Petitions Filed in 15 States to Leave the Union

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

We all know what happened when there was a legitimate movement towards secession don't we? It didn't turn out well for those that tried if I can remember correctly.

Thats why I say let them try.

But on a serious note, sometimes I do wonder if secession is really so bad. I mean, seriously... There are elements on both sides that are so far apart that I wonder if it wouldn't be best letting us each have our own countries.

The right can have their Christian based theocracy where they dont allow gays, Muslims, or women's rights, and the left can have their athiest government that gives handouts to everyone.

So there's some exaggeration in there, but a part of me wouldn't mind the Christian right having their own country so they can keep their religion out of my life.

 

[Marvolo]

Thats why I say let them try.

But on a serious note, sometimes I do wonder if secession is really so bad. I mean, seriously... There are elements on both sides that are so far apart that I wonder if it wouldn't be best letting us each have our own countries.

The right can have their Christian based theocracy where they dont allow gays, Muslims, or women's rights, and the left can have their athiest government that gives handouts to everyone.

So there's some exaggeration in there, but a part of me wouldn't mind the Christian right having their own country so they can keep their religion out of my life.

No because the majority in that state wanting secession may not speak for the minority who do not want it. And the minority would have to leave their homes to go to another union state. Also it would weaken those states and potentially create an enemy state right at our border. Imagine if one union state was surrounded by non union states. It would eventually lead to problems. The differences would over time lead to conflicts. The reason states cant attack and strangle each other is due to us being regulated and protected by our federation. You get rid of that and problems will arise. So no i dont think it is a good idea. The last thing i want is a bigoted religious state with no intelligent regulations rising up next door to my state.

It would also do a number on the global economy. That is something we dont need. The dollar would be weakened due to some states adopting new economies. Trade would be a mess of varying regulations and some states would tax other states more for political reasons. Alliances would rise up and squash opposing weaker states. These are the reasons we need a federal government. To keep these things from happening.

 

[Hotwire]

I would wager that just about every one of the people signing those petitions have no clue just how much the federal government does to help keep their state afloat. Nor do they fully grasp the consequences of suddenly creating 15 new countries inside this one. They would be suddenly forcing thousands of companies to go into an international market. I'd bet they're not thinking about how they secure their borders between other states. Hell, I doubt they can even fathom the simple cost of starting their own countries. They're just pissed and want to whine about it.

 

[terry78]

If they did manage to break off, they'd collapse in on themselves via martial law within a month.

 

[AndrewGilkison]

I would wager that just about every one of the people signing those petitions have no clue just how much the federal government does to help keep their state afloat. Nor do they fully grasp the consequences of suddenly creating 15 new countries inside this one. They would be suddenly forcing thousands of companies to go into an international market. I'd bet they're not thinking about how they secure their borders between other states. Hell, I doubt they can even fathom the simple cost of starting their own countries. They're just pissed and want to whine about it.

What else do you expect from the kind of people that likely take what Rush Limbaugh and Glen Beck say on the radio as gospel?

 

[wraith20878]

This sounds like a marvelous idea. I seem to remember that this happened before. Nation divided, 600,000 dead, and thousands more maimed. Those were great times weren't they?

This is why when anyone tells me "the south will rise again" I get pissed. Seriously, that worked out so well for us the last time, right?

 

[Spider‐Man]

Just because he won reelection doesn't make the racist any less racist. They are stubborn bunch.

Yes, but you're just perpetuatring the acceptability of casually playing the race card when there is no evidence that any exists. As I said, if you'd have said this 4 years ago, even without evidence, it would have still been more credible. To say 'we can't have a black president' when the fact is we've already had one for 4 years seems silly. If these people are doing this for racist reasons, why didn;t they do it 4 years ago? 'We can't have a black president' sounds like a more viable accusation when a black president is first elected. Today, what IS new is people who after 4 years feel Obama has done a lousy job and can't believe that he got rewarded with 4 more years. That hardly has anything to do with race.

 

[Hotwire]

Yes, but you're just perpetuatring the acceptability of casually playing the race card when there is no evidence that any exists. As I said, if you'd have said this 4 years ago, even without evidence, it would have still been more credible. To say 'we can't have a black president' when the fact is we've already had one for 4 years seems silly. If these people are doing this for racist reasons, why didn;t they do it 4 years ago? 'We can't have a black president' sounds like a more viable accusation when a black president is first elected. Today, what IS new is people who after 4 years feel Obama has done a lousy job and can't believe that he got rewarded with 4 more years. That hardly has anything to do with race.

I Googled "racist anti-obama signs" and this was the first result. Take a look at the date.

I'm sure you'll dismiss it as an isolated incident but, I can tell you from personal experience. There are plenty of people who hate him just because he's black. How do I know? Because they've said things just like that sign reads while I was in their house.

Here's some more...
http://news.cnet.com/8301-17852_3-57548077-71/racist-anti-obama-facebook-post-gets-woman-fired/

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/students-accused-racist-anti-obama-tweets-article-1.1200113

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...hite-house-campaign-event-ohio_n_1963583.html

Should I keep going? Seriously, just do some Google searching.

 

[Spider‐Man]

I Googled "racist anti-obama signs" and this was the first result. Take a look at the date.

I'm sure you'll dismiss it as an isolated incident but, I can tell you from personal experience. There are plenty of people who hate him just because he's black. How do I know? Because they've said things just like that sign reads while I was in their house.

Here's some more...
http://news.cnet.com/8301-17852_3-57548077-71/racist-anti-obama-facebook-post-gets-woman-fired/

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/students-accused-racist-anti-obama-tweets-article-1.1200113

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...hite-house-campaign-event-ohio_n_1963583.html

Should I keep going? Seriously, just do some Google searching.

I am not saying that there aren't people who don't like obama based on race. I can show plenty of google results with racist hate talk directed at whites by blacks. I could post some videos but the language won't allow it, but as you say just do some google searching. Yes, there are plenty of whites who hate blacks because they're black. There are plenty of blacks who hate whites because they're white.

But are you trying to say that EVERYONE who doesn't approve of Obama does so based on race and therefore using that as 'proof' that anyone who wants to secede wants to do so for racist reasons?

edit*: thought I'd show some people's oposition to Obama. DO you see race in any of these?

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2012/09/why-i-refuse-to-vote-for-barack-obama/262861/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/ezra-klein/wp/2012/08/20/the-best-case-against-the-obama-administration/

http://www.salon.com/2012/10/27/the_progressive_case_against_obama/

http://www.policymic.com/articles/3227/ndaa-barack-obama-s-war-against-the-american-people

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TKCwSVH7Bw

Remember, when all you look at is race, all you see is racism.

 

[Hotwire]

I am not saying that there aren't people who don't like obama based on race. I can show plenty of google results with racist hate talk directed at whites by blacks. I could post some videos but the language won't allow it, but as you say just do some google searching. Yes, there are plenty of whites who hate blacks because they're black. There are plenty of blacks who hate whites because they're white.

But are you trying to say that EVERYONE who doesn't approve of Obama does so based on race and therefore using that as 'proof' that anyone who wants to secede wants to do so for racist reasons?

edit*: thought I'd show some people's oposition to Obama. DO you see race in any of these?

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2012/09/why-i-refuse-to-vote-for-barack-obama/262861/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/ezra-klein/wp/2012/08/20/the-best-case-against-the-obama-administration/

http://www.salon.com/2012/10/27/the_progressive_case_against_obama/

http://www.policymic.com/articles/3227/ndaa-barack-obama-s-war-against-the-american-people

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TKCwSVH7Bw

Remember, when all you look at is race, all you see is racism.

I'm not saying that everyone who voted against Obama is racist, just that to say it's not a factor is wrong.

 

[Spider‐Man]

I'm not saying that everyone who voted against Obama is racist, just that to say it's not a factor is wrong.

You were responding to my point that, with no proof, 100% of the people filing for petition to secede were automatically accused of doing so because they were racist. Your post seemed to be trying to defend that as a fact.

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

Secession obviously weakens the United States and would place a potential enemy/competitor right next to our borders.

So why is building support for secession not considered treason???

 

[Spider‐Man]

Secession obviously weakens the United States and would place a potential enemy/competitor right next to our borders.

So why is building support for secession not considered treason???

I would say these petitions are more of a symbolic gesture than anything. Secession is obviously illegal as determined by Texas v. white.

I guess in this letigious society you can petition to sue anyone but to actually attempt to secede (which would be the illegal part) would take more than a few individually filed petitions.

 

[Hotwire]

You were responding to my point that, with no proof, 100% of the people filing for petition to secede were automatically accused of doing so because they were racist. Your post seemed to be trying to defend that as a fact.

Okay. So, we better understand each other, now?

 

[Dr. Evil]

This isn't going to happen. It's nothing. I don't know why such a thread is necessary when it's not going to happen.

I am looking at this from an international standpoint, which if there is interest, I could go into full detail about.

 

[Matt Mortem]

This literally one of the most stupid things I've ever seen or read. Bunch of ****ing cry babies. If you don't like how the US is going politically, then take action to change it. Don't just vote and then throw a hissy fit because your guy lost. This is just one big stupid temper tantrum. I'd be interested to see the demographic of the people who started the petitions. I'd assume it's a group of angry old white people, but I could be wrong.

 

[Marvolo]

Yes, but you're just perpetuatring the acceptability of casually playing the race card when there is no evidence that any exists. As I said, if you'd have said this 4 years ago, even without evidence, it would have still been more credible. To say 'we can't have a black president' when the fact is we've already had one for 4 years seems silly. If these people are doing this for racist reasons, why didn;t they do it 4 years ago? 'We can't have a black president' sounds like a more viable accusation when a black president is first elected. Today, what IS new is people who after 4 years feel Obama has done a lousy job and can't believe that he got rewarded with 4 more years. That hardly has anything to do with race.

Im not sure what you are getting at but my original post that you responded to was about someone i know saying he wanted a white president again. He wanted a white president four years ago also. He doesnt want a black president ever. It had nothing to do with other racists or a group. Just a comment i made about something i heard.

Now i can say that in my area the racists are still alive and in full swing. They havent stopped being racist after four years of having a black president. True racism is engrained deeper than that and it grows on ignorance so to expect it to disappear because of logic isnt well logical lol. These people ignore logic. Ive already heard some say it would be a shame to have a cuban american (Rubio) as president before another white man.

 

[Doctor Evo]

Don't let the door hit your asses on the way out.

 

[Hotwire]

Don't let the door hit your asses on the way out.

It's actually not that easy. Just think about some of the consequences. The massive influx of population to the surrounding states. Think of how many companies would be forced into the international market. The impact it would have on travel. We currently enjoy the ease of interstate travel. Throw a foreign country in the middle, and it suddenly gets a whole lot harder.

This whole thing just reminds me of some 5 year old kid who doesn't get his way and decides he's going to run away from home.

 

[Doctor Evo]

It's actually not that easy. Just think about some of the consequences. The massive influx of population to the surrounding states. Think of how many companies would be forced into the international market. The impact it would have on travel. We currently enjoy the ease of interstate travel. Throw a foreign country in the middle, and it suddenly gets a whole lot harder.

This whole thing just reminds me of some 5 year old kid who doesn't get his way and decides he's going to run away from home.

And the award for, "Takes Facetious Post Too Seriously" goes to...

Obviously this isn't going to happen.

 

[Matt Mortem]

It's actually not that easy. Just think about some of the consequences. The massive influx of population to the surrounding states. Think of how many companies would be forced into the international market. The impact it would have on travel. We currently enjoy the ease of interstate travel. Throw a foreign country in the middle, and it suddenly gets a whole lot harder.

This whole thing just reminds me of some 5 year old kid who doesn't get his way and decides he's going to run away from home.

This is EXACTLY what's going on. It's embarrassing.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

So someone I go to school with says that its up to about 25 states now, including California. Is this true? I haven't seen anything.

 

[Matt Mortem]

So someone I go to school with says that its up to about 25 states now, including California. Is this true? I haven't seen anything.

Last count I saw was 18

http://www.examiner.com/article/mul...ma-to-secede-from-union-start-own-governments

 

[Marvolo]

It doesnt matter how many states its up to. Its unconstitutional and it flies in the face of democracy. Obama won the election. He got more of the popular vote and he won the EC. They can vote for someone else in four years. They are just pissed that the old white bigots have lost control of this country.

 

[Hotwire]

And the award for, "Takes Facetious Post Too Seriously" goes to...

Obviously this isn't going to happen.

You'll have to forgive me seeing as facetiousness doesn't have it's own font.