys vent until you have something to announce. Throwing fuel into a fire is stupid and disrespectful to your consumer (who no matter how irrational they may be acting, put food on your table). Act professionally.

Bioware seems more focused on the DLC anger then the ending anger to give any real response to the ending anger

 

[DeGenerate10]

I don't really get all the DLC anger

 

[iamlegend]

Bioware seems more focused on the DLC anger then the ending anger to give any real response to the ending anger

Bioware, being staffed by gamers, is also naturally inclined to be snarky.

I honestly think their various posts addressing the ending are legitimately just ways to tease the fan base into inevitably buying more DLC. Money, money, money...

 

[Donut]

I honestly think their various posts addressing the ending are legitimately just ways to tease the fan base into inevitably buying more DLC. Money, money, money...

Hopefully they wait to long to release the DLC. Then people will eventually start trading in Mass Effect 3 & will just watch the DLC on Youtube

 

[smashmode]

Possible reason about the endings

Spoiler

There is another explanation. From the audio files people have extracted and posted on the BW forums, it appears that Shepard was originally supposed to end up back on Earth somehow, and the Normandy was supposed to get in a fight with Harbinger and be forced to run away through the mass relay. All that was cut from the ending for reasons unknown, along with a bunch of extra Anderson dialogue.
The most plausible explanation is that they simply got lazy and/or pressed for time at the end, rewrote the ending into its current form, but used the clips you mention (which became nonsensical after the revisions) because they didn't have time to render and record anything else.
It'd be nice to think they have some kind of master plan here, but IMO they just ****ed up.

 

[iamlegend]

Possible reason about the endings

Spoiler

There is another explanation. From the audio files people have extracted and posted on the BW forums, it appears that Shepard was originally supposed to end up back on Earth somehow, and the Normandy was supposed to get in a fight with Harbinger and be forced to run away through the mass relay. All that was cut from the ending for reasons unknown, along with a bunch of extra Anderson dialogue.
The most plausible explanation is that they simply got lazy and/or pressed for time at the end, rewrote the ending into its current form, but used the clips you mention (which became nonsensical after the revisions) because they didn't have time to render and record anything else.
It'd be nice to think they have some kind of master plan here, but IMO they just ****ed up.

Spoiler

Yeah, the 'original script' that hit the net in November had an entire scene where the Normandy appeared and kept Harbinger and company busy while Anderson and co. had some dramatic final stand scene before throwing themselves into the fire to ensure that Shepard made it to the Citadel. I, too, assume that they just ran out of time and had to scrap it.

 

[Matt]

Truth. It's so ****ing childlike. Look at this tweet. It's not the only one like that. Whoever is in charge of their feed should be ashamed.

Agreed. Some of it is down right disrespectful. I get that fans aren't exactly being rational, but you had to expect this when you decided upon that ending. Let them vent. They put food on your table and money in your pocket. So they're upset and acting like jerks? Big deal....don't egg it on.

Jessica Merizan, Bioware's community outreach director has been handling it the best. She lets fanboys vent with respectful responses on Twitter (and she seems to respond to everyone). The only frustrating thing I've seen from her is she too has been unable to resist the urge to post an ominous "Wait til you see it all," type tweet.

Bioware seems more focused on the DLC anger then the ending anger to give any real response to the ending anger

They've been pushing buttons with the ending too. Basically every Bioware employee has tweeted or posted some kind of message that is essentially "Don't judge the ending until you see EVERYTHING we have in store." I think they need to either announce something or shut the hell up about it. Aside from the fact that saying things like that only throws fuel into the fire, the implication in those types of tweets is that Bioware released an incomplete game and we will need DLC to really see and judge the ending.

Bioware, being staffed by gamers, is also naturally inclined to be snarky.

I honestly think their various posts addressing the ending are legitimately just ways to tease the fan base into inevitably buying more DLC. Money, money, money...

Nail, meet head. I think right now, Bioware is pissing their pants. Their ending pissed a lot of people off. I happened to like it, but I acknowledge that a good many did not. Like you said, Bioware is staffed by gamers. It is essentially a studio made of gamers for gamers. Gamers want to be liked, to be seen as the cool kids. This backlash....they didn't anticipate on this level. Now they are releasing ominous tweets with no real plan to add on at the moment (I'm sure they have some DLC up their sleeves, but I don't think that they had anything in mind to undo the ending prior to launch). I think that the tweets and posts that imply as much are purely responsive, telling people what they think that they want to hear to placate them and reclaim their title as the cool studio that listens to their fans and what not.

That said, I hope they don't give in to pressure. Own your ending, let it stand. Don't let the internet pressure you into changing it.

 

[X Knight]

well, didn't they tell us beforehand to "hold on" to our ME 3 saves?

perhaps that was a hint that they had more stuff planned after the "end" of ME 3......

 

[Benstamania]

This isn't the first short ending.. Anyone remember the KotOR and KotOR II endings?

Yeah...

Ateast this time we'll probably get DLC that expands on said ending.

And yes, I will buy it. I'm not suddenly going to hate Bioware because I got upset over an ending.

Which I didn't even get upset over.

 

[Matt]

Interesting article, kind of defends the fanboys.

Link

Of course, it raises the question....why the **** is Forbes magazine covering Mass Effect 3 so heavily?

 

[Wolvieboy17]

I disagree with that article though.

Because, at the end of the day, the fact of the matter is DEMANDING a new ending IS being entitled. It's one thing to hate the ending but to say that you are actually owed a new one is simply ridiculous. You might wish there was a different ending but to honestly feel like you deserve one is just silly.

I've thought even more about the endings now and

Spoiler

I think they're great. It always sucks to have your character sacrifice their own life, but how many other ways did people expect this whole thing to end? What kind of hypocrite would Shepard be and by extension, you the gamer, if after witnessing the deaths of millions and even being responsible for plenty yourself, you aren't prepared to end your own life to save them all?

Also, I'm so sick of the misconception that NONE of your choices leading up to the end matter. Who the **** is only playing Mass Effect for an end result? It's an RPG, your decisions colour and change everything around you for 3 games! By the time you even get to the end, most of the big decisions have been mentioned or resolved in some way anyway, and even then, your decisions and choices still directly affect who else survives and the trimmings of those cutscenes.

Being 'outraged' by the supposed limited options at the end is like being outraged that you only get Renegade and Paragon options. That's only 2 choices for most situations, yet that's never been a problem before.

I think the main reason people seem to have a problem with the ending is that they

Spoiler

haven't quite lost that 'I have to save everyone' attitude that ME 1 and 2 feeds, which seems to be the whole point of ME 3 anyway. Thats why Shepard is haunted by visions of the little boy (and obviously why his image is used at the end), why Thessia is such a large blow, why it affects you as a gamer when Thane or Miranda die and you can't help them In many ways, I think the ending is much better utilised than Red Dead Redemption or L.A. Noire, which used a similar idea for the ending.

 

[ChrisBaleBatman]

Finally got to start this. Just ran into Chobot. ugh.

Everything else is pretty cool tho.

She's really not so bad. You'll probably forget she's even on the ship. Or you can just kick her off, if you're so inclined.

I think people overreacted to her presence in the game. Weirdly so, but then again...it is the internet.

 

[Balthus Dire]

TBH I can't stand how people lump anyone who complains into an "entitled" or whiny fanboy category. Sure, some of the complainers are a bit fanatic about it, but I mean...that happens when you're passionate about something. You're talking about a massive franchise that's adored by thousands and thousands of loyal fans who have invested mass (no pun intended) amounts of time getting to know and love the characters and universe Bioware has created. Even if you personally LOVE the ending and think it's the best thing since Batarian porn, I don't think it should be difficult to grasp why others are outspoken if they dislike it.

Also, the more I read about the previous leaks and certain things in the art book and stuff it just seems like Bioware might've flat out ran out of time or something in designing the endgame. It seems like they had a lot more planned but then ended up cutting stuff, so in turn we have a bit of a disjointed ending. Maybe those missing pieces are what will show up as DLC, but I'm not holding my breath. I don't think they planned for disappointment TBH.

 

[Balthus Dire]

I disagree with that article though.

Because, at the end of the day, the fact of the matter is DEMANDING a new ending IS being entitled. It's one thing to hate the ending but to say that you are actually owed a new one is simply ridiculous. You might wish there was a different ending but to honestly feel like you deserve one is just silly.

I've thought even more about the endings now and

Spoiler

I think they're great. It always sucks to have your character sacrifice their own life, but how many other ways did people expect this whole thing to end? What kind of hypocrite would Shepard be and by extension, you the gamer, if after witnessing the deaths of millions and even being responsible for plenty yourself, you aren't prepared to end your own life to save them all?

Also, I'm so sick of the misconception that NONE of your choices leading up to the end matter. Who the **** is only playing Mass Effect for an end result? It's an RPG, your decisions colour and change everything around you for 3 games! By the time you even get to the end, most of the big decisions have been mentioned or resolved in some way anyway, and even then, your decisions and choices still directly affect who else survives and the trimmings of those cutscenes.

Being 'outraged' by the supposed limited options at the end is like being outraged that you only get Renegade and Paragon options. That's only 2 choices for most situations, yet that's never been a problem before.

I think the main reason people seem to have a problem with the ending is that they

Spoiler

haven't quite lost that 'I have to save everyone' attitude that ME 1 and 2 feeds, which seems to be the whole point of ME 3 anyway. Thats why Shepard is haunted by visions of the little boy (and obviously why his image is used at the end), why Thessia is such a large blow, why it affects you as a gamer when Thane or Miranda die and you can't help them In many ways, I think the ending is much better utilised than Red Dead Redemption or L.A. Noire, which used a similar idea for the ending.

Spoiler

As has been said previously in the thread, I think most of the animosity is geared towards the complete lack of epilogue and closure and not so much Shep dying.

Yes, there have been complaints about Shep's death as well, but I think it would've gone over easier with fans if we saw some kind of results from that. We don't even know what happens to everyone lol the game just ends...after 3 massive games where miniscule choices effect the gameplay and story elements, you'd think they would've ended it with some kind of epilogue that took those elements into account. But, they didn't, so people are upset. Add gaping plotholes into that equation and people are even more upset.

 

[Matt]

I disagree with that article though.

Because, at the end of the day, the fact of the matter is DEMANDING a new ending IS being entitled. It's one thing to hate the ending but to say that you are actually owed a new one is simply ridiculous. You might wish there was a different ending but to honestly feel like you deserve one is just silly.

I've thought even more about the endings now and

Spoiler

I think they're great. It always sucks to have your character sacrifice their own life, but how many other ways did people expect this whole thing to end? What kind of hypocrite would Shepard be and by extension, you the gamer, if after witnessing the deaths of millions and even being responsible for plenty yourself, you aren't prepared to end your own life to save them all?

Also, I'm so sick of the misconception that NONE of your choices leading up to the end matter. Who the **** is only playing Mass Effect for an end result? It's an RPG, your decisions colour and change everything around you for 3 games! By the time you even get to the end, most of the big decisions have been mentioned or resolved in some way anyway, and even then, your decisions and choices still directly affect who else survives and the trimmings of those cutscenes.

Being 'outraged' by the supposed limited options at the end is like being outraged that you only get Renegade and Paragon options. That's only 2 choices for most situations, yet that's never been a problem before.

I think the main reason people seem to have a problem with the ending is that they

Spoiler

haven't quite lost that 'I have to save everyone' attitude that ME 1 and 2 feeds, which seems to be the whole point of ME 3 anyway. Thats why Shepard is haunted by visions of the little boy (and obviously why his image is used at the end), why Thessia is such a large blow, why it affects you as a gamer when Thane or Miranda die and you can't help them In many ways, I think the ending is much better utilised than Red Dead Redemption or L.A. Noire, which used a similar idea for the ending.

I disagree. I've been fairly supportive of the ending, but I disagree with this....

Spoiler

Fans feel entitled because Bioware convinced them that they were a part of the story. From day one, from the very first GI article about Mass Effect, Bioware has been saying that this is a trilogy where every choice made will go on to affect future games and that the player will have control.

Hell, even in the build up to ME3, how many interviews have we seen with Casey Hudson where he said that no two endings will be the same and that every choice will have built into them?


I'm not saying there should've been three clear cut choices, one where Shepard dies, one where he lives and one that is ambiguous. I am saying that decisions should have led to different fates. If I am a pure renegade, Shepard should essentially become the Illusive Man. If I am a pure Paragon, then self-sacrifice makes sense. If I built the grandest army of all time, I should've been able to say, "**** your choices, we'll fight." Even if the ending after that is uncertain, it is humanity and life going on their terms, not the Reapers. If I had basically no army, then I should've never even made it to the Citadel and so on and so forth.

No matter what you do...the same three choices are there. No matter which you pick, the ending is the same, only with a different color.

Fans deserved better because Bioware told us that we deserved better. From day one, Bioware told us that this is OUR STORY. The fans aren't just feeling entitled, we were told we were going to be a part of crafting it. When we put our money down, we invested in the experience that we promised. And what we received is not that experience. And that is fine for guys like you and I who liked the ending, but fans who wanted something different, some actual choice and control should've had it.

I liked the ending. It was a fitting ending for my Shepard and ME universe. But I can see how it wasn't for others and that is the problem. Bioware told us that we can each build our story....but in the end, they made one ending, regardless of what story you built.

What Bioware pulled to those fans makes Peter Molyneux look like the most honest man on Earth and I can get why they are pissed.

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

Spoiler

I mean heck ME2 let you talk to your squadmates after the suicide mission which was totally unnecessary but very cool. It just seems so bizarre in a game that completely raised the level of interaction with your squad not to mention the general scope over all previous installments to suddenly just forget about all of that.

 

[Balthus Dire]

I liked the ending. It was a fitting ending for my Shepard and ME universe. But I can see how it wasn't for others and that is the problem. Bioware told us that we can each build our story....but in the end, they made one ending, regardless of what story you built.

What Bioware pulled to those fans makes Peter Molyneux look like the most honest man on Earth and I can get why they are pissed.

Pretty much sums it up.

 

[Matt]

My thoughts on "entitlement," are this:

Entitled is the wrong word. Entitlement implies that they do not deserve it. The fact is, fans were sold the very thing that they are asking for. If I am sold an apple and am handed an orange, am I entitled if I say, "Wait a tick....this isn't an apple,"? That is what happened here.

Whether the ending is good or not is irrelevant. Entitlement is the wrong choice of words.

 

[PWN3R]

I disagree. I've been fairly supportive of the ending, but I disagree with this....

Spoiler

Fans feel entitled because Bioware convinced them that they were a part of the story. From day one, from the very first GI article about Mass Effect, Bioware has been saying that this is a trilogy where every choice made will go on to affect future games and that the player will have control.

Hell, even in the build up to ME3, how many interviews have we seen with Casey Hudson where he said that no two endings will be the same and that every choice will have built into them?


I'm not saying there should've been three clear cut choices, one where Shepard dies, one where he lives and one that is ambiguous. I am saying that decisions should have led to different fates. If I am a pure renegade, Shepard should essentially become the Illusive Man. If I am a pure Paragon, then self-sacrifice makes sense. If I built the grandest army of all time, I should've been able to say, "**** your choices, we'll fight." Even if the ending after that is uncertain, it is humanity and life going on their terms, not the Reapers. If I had basically no army, then I should've never even made it to the Citadel and so on and so forth.

No matter what you do...the same three choices are there. No matter which you pick, the ending is the same, only with a different color.

Fans deserved better because Bioware told us that we deserved better. From day one, Bioware told us that this is OUR STORY. The fans aren't just feeling entitled, we were told we were going to be a part of crafting it. When we put our money down, we invested in the experience that we promised. And what we received is not that experience. And that is fine for guys like you and I who liked the ending, but fans who wanted something different, some actual choice and control should've had it.

I liked the ending. It was a fitting ending for my Shepard and ME universe. But I can see how it wasn't for others and that is the problem. Bioware told us that we can each build our story....but in the end, they made one ending, regardless of what story you built.

What Bioware pulled to those fans makes Peter Molyneux look like the most honest man on Earth and I can get why they are pissed.

You said it. Wolvie's post really made me lol. No one is complaining because [BLACKOUT]Shep dies[/BLACKOUT]. I'm just too depressed and lazy to respond with the old wall of text. Thank you.

EDIT:

 

[Balthus Dire]

^ errr...might wanna put a spoiler tag on that.

 

[Balthus Dire]

My thoughts on "entitlement," are this:

Entitled is the wrong word. Entitlement implies that they do not deserve it. The fact is, fans were sold the very thing that they are asking for. If I am sold an apple and am handed an orange, am I entitled if I say, "Wait a tick....this isn't an apple,"? That is what happened here.

Whether the ending is good or not is irrelevant. Entitlement is the wrong choice of words.

Another winner.

 

[smashmode]

TBH I can't stand how people lump anyone who complains into an "entitled" or whiny fanboy category. Sure, some of the complainers are a bit fanatic about it, but I mean...that happens when you're passionate about something. You're talking about a massive franchise that's adored by thousands and thousands of loyal fans who have invested mass (no pun intended) amounts of time getting to know and love the characters and universe Bioware has created. Even if you personally LOVE the ending and think it's the best thing since Batarian porn, I don't think it should be difficult to grasp why others are outspoken if they dislike it.

Also, the more I read about the previous leaks and certain things in the art book and stuff it just seems like Bioware might've flat out ran out of time or something in designing the endgame. It seems like they had a lot more planned but then ended up cutting stuff, so in turn we have a bit of a disjointed ending. Maybe those missing pieces are what will show up as DLC, but I'm not holding my breath. I don't think they planned for disappointment TBH.

Agreed, I think you are not looking at the whole picture when you lump everyone into 'whiny' fanboy/entitled group. There are legitmate concerns here that people are trying to sweep under the rug.

And what is it with this thought that people are not allowed to ask for a new ending. Is Bioware a business? Are we not the consumers? We can demand whatever the hell we want from a company that we do business with, its our right as the consumer. It is also the companies right to either fix the consumer's issues or just ignore the complaints.

Leading up to the third installment, there were producers talking about how your choices matter, about all these different kinds of endings that depends on your choices throughout the games. People can spin it anyway they want to, this is just not the case.

Also I am completely okay with

Spoiler

Shep dying, not everyone wants a happy rainbows and unicorn ending, I just want his death to actually 'matter' if that makes sense.

 

[smashmode]

Interesting article, kind of defends the fanboys.

Link

Of course, it raises the question....why the **** is Forbes magazine covering Mass Effect 3 so heavily?

They have a technology sector on forbes, and a couple of their writers are talking about it.

Interesting enough, the most viewed article at forbes.com? Deals with Mass effect 3 and how Bioware can find Redemption with a new DLC.

Its not just gaming sites that are now stepping forward and defending the fans, you have forbes, and I saw a piece by Ars Technica also stating the same thing. Bioware screwed the ending.

 

[PWN3R]

Again, so sorry for that spoiler. Corrected it.

 

[smashmode]

Another piece from Forbes:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2012/03/13/why-fan-service-is-good-business/

I’ve been told that the article I wrote yesterday about Bioware’s bungling of Mass Effect 3 was the only real defense of the game’s fans that exists in “mainstream” gaming journalism. And sure enough, when I looked around, I found huge sites like Kotaku, IGN and GiantBomb mocking fans for complaining about the unsatisfying conclusion.

Leave it to Forbes of all sites to stand up for gamers. I do believe Kotaku finally posted something defending the fans, after their first several articles bashed on the fans, perhaps they are reading the tea leaves and see they are on the wrong side of this discussion.