Discussion in 'The Dark Knight' started by Diemtay, Jun 24, 2011.
If not, who is?
I voted that he's tied along side Darth Vader.
He is my favorite film villain!
I don't know about the best film villain, but definitely the best comic book film villain.
One of the best, yes. But there are so many others that are up there.
THE best? oh god no, he was just perfect for THIS type of Batman
He may not even be the best Joker.
I wouldn't say best, no way. He was great but cinema is full of amazing villians.
there isnt a best Joker when its only been done twice lol
You do realize that between two nouns, there can indeed be a "best"? Right?
He's one of the best. Cinema is full of amazing and memorable villains and I think Heath's Joker is definitely up there with them.
I'd like to hear some examples of film villains people think are better. Just curious.
Someone said Darth Vader, who is a pretty tough icon to beat. I'm hoping to hear a few names in particular.
Here's AFI's Top 20
Dr. Hannibal Lecter (Anthony Hopkins) in The Silence of the Lambs (1991)
Norman Bates (Anthony Perkins) in Psycho (1960)
Darth Vader (David Prowse/James Earl Jones) in The Empire Strikes Back (1980)
The Wicked Witch of the West (Margaret Hamilton) in The Wizard of Oz (1939)
Nurse Ratched (Louise Fletcher) in One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest (1975)
Mr. Potter (Lionel Barrymore) in It's A Wonderful Life (1946)
Alex Forrest (Glenn Close) in Fatal Attraction (1987)
Phyllis Dietrichson (Barbara Stanwyck) in Double Indemnity (1944)
Regan MacNeil (Satan) (Linda Blair) in The Exorcist (1973)
The Queen (voice of Lucille LaVerne) in Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs (1937)
Michael Corleone (Al Pacino) in The Godfather, Part II (1974)
Alex DeLarge (Malcolm McDowell) in A Clockwork Orange (1971)
HAL 9000 (voice of Douglas Rain) in 2001: A Space Odyssey (1968)
The Alien (Bolaji Badejo) in Alien (1979)
Amon Goeth (Ralph Fiennes) in Schindler's List (1993)
Noah Cross (John Huston) in Chinatown (1974)
Annie Wilkes (Kathy Bates) in Misery (1990)
The Shark in Jaws (1975)
Captain Bligh (Charles Laughton) in Mutiny on the Bounty (1935)
Man in Bambi (1942)
I would say he is up there, but I don't know if you can say he was the best ever. When I think of iconic film villains I think of Joker(from both films), Vader, and Hannibal.
Definitely not the best of them all, that's just ridiculous and a little insulting. I'd say a few of the best are
Gozer the Gozerian
Pennywise the Clown
and many more. Heath may be one of them, but he's definitely not the best or most iconic unless you only watch Nolan films
The Joker is far and away better than all of those listed. On a mental and visual level. He's a truly dynamic character. Darth Vader and Hannibal Lecter are the only others that come close. To put Chucky and Le Chiffre and Gozer on the same list is insane.
Dude he isn't the best villain of all cinematic time. You probably didn't pay attention to Heaths work until TDK, which is ****ing pathetic when it comes down to how the villain affects the story. Ghostbusters was a huge success if you actually knew about it, Stay Puft Gozer was incredibly funny and creative so don't bash something you couldn't explain because you've had your eyes glued to ONE RECENT performance.
Gozer is like...a throwaway character with little screen time...they needed to give a face to a main villain. No one in the general public thinks about or remembers the villains of Ghostbusters except Slimer and the iconic Stay Puft. Don't be blinded as a Ghostbusters fan. I love Ghostbusters. One of my favorite franchises. I'd venture to say that Peter Venkman is one of my favorite protagonists in a film ever. But I don't think Gozer is even elligble for the hierarcy of film villains. And trust me I know Ghostbusters. Real Ghostbusters. Extreme Ghostbusters. Ghostbusters 2. etc. So I'm with you as a fan, but I refuse to acknowledge Gozer as even action figure worthy let alone list worthy. There have been some good villains in the animated canon of GB though, such as Sam Hain and The Boogeyman.
And no no I did pay attention to Heath's work. Brokeback. Dogtown. The Patriot. He's been great in all of his films, shame he never made it to Tree of Life. Would have been interesting to see him in place of the Brad Pitt character. So not only a good Joker, but also a good actor in general. I realize when something is overwhelmingly popular (as the Joker was) there will always be some naysayers and people that find the success transparent, etc etc. but I personally think (and again this thread and others are just matters of opinion not worth getting angry over) that Heath's Joker is a great character.
And I love Jack's Joker too so it's not like I'm just going to gush over Ledger. It's a hard call over which of them is "better." Like comparing apples and oranges. But the character of Ledger's Joker resonated with me more than any other villain on screen that I've seen so yes is what I voted for. And you should also know that I'm a HUGE skeptic of the Nolan franchise. I liked nothing about it UNTIL Heath's Joker and he remains the only thing I like about it.
Now some other villains that I think are definitly up there with Joker, Vader, Hannibal are:
The T-1000 (terminator 2)
Amon Goeth-Schindler's List
Hans Gruber (Die Hard)
Anton Chighur (No Country for Old men)
Scar (The Lion King)
Hans Landa (inglorious Basterds)
....Stay Puft was Gozer....
joker is no where near the level of darth vader and hannible lecter.
I actually prefer hans gruber to joker as well.
I will say though that ledger's joker is top 5.
I'll get you my pretty, and your little dog too!
Alfred Molina's Doc Ock is more iconic than the likes of Gozer and LeChiffre. If you're going to list Bond villains then list the likes of Blofeld, Goldfinger, Oddjob and Jaws.
What kind of silly logic is this? You wouldn't know about half of the villains on your list, especially the likes of Gozer or LeChirffe, unless you've seen the movies they're in. Heath's Joker is already being parodied in other stuff.
The Office, for example:
He's tied with Norman Bates and Anton Chigurh.
You would rank Le Chiffre over The Joker? All he did was whip Bond's balls back and forth.
Well done. Now throw them into a cage and throw away the key. And never ever untie them again!
So hard to pick best villain. Is it someone you hate on screen? Most fearsome? John Doe in Se7en was great, but had little screen time (although his presence was felt throughout). I'd have to say Norman Bates was probably the most well done villain on screen with hannibal being a close second. Vader has to be the most well known fantasy villains. Really hard to beat those three. I actually felt that heath's joker was lifted a bit from characters I'd seen before....so...no I wouldnt' rate him as the best villain of all time, but probably one of the best done Batman villains i've seen...Catwoman was done exceedingly well though too.