Civil War Sharon carter A.K.A. Agent 13 - Part 1

[DanielFM]

Yea, and Barton relies on a bow yet still isn't dead

A bow that allows him to shot explosive arrows, frag arrows, neural-disrupting arrows and all kinds of trick shots.
The versatility of the weapon together with his flawless aim with it elevates him above what an agent with a bog standard pistol can contribute.

 

[Majik1387]

It's still a bow.

 

[TeeKay]

*Reads last few pages*

 

[Mike5575]

Nothing implies Sharon is better with a pistol than BW (a regular user and extensively trained) or even Maria Hill.
And being good with a pistol doesn't sound like a very valuable skillset in the world of MCU, to be fair.

It's a wild stretch of the imagination to see Black Widow bringing anything to a fight when she's surrounded by such giants as Thor, Hulk, and Iron Man, but somehow the writers make her come off as not being entirely useless. It's not that much more of a stretch to believe Sharon Carter isn't useless. Any difference in skill set between the characters are negligible at best.

 

[Voltron]

Exactly, it's up to M&M, Feige, and Russos to determine her capabilities, either way most Stucky, Stony, Steggy, and Romangers shippers will still bag on her and will find any flimsy excuse to hate on her

 

[Stevie2020]

Exactly, it's up to M&M, Feige, and Russos to determine her capabilities, either way most Stucky, Stony, Steggy, and Romangers shippers will still bag on her and will find any flimsy excuse to hate on her

Don't leave out Wilrogers.

 

[Voltron]

I forgot about Staria and Stury, and Stredwing, and Stawkeye, and Stevision, and Standa, and Stuicksilver, and, Stack Panther, and Stultron, and Sthor, Stoki, and Stappy, and Stepper, and Stierce, etc. t:

 

[Rote]

You can make terrible excuses, that it's all about shippers, because it's very convenient for you, but the fact is (whether you want to admit it or not), there have always been tons of shippers, but only Staron is getting THIS level of hate. Because the main reason are not the ships, but what Staron represents. If anything, for Steggy shippers it's the best option, because (as they'll never be together) it means, that Steve loves Peggy SO MUCH, that have found the closest second rate replacement. But this makes Cap's character to be the complete idiot in love, who can't let go. Hell, even Hayley Atwell understands this and disaproves Staron and has stated this so many times. Only comic-book fanboys are blind so much, that can't see this huge flaw in comics, it's easier for them to shift the blame on shippers, be hypocrites and make different excuses.

 

[DanielFM]

I ship all of those before Steve x the most boring character in the MCU t:
Oh, don't forget Stum-dum-dugan t:

I'm sorry, but in my case it has nothing to do with being a shipper of any couple.
I think if they try to make Sharon a Black Widow 2 (which she isn't) they would dilute both characters and do BW a disservice. And if Sharon is not at BW level of skill, she will be useless in any real fight (not in other tasks, I have already admitted).

 

[Xeno]

In stripper clubs yes, but in hired ones for bdays or bachelor parties no. I went to a bday one ages ago and the stripper was wearing something like a super tight red catsuit that zips up from the front with her cleavage hanging out since that was what the bday boy wanted or requested. Look at the white Sharon suit again, boobs can fall out easily in a fight since it looks like she's not wearing a super supportive bra if this was irl. I've seen a couple of friends with smaller boobs in more supportive bikinis fall out.

Also that Captain Marvel pic excluding the high boots looks like what gymnasts would wear.

Apparently it's ok to hate Sharon around here as long as it's not Scarjo-Black Widow.

I just said that the white suit screams stripper with the way it's designed all tight, and all cleavage.

Are you male or female? I'm only asking because you have some really strange ideas about the things breasts do inside womens' garments. And whether or not you and loki are male or female, you are both sl*t-shaming female characters based solely on their clothes. Apparenty, any female showing cleavage is dressed like a stripper and in danger of exposing her breasts with any sudden movement. And, illogically, you claim that a character whose costume exposes acres of skin is somehow dressed practically.

(For the record, Ms. Marvel isn't bad but her costume sure was.)

Far be it from me to try changing your minds. Once people have embraced such pernicious ideas there's just no hope.

 

[Voltron]

Are you male or female? I'm only asking because you have some really strange ideas about the things breasts do inside womens' garments. And whether or not you and loki are male or female, you are both sl*t-shaming female characters based solely on their clothes. Apparenty, any female showing cleavage is dressed like a stripper and in danger of exposing her breasts with any sudden movement. And, illogically, you claim that a character whose costume exposes acres of skin is somehow dressed practically.

(For the record, Ms. Marvel isn't bad but her costume sure was.)

Far be it from me to try changing your minds. Once people have embraced such pernicious ideas there's just no hope.

Whoa, take a step back from false accusations, did you read my comments correctly? Where did I sl#t-shame female characters? Where's your proof? My opinion was only that I didn't like Sharon's comic white tight suit with the cold shoulders and low zipped with cleavage, (and it's not practical when you fight in combat) since it looks and screams stripper, not Sharon, but the outfit, the outfit is stripper. You've taken things out of context. Also there's nothing wrong with being a stripper, they provide entertainment.

And Captain Marvel's outfit is what gymnasts wear since it's covered at the front.

Where did I state, "any female showing cleavage is dressed like a stripper"?

 

[Voltron]

You can make terrible excuses, that it's all about shippers, because it's very convenient for you, but the fact is (whether you want to admit it or not), there have always been tons of shippers, but only Staron is getting THIS level of hate. Because the main reason are not the ships, but what Staron represents. If anything, for Steggy shippers it's the best option, because (as they'll never be together) it means, that Steve loves Peggy SO MUCH, that have found the closest second rate replacement. But this makes Cap's character to be the complete idiot in love, who can't let go. Hell, even Hayley Atwell understands this and disaproves Staron and has stated this so many times. Only comic-book fanboys are blind so much, that can't see this huge flaw in comics, it's easier for them to shift the blame on shippers, be hypocrites and make different excuses.

 

[BoredGuy]

in the comics Steve and Peggy were barely a thing, so imo "Staron" >>>> "Steggy"

and I find it funny people keep saying sharon's "the most boring character in the MCU" when we've heard all of, what, two lines from her..? On that basis, I'd have to say Helicarrier SHIELD agent #4 was wayyyy more boring. I mean, did you see the way that guy just stood there?? the f**k man??

 

[Xeno]

in the comics Steve and Peggy were barely a thing, so imo "Staron" >>>> "Steggy"

and I find it funny people keep saying sharon's "the most boring character in the MCU" when we've heard all of, what, two lines from her..? On that basis, I'd have to say Helicarrier SHIELD agent #4 was wayyyy more boring. I mean, did you see the way that guy just stood there?? the f**k man??

In the comics, Tony & Pepper were barely a thing, but in the MCU Pepperony have the only long-term romance. Steve and Peggy have a far more significant romance than they did in the comics, as we've seen in the films and the Agent Carter series.

Relationships in the MCU are often quite different from the comics universe. But then, you know that.

Also, Sharon had an entire conversation with Steve, which was definitely more than "two lines." She had zero chemistry with the Captain, however, and would have been forgettable if not for her belated response to Fury's shooting. It's understandable that you wouldn't remember that, seeing as she's such a boring character. t:

 

[MadVillainy]

I mean she's in the movie. I assume she's going to have a significant role, being in the promo art.
She's most likely be a romantic interest for Steve.

People need to get with it. It's happening

I really dont understand why people are complaining about it still >.I mean I know how things get in our fanboy forums so I dont know why Im surprised.

 

[Ms. Marvel]

In the comics, Tony & Pepper were barely a thing, but in the MCU Pepperony have the only long-term romance. Steve and Peggy have a far more significant romance than they did in the comics, as we've seen in the films and the Agent Carter series.

Relationships in the MCU are often quite different from the comics universe. But then, you know that.

Also, Sharon had an entire conversation with Steve, which was definitely more than "two lines." She had zero chemistry with the Captain, however, and would have been forgettable if not for her belated response to Fury's shooting. It's understandable that you wouldn't remember that, seeing as she's such a boring character. t:

I think that's overstating it a bit. They talked about washing machines, he asked her out (all while she was pretending to be somebody she wasn't) and then she came in when Nick got shot at which point the characters had bigger things to deal with.

 

[Voltron]

Are you male or female? I'm only asking because you have some really strange ideas about the things breasts do inside womens' garments. And whether or not you and loki are male or female, you are both sl*t-shaming female characters based solely on their clothes. Apparenty, any female showing cleavage is dressed like a stripper and in danger of exposing her breasts with any sudden movement. And, illogically, you claim that a character whose costume exposes acres of skin is somehow dressed practically.

(For the record, Ms. Marvel isn't bad but her costume sure was.)

Far be it from me to try changing your minds. Once people have embraced such pernicious ideas there's just no hope.

Whoa, take a step back from false accusations, did you read my comments correctly? Where did I sl#t-shame female characters? Where's your proof? My opinion was only that I didn't like Sharon's comic white tight suit with the cold shoulders and low zipped with cleavage, (and it's not practical when you fight in combat) since it looks and screams stripper, not Sharon, but the outfit, the outfit is stripper. You've taken things out of context. Also there's nothing wrong with being a stripper, they provide entertainment.

And Captain Marvel's outfit is what gymnasts wear since it's covered at the front.

Where did I state, "any female showing cleavage is dressed like a stripper"?

No answers? You know what's pernicious, making false accusations.

 

[Xeno]

I think that's overstating it a bit. They talked about washing machines, he asked her out (all while she was pretending to be somebody she wasn't) and then she came in when Nick got shot at which point the characters had bigger things to deal with.

That conversation was Steve & Sharon's "meet-cute" moment. It was meant to demonstrate the chemistry between two characters who have a relationship in the comic book universe. The fact that there wasn't the slightest spark between them was a failure of casting, scripting or both.

Steve's first meeting with Sam Wilson was a stark contrast to that Staron moment. Leaving aside Steve's friendly taunts as he passed Sam, when they talked one could totally buy their instant rapport. The audience could see Steve & Sam quickly becoming friends as a natural development. That scene shows how great casting and writing combine to create believable relationships in a few swift strokes.

 

[Stevie2020]

That conversation was Steve & Sharon's "meet-cute" moment. It was meant to demonstrate the chemistry between two characters who have a relationship in the comic book universe. The fact that there wasn't the slightest spark between them was a failure of casting, scripting or both.

Steve's first meeting with Sam Wilson was a stark contrast to that Staron moment. Leaving aside Steve's friendly taunts as he passed Sam, when they talked one could totally buy their instant rapport. The audience could see Steve & Sam quickly becoming friends as a natural development. That scene shows how great casting and writing combine to create believable relationships in a few swift strokes.

Sam and Steve was the actual "meet cute" moment. The were actually meeting for the first time where Steve and "Kate" were obviously acquainted with one another as neighbors.

I know; "Captain Obvious".

 

[Rote]

I mean she's in the movie. I assume she's going to have a significant role, being in the promo art.
She's most likely be a romantic interest for Steve.

Significant role? How much significant? You can't assume this just because of her presence in the promo art, which shows everyone from the cast apart from two villains, two politicians and Wanda for the reason unknown. There won't be enough time to develop her character and her relationships, she's there only for romantic plot. Because that's who she is - nothing but a love interest for Steve. And Evans said, that key members of his team are Sam and Bucky. We already know, that Steve's main emotional arc here will be about Bucky. Hell, she's not even the first female lead, it's Widow instead, assuming her time on set.

 

[Loki882]

Are you male or female? I'm only asking because you have some really strange ideas about the things breasts do inside womens' garments. And whether or not you and loki are male or female, you are both sl*t-shaming female characters based solely on their clothes. Apparenty, any female showing cleavage is dressed like a stripper and in danger of exposing her breasts with any sudden movement. And, illogically, you claim that a character whose costume exposes acres of skin is somehow dressed practically.

(For the record, Ms. Marvel isn't bad but her costume sure was.)

Far be it from me to try changing your minds. Once people have embraced such pernicious ideas there's just no hope.

And whether or not you and loki are male or female, you are both sl*t-shaming female characters based solely on their clothes.

BULLCRAP!! Don't you DARE try and pull that. I have NEVER ****-shamed anyone in my life. I'm a very live and let live type of person. What I was complaining about was the look of her UNIFORM!! If she goes to the pool and wears a bikini, fine. If she goes to party and wears a nice dress, sure. If she sleeps with a guy because she wants to, got no problem with that either, and so on.

BUT, when it's her official costume that she fights evil in, an we're supposed to take her seriously as a badass, that's another matter entirely. Why is the zipper pulled down that far? What possible purpose does that serve in a professional or even combat scenario? The answer is, it doesn't. It's just there for sex appeal, nothing more. And the ratio of male vs. female characters that this happens to is overwhelming skewed to one side, so the double-standard is all the more obvious. As for the shoulder cutouts, I just think they look dumb, nothing more or less than that.

That's the distinction. I'm really sick and tired of people misrepresenting what people who disagree with them are saying in an attempt to try and insinuate that there's something "wrong" with said, or dodge the issue at hand. If you have to do that, then you never had much of an argument to begin with.

 

[Loki882]

Hercules.
Namor.
Colossus in his short shorts.
Logan walked around shirtless for a number of years in the early 2000's.

and you can say it's different because she's a "non-powered field agent" as opposed to guys who absorb damage
but if you so badly need realism, and can't excuse these as superhero outfits, then she should wear this:

Spoiler

full body armor is getting so damn boring, just from a design standpoint alone. I'm all for getting rid of ridiculously skimpy outfits like Ms Marvel up there, but not at the expense of variety (nor do I think cleavage is some horrible, evil thing that must be purged).

Congratulations, you've named like 4. And there are MANY more female characters who wear those kinds of outfits. The ratio is overwhelming to one side. Oh and Logan's most iconic costumes all cover him up, and both Colossus and Namor have been wearing pants for years now btw. And it's funny how all the MALE characters are the ones who get armor, but the female ones get the cleavage costumes, hmm.

I'm for variety as well, but the costume should fit the character. Sharon is a professional non-powered SHIELD agent. So yes, given those facts her costume should be a bit more practical. And I don't mind cleavage either, but not in a mission/combat situation. Oh and I'd complain if say, Cap was fighting evil in ass-less chaps as well. It may work in other situations, but not in their "superhero" ones.

THAT'S the distinction. Which people either don't get, or just choose to ignore.

 

[BullMcGiveny]

That conversation was Steve & Sharon's "meet-cute" moment. It was meant to demonstrate the chemistry between two characters who have a relationship in the comic book universe. The fact that there wasn't the slightest spark between them was a failure of casting, scripting or both.

Steve's first meeting with Sam Wilson was a stark contrast to that Staron moment. Leaving aside Steve's friendly taunts as he passed Sam, when they talked one could totally buy their instant rapport. The audience could see Steve & Sam quickly becoming friends as a natural development. That scene shows how great casting and writing combine to create believable relationships in a few swift strokes.

You're right, it was an issue of scripting. Steve and "Kate" had a generic conversation about coffee, Steve and Sam bonded over shared experience as combat vets.

 

[Voltron]

Significant role? How much significant? You can't assume this just because of her presence in the promo art, which shows everyone from the cast apart from two villains, two politicians and Wanda for the reason unknown. There won't be enough time to develop her character and her relationships, she's there only for romantic plot. Because that's who she is - nothing but a love interest for Steve. And Evans said, that key members of his team are Sam and Bucky. We already know, that Steve's main emotional arc here will be about Bucky. Hell, she's not even the first female lead, it's Widow instead, assuming her time on set.

Like how Peggy was a love interest in TFA?

"Because that's who she is - nothing but a love interest for Steve"? Sounds like you've read the CW script then.

 

[Voltron]

And whether or not you and loki are male or female, you are both sl*t-shaming female characters based solely on their clothes.

BULLCRAP!! Don't you DARE try and pull that. I have NEVER ****-shamed anyone in my life. I'm a very live and let live type of person. What I was complaining about was the look of her UNIFORM!! If she goes to the pool and wears a bikini, fine. If she goes to party and wears a nice dress, sure. If she sleeps with a guy because she wants to, got no problem with that either, and so on.

BUT, when it's her official costume that she fights evil in, an we're supposed to take her seriously as a badass, that's another matter entirely. Why is the zipper pulled down that far? What possible purpose does that serve in a professional or even combat scenario? The answer is, it doesn't. It's just there for sex appeal, nothing more. And the ratio of male vs. female characters that this happens to is overwhelming skewed to one side, so the double-standard is all the more obvious. As for the shoulder cutouts, I just think they look dumb, nothing more or less than that.

That's the distinction. I'm really sick and tired of people misrepresenting what people who disagree with them are saying in an attempt to try and insinuate that there's something "wrong" with said, or dodge the issue at hand. If you have to do that, then you never had much of an argument to begin with.

Nicely said. And I don't think I'll get any answers to my questions.