Prometheus - Part 9

[Hammer!]

Um, we don't agree that it was disappointing.

You personally felt it was disappointing and are now attempting to thrust your own opinions into our faces under the guise that they're some kind of public consensus or fact.

Both of which, they are not.

Whatever lets just agree to disagree. Perhaps we've read different reviews, or the websites and people we surround ourselves with are different. The last couple posts made in this thread inspired me to post a poll that may shed some light on this matter...

 

[flickchick85]

I think CConn's point is that, regardless of what any group vote declares, it's still not some blanket fact that it's the most disappointing film of the summer, since there are plenty who were not disappointed by it. Everybody has their own expectations and disappointments.

 

[CConn]

I think CConn's point is that, regardless of what any group vote declares, it's still not some blanket fact that it's the most disappointing film of the summer, since there are plenty who were not disappointed by it. Everybody has their own expectations and disappointments.

Yup.

 

[Marvolo]

I enjoyed the movie. Stupid decisions, dumb scientists, questionable decisions and all. It had its flaws, but i was able to enjoy it

 

[DorkyFresh]

Personally, this film exceeded my expectations...which were already pretty high to begin with. I honestly don't know what people were expecting for them to be so disappointed by the movie. I'm not saying that it's a perfect film, far from it. It has plenty of inconsistencies and plot holes....but many people hyped themselves up too much after waiting so long for answers to the questions that spawned from 'Alien'.

I knew this film was connected to Alien, I knew that this film was going to answer SOME questions about the space jockey, and I knew Ridley Scott was directing it...but I also knew that this movie wasn't going to be as revolutionary or critically hailed as the original 'Alien' now is (it was originally received by mixed reviews) and I didn't really know WHAT to expect until I saw the trailers.

Now when I saw the trailers, I INSTANTLY loved what I saw. There wasn't a shot in any of the trailers that DIDN'T hold my attention. I was drawn to this movie in a way that I hadn't been in a long time.....and it's the only movie of this summer that I keep going back to in my head. Not because of the hype, not because it was disappointing.....but because it exceeded my expectations that were ALREADY high to begin with.

None of the other big tent pole films have grabbed me on the level that Prometheus did. Avengers - even though I thoroughly enjoyed that movie twice in theaters, I was slightly disappointed. Spider-Man - I loved this movie and it also exceeded my high expectations, but it's not as memorable as Prometheus. TDKR - I never was really excited about but it exceeded my expectations, primarily because of the last 10 minutes. Prometheus, however, hits me on a level that none of these can. It supplied me with 2 hours of fantastic visuals, suspense, horror, great acting, and thought-provoking themes.

Yes, while others have said that this movie is disappointing...I'm not sure what they were expecting. Again, it's not perfect, but I certainly could never bring myself to call it the most disappointing movie of the summer...since my expectations were already quite high and I was STILL blown away. Even if it IS voted as the most disappointing movie of the summer, I know that it's not a bad film by any means...and to me that only makes it the most CONTROVERSIAL film of the summer.

 

[Marvolo]

Prometheus asked questions and presented ideas that i like. The idea of earth being seeded, our gods being nothing more than malicious hyperevolved intelligent beings, questions about life, and so on. Yeah there were plot holes and the plot is a bit of a mess but what drew me to the movie was the ideas and questions it presented. That stuff was done right imo. The movie for me was more of a vehicle of things that ive been wanting to see on screen. Essentually i got what i wanted out of the movie the rest: the messy plot, dumb decisions, and plot holes didnt effect the things i was there to see. Take for instance the prometheus crew. I wasnt there to see them, nor was i there to care about them. I was there to see the engineers and the story connected to them and i feel the movie dealt with them and the plot pertaining to them well.

 

[DorkyFresh]

Prometheus asked questions and presented ideas that i like. The idea of earth being seeded, our gods being nothing more than malicious hyperevolved intelligent beings, questions about life, and so on. Yeah there were plot holes and the plot is a bit of a mess but what drew me to the movie was the ideas and questions it presented. That stuff was done right imo. The movie for me was more of a vehicle of things that ive been wanting to see on screen. Essentually i got what i wanted out of the movie the rest: the messy plot, dumb decisions, and plot holes didnt effect the things i was there to see. Take for instance the prometheus crew. I wasnt there to see them, nor was i there to care about them. I was there to see the engineers and the story connected to them and i feel the movie dealt with them and the plot pertaining to them well.

"Very nice, high five!"

 

[Marvolo]

"Very nice, high five!"

 

[CConn]

I'm starting to feel as though most truly great metaphysical films are rife with plotholes. Because the plot only serves as a background piece, instead serving the larger meaning rather than building upon itself.

It's like a dreamscape. Things don't make sense in dreams, because dreams don't exist to make sense, they exist to espouse messages hidden in methaphor and imagery and emotion. Once you start making films for that same purpose, plotting often becomes increasingly sparse and less throughly cultivated.

 

[Marvolo]

I'm starting to feel as though most truly great metaphysical films are rife with plotholes. Because the plot only serves as a background piece, instead serving the larger meaning rather than building upon itself.

It's like a dreamscape. Things don't make sense in dreams, because dreams don't exist to make sense, they exist to espouse messages hidden in methaphor and imagery and emotion. Once you start making films for that same purpose, plotting often becomes increasingly sparse and less throughly cultivated.

I see where your going with that, and i agree. Although many may not agree because plot is so readily disected snd scrutinized. Many metaphysical films ive seen have plot issues, holes, or are one demensional in aspects. The ideas presented seem to be the most important part of these films with everything else acting as a canvas on which to present the ideas. Its pretty clear that Ridley had some ideas he wanted to present and questions to ask and he did. He just didnt seem to really care about the plot which is fine because he did what he set out to do. He presented his ideas and asked his questions. Now he gets to answer those question in Paradise.

This film along with The Fountain and to an extent Sunshine hold a special place in my heart snd its for the ideas they present and questions they ask.

 

[CConn]

Personally, I think people in general are way too plot-obsessed. Like in the other thread, dude said TDKR is worse after multiple viewings. Why? I guarantee it's because he's still focused on dissecting and analyzing the plot. For me, however, I went into my subsequent viewings looking for the meaning and message behind the story, and I found it quite easily, which greatly enriched the film for me.

Plotting's fun, don't get me wrong. There's a lot of movies that suceed due to great plotting and story execution. But to me (and yeah, I know this is pretentious), plotting is simple. Base. One-dimensional. The best works of fiction are the ones that are a little bit crooked. That you might not even be able to grasp the first time, or even the second, due to how layered and multifaceted they are.

 

[Marvolo]

Personally, I think people in general are way too plot-obsessed. Like in the other thread, dude said TDKR is worse after multiple viewings. Why? I guarantee it's because he's still focused on dissecting and analyzing the plot. For me, however, I went into my subsequent viewings looking for the meaning and message behind the story, and I found it quite easily, which greatly enriched the film for me.

Plotting's fun, don't get me wrong. There's a lot of movies that suceed due to great plotting and story execution. But to me (and yeah, I know this is pretentious), plotting is simple. Base. One-dimensional. The best works of fiction are the ones that are a little bit crooked. That you might not even be able to grasp the first time, or even the second, due to how layered and multifaceted they are.

I feel very much the same way. I look for meaning, messages, ideas, characters and some other things. And then i look at how these things are presented and what the movie is trying to do with these aspects. What prometheus was trying to do it succeeded at. The plot doesnt seem to have ever been a major concern of Scott's. It was the ideas he was most concerned with. I see this aspect in other films Scott has done. Blade Runner is thin on plot and on first viewing i felt it was rather 'meh'. On repeat viewings however all the ideas and meaning started to come out and now i appreciate the film on a level i couldnt have imagined at first.

 

[CConn]

Yup, I was similarly unimpressed with the original Alien.

Then when I went back and really looked at what he did with it, what he was saying, it immediately became one of my favorite movies.

And in terms of sophistication of subtext, Prometheus far exceeds even what Alien did (although I still think Alien is a better movie, of course).

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Prometheus asked questions and presented ideas that i like. The idea of earth being seeded, our gods being nothing more than malicious hyperevolved intelligent beings, questions about life, and so on. Yeah there were plot holes and the plot is a bit of a mess but what drew me to the movie was the ideas and questions it presented. That stuff was done right imo. The movie for me was more of a vehicle of things that ive been wanting to see on screen. Essentually i got what i wanted out of the movie the rest: the messy plot, dumb decisions, and plot holes didnt effect the things i was there to see. Take for instance the prometheus crew. I wasnt there to see them, nor was i there to care about them. I was there to see the engineers and the story connected to them and i feel the movie dealt with them and the plot pertaining to them well.

What someone gets out of a film is a very personal thing and thus can only really be judged that person. Whether a film is a failure or not is purely up to them alone. My personal disconnect with the part in bold, comes with how small of a role that story plays in the film. The film is about the crew imo. It is about Shaw, Adam, Vickers, and others.

Yes there are big ideas, but they are presented in a similar manner to Blade Runner or Alien, through the emotional arc of the characters. This isn't a 2001 situation, where the characters feel like simply a vessel to explore these abstract ideas. They are the "heart" of the film. There is what I feel is a clear attempt by Scott to try to get the audience to empathize with the characters so that the crazy crap that happens to them and the self-sacrifice on display means something. It is at the heart of the film. All the big moments and emotional peaks are built around the crew and their reaction to this situation.

The film doesn't end with a resolution for the Engineers or their plans. It ends with Shaw finding her emotional resolve and reaffirming why she was out there in the first place. In many ways it mirror's the end of Blade Runner in that regard. The freeing of the soul and the bucking up to move beyond this messed up situation.

Thinking about it now, I think why I personally found this film to be disappointing is that it really doesn't feel new, and yet it isn't really polished from a storytelling perspective. One of my favorite films is Joe Wright's "Pride and Prejudice". The story has been told countless times, but the execution on all levels makes the film completely engaging for me. The material is presented in a fresh, vibrant manner.

For me, Prometheus in so many ways feels like a unremarkable retelling of Alien. It lacks the execution and really material to bring the film to life. It is a good idea, but it never quite gets past the good idea stage and eventually just falls back on the cornerstones of the genre without the heart or execution of the best.

It is like the leap between coming up with the idea for a time traveling robot assassin and the final product that is Terminator and T2. Yes there is potential, but it has to be executed for it to work properly.

 

[HopeOfTheFuture]

The film doesn't end with a resolution for the Engineers or their plans.

One of my main problems with the movie. The whole movie they are trying to find answers, and in the end they aren't given any anwers. Feels like the point of the movie itself failed.

 

[dark_b]

I probably could've given a 2,000 word dissertation on its subtext and underlying messages.

is this meant to be an insult to people who didnt like it because they didnt get it? t:

 

[dark_b]

I feel very much the same way. I look for meaning, messages, ideas, characters and some other things. And then i look at how these things are presented and what the movie is trying to do with these aspects. What prometheus was trying to do it succeeded at. The plot doesnt seem to have ever been a major concern of Scott's. It was the ideas he was most concerned with. I see this aspect in other films Scott has done. Blade Runner is thin on plot and on first viewing i felt it was rather 'meh'. On repeat viewings however all the ideas and meaning started to come out and now i appreciate the film on a level i couldnt have imagined at first.

presenting an idea and asking questions and then .......not exploring them is to me a bad movie.

did i have a 4 hour debate about the meaning of live after the movie was over? yes i did. so the movie made me think? because of the qustion asked in the movie the debate started. so in 4 hours only the first 5 minutes were devoted to Prometheus. but the writter director put the question there so Scott and Lindelof made me and my friends think. and not Prometheus. i watched in my live a lot documentaries about aliens on earth and about the meaning of life. i already know about those deep questions. i payed money for the ticket so that an artist uses movies to explore those qustions through a story and plot that they come up with.a scifi movie.

my english is bad so its hard to explain. so lets make it easier. Prometheus fails as a movie but succeeds in making people think about life. so what?

if you enjoy watching 2 hour expensive 3d movies so that you come out asking yourself what is the meaning of life. good for you. i am paying the ticket for the movie and not for something that i could watch here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUHk9FLZMf4&feature=related

 

[regwec]

I found the film disappointing, while still liking it, but I think that was caused by the film's provenance rather than any hype surrounding it.

"Alien" is one of my favourite movies so Prometheus, as the succeeding sci fi film directed by Ridley, had to achieve much in order to match my expectations. It didn't, but it was still more interesting than 99% of movies made in recent years.

 

[chamber-music]

I've got a question for those disappionted just out of curiosity

Do you think that any of the deleted scenes might improve you opinion of the film depending on what they contain?

 

[Lord]

Just like i said when this thread was in Part 2 or so after the the movie was released at first i liked it but found it disconected, then after thinking more i began to dislike it, until i stoped trying to find answers in the film and began to think for myself how there are some simple explanations if only you think a bit more about it.

Here's one of my posts:

The movie wanted to explain what the space jockey actually was, it was explained.

That entire galaxy was probably a military instalation for the space jockeys, so when the project started to go wrong they left it, more must have gone wrong too.

Here's my guess.

In the planet that appeared in Alien they probably developed the Xenomorphs as we know them from the alien films, while other planets like the one in Prometheus were working with the same DNA, that's why they got similar but different results.

So it's probable that they also had problems in the planet from Alien, and why that planet became infested with Xenomorphs, i also believe that after these problems the engineers abandoned that galaxy, but left their military experiments behind as it was too risky to take them.

Does Ridley have to show everything? Do humans have to allways be there when something happens? Hell no!

Imagine now, somebody that didn't see any Alien film, watches Prometheus first and then sees Alien, considering the planet they guess that it's a different planet that also has a Space Jockey military instalation.

Marvolo is right, the Prometheus movies are supposed to be about the space jockeys, it has some pleasant references to the Alien franchise but that's it, Ridley said himself that his main inspiration to go back to the franchise was to explore the space jockeys.

I also like the timing in which the movie takes place, 30-40 years before Alien, which makes such things as Weyland to merge with Yutani, and the companny to be interested in exploring that sector realistically.

 

[spidey-dude]

It remains - and probably will stay that way for the whole year - the ONLY film I have seen in the cinema twice this year (although I did want to see Avengers on the big screen again, but life got in the way of that), I was a tad disappointed the first time but enjoyed it alot more the second time. I can't wait for the blu-ray (and I buy very few blu rays, I try and reserve them for MUST HAVE films)

I still thnk that they should have had it be the same planet from Alien though - it wouldn't have been hard to make them match up really...

 

[Lord]

It remains - and probably will stay that way for the whole year - the ONLY film I have seen in the cinema twice this year (although I did want to see Avengers on the big screen again, but life got in the way of that), I was a tad disappointed the first time but enjoyed it alot more the second time. I can't wait for the blu-ray (and I buy very few blu rays, I try and reserve them for MUST HAVE films)

I still thnk that they should have had it be the same planet from Alien though - it wouldn't have been hard to make them match up really...

I think that if they did that some things like the xenomorph would have had to be different, and Weyland's daughter would have had to live, which would make sence to why 30 years later she sends another team there.

 

[dark_b]

I've got a question for those disappionted just out of curiosity

Do you think that any of the deleted scenes might improve you opinion of the film depending on what they contain?

a trick question for finding out if we were disappointed because the movie didnt give us answers? since the DS give answers .

good one t:

 

[spidey-dude]

I think that if they did that some things like the xenomorph would have had to be different, and Weyland's daughter would have had to live, which would make sence to why 30 years later she sends another team there.

I don't think she would need to live, the company could send a team there 30 years later to try and figure out why noone from prometheus had returned....

As for the Xeno, I think all they needed was for it to be the queen and for it to chest burst while he was in the driving seat... it would explain all the eggs in Alien

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Personally speaking, I found this film to be amazing, and as someone else said, I have loved many movies this year, but non of them got into my head as much as Prometheus did, I was thinking about it for weeks afterwards, and still even now it pops into my head every now and again.

I loved the movie and was riveted both times I saw it, and cant wait to own it on BD, and even more so to see the sequel.