Comics The '07 X-Event: Endangered Species, Messiah Complex, & Disassembled

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

Especially considering how, since they started popping up, mutants have caused more death and destruction than anything else...

Kinda ironic, really. Not as bad as Claremont made it to be in The End whatever, but still...

I mean, we never actually see how mutants are supposed to be helping the human race advance. They're too busy killing each other.

Well, to be fair, Whedon *did* address this "OMG, how the f**k could they miss it that bad" issue.

 

[AndThePickles]

What'd everyone think of the one shot? I thought it was an interesting start. Really enjoyed the interactions between characters from different books.

I thought it was rather disappointing Nothing really happened.

 

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

Carey himself warned us, actually.

 

[El Bastardo]

What'd everyone think of the one shot? I thought it was an interesting start. Really enjoyed the interactions between characters from different books.

I thought it was written pretty darn well.

No. Not a lot happened. It was a centralized event based around a funeral and nothing more than, say, half a day. There was no huge battle, no balls-to-the-wall action, because there wasn't supposed to be.

Oh no! Nobody smashed the funeral!

You know, I know I'm going to take flak for saying this, but I think Carey gets the voices right for a whole slieu of characters. Iceman and Cannonball, sure - "but he writes them monthly!" you say. I liked how he wrote Bishop, I liked how he wrote Cyclops, and Wolverine, Emma, Bishop, even Madrox - and Xavier, and [BLACKOUT]Shaw, which was such a nice surprise[/BLACKOUT].

I'm not going to quote stuff, but to answer the argument that the X-Men worrying about there being no more mutants goes against the morality they've always preached - well, I suppose if we wanted to keep the same status quo and keep everyone static, we wouldn't need to change anything. They did something with M-Day way back when, and I don't care what the plans were back then. They've made a decision, and the take is a pretty understandable one - yeah, the X-Men always preached a certain something, and when faced with "incontrovertable extinction" they've changed. To draw a fictional analogy, look at the movie Children of Men, and how the world acted when no more babies were being born. Drastic measures?

Or would it be all preferable for the X-Men to say: "Oh, no more mutants are being born? Well, whatever! Guess it wasn't meant to be! Let's just, uh, hang out, and hey, if we all die out, well, whatever."

I don't see what's wrong.

Oh, and on another note: What [BLACKOUT]Sebastian Shaw[/BLACKOUT] said to Xavier was freakin' pwnage. And what Emma said early in the issue was rad, too.

 

[iamlegend]

Or would it be all preferable for the X-Men to say: "Oh, no more mutants are being born? Well, whatever! Guess it wasn't meant to be! Let's just, uh, hang out, and hey, if we all die out, well, whatever."

I don't see what's wrong.

But who is we? For years the X-Men have struggled for acceptance under the argument that they're just humans too.

It's not like there aren't going to be anymore people if no more mutants are born. There will still be plenty of people that are alive and well. The same number, in fact, that there would be if no more mutants were born, because mutants aren't a race in themselves, they're a group of PEOPLE.

So what if there are no more mutants being born? That means there'll be no more people born with an inability to have physical contact, no more (or fewer, anyway) people with the power to blow up the world with a thought.

I mean, mutants are people with powers/curses. Look at it this way... Say starting tomorrow there would be no more people on Earth born with blonde hair. None. It just stops happening. In the end, it doesn't really matter in the whole scheme of things.

I just don't understand the dilemma.

 

[OutcryX]

um. Thats like saying there wont be anymore White people being born, or black, or any ethnicity, but so what?...cuz in the long run they are just people that look different, but people as a whole will still be here...that is a flawed and dangerous viewpoint

Mutants are here and they have a right to exist. they state that they are regular people with powers...just like gays are regular people that like the same sex...they still deserve to exist. wiping them out is genocide and mutants have every right to fight for their existence and demand social acceptance and justice for being who they are.

they want EQUALITY...NOT to be the same as everyone else. I have seen you state this several times and each time it is just as wrong.

Nazi's figured that the supreme race should be blonde with blue hair and went about eradicating Jews and if left unchecked they would have succeeded then moved on to other ethnicities...but hey, as long as people are still being born, who cares if there aren't any more jews?

mutants are a subcategory of the human race, if not the future of the human race. just like different ethnicities are called 'races' but all classify under the Human race, mutants are a race as well and they deserve to find a way to carry on their survival

 

[El Bastardo]

But you disregarded other parts of my post.

Yes, they've wanted humans to accept them. They've wanted humans to not fear them. Fine, they've wanted to be seen as fellow humans, as a fellow sub-group of humans.

And now that sub-group of humans is on the verge of extinction.

You can't say it's akin to the blond gene being eradicated, because it's not quite the same. More accurately, you'd have to gear it toward another ethnicity - all of a sudden, for whatever reason, whites, or blacks, or asians, or whatever would suddenly be able to not reproduce, and would be dying out. Better yet, set it to a certain country - Americans are no longer able to reproduce, Canadians aren't, Mexicans aren't, Russians aren't, Japanese aren't. If you think you'd see no outburst, no sudden changes in mentality, no panicking, you're deluding yourself.

What the X-Men have said doesn't matter. They're mutants. They are, as Magneto has said, homo sapiens superior. They're the next level of evolution, supposedly. If they want to consider themselves the same as humans, that's fine. But when disaster strikes and they realize it, shouldn't they have to come to terms that they -aren't- just humans, and that "no more mutants" really does mean "no more mutants?"

It's no longer about perception. It's about realization and rationalization.

Gee, I thought a lot of the words in the one-shot kinda pointed that out. Maybe they just made too much sense to me.

Edit: And I posted this before getting to read Outcry's edited message. <3 you.

 

[UraniaChang]

um. Thats like saying there wont be anymore White people being born, or black, or any ethnicity, but so what?...cuz in the long run they are just people that look different, but people as a whole will still be here...that is a flawed and dangerous viewpoint

Mutants are here and they have a right to exist. they state that they are regular people with powers...just like gays are regular people that like the same sex...they still deserve to exist. wiping them out is genocide and mutants have every right to fight for their existence and demand social acceptance and justice for being who they are.

they want EQUALITY...NOT to be the same as everyone else. I have seen you state this several times and each time it is just as wrong.

Nazi's figured that the supreme race should be blonde with blue hair and went about eradicating Jews and if left unchecked they would have succeeded then moved on to other ethnicities...but hey, as long as people are still being born, who cares if there aren't any more jews?

mutants are a subcategory of the human race, if not the future of the human race. just like different ethnicities are called 'races' but all classify under the Human race, mutants are a race as well and they deserve to find a way to carry on their survival

100% agreed.

 

[OutcryX]

But you disregarded other parts of my post.

Yes, they've wanted humans to accept them. They've wanted humans to not fear them. Fine, they've wanted to be seen as fellow humans, as a fellow sub-group of humans.

And now that sub-group of humans is on the verge of extinction.

You can't say it's akin to the blond gene being eradicated, because it's not quite the same. More accurately, you'd have to gear it toward another ethnicity - all of a sudden, for whatever reason, whites, or blacks, or asians, or whatever would suddenly be able to not reproduce, and would be dying out. Better yet, set it to a certain country - Americans are no longer able to reproduce, Canadians aren't, Mexicans aren't, Russians aren't, Japanese aren't. If you think you'd see no outburst, no sudden changes in mentality, no panicking, you're deluding yourself.

What the X-Men have said doesn't matter. They're mutants. They are, as Magneto has said, homo sapiens superior. They're the next level of evolution, supposedly. If they want to consider themselves the same as humans, that's fine. But when disaster strikes and they realize it, shouldn't they have to come to terms that they -aren't- just humans, and that "no more mutants" really does mean "no more mutants?"

It's no longer about perception. It's about realization and rationalization.

Gee, I thought a lot of the words in the one-shot kinda pointed that out. Maybe they just made too much sense to me.

Edit: And I posted this before getting to read Outcry's edited message. <3 you.

to be honest. and i am a bit rusty, but i collected die hard throughout the late 80s and 90s..the X-Men have ALWAYS been proud of their mutations and never have wanted to be 'just humans'. they are proud to be who they are. they want acceptance and equality. and from what I've seen the X-Men and mutants in general have been in a state of shock and panic ever since House of M. first they had to come to the realization that 98% of mutants had been wiped from the face of the earth, secondly they had to go on living and surviving and fighting and demanding the same treatment that they always have demanded and thirdly they later realized that they wouldn't be reproducing and have started to panic. they are now fighting not only for their personal survival but for the survival of their people. the outburst is occurring NOW.

 

[OutcryX]

and i meant blue eyes by the way

 

[El Bastardo]

to be honest. and i am a bit rusty, but i collected die hard throughout the late 80s and 90s..the X-Men have ALWAYS been proud of their mutations and never have wanted to be 'just humans'. they are proud to be who they are. they want acceptance and equality. and from what I've seen the X-Men and mutants in general have been in a state of shock and panic ever since House of M. first they had to come to the realization that 98% of mutants had been wiped from the face of the earth, secondly they had to go on living and surviving and fighting and demanding the same treatment that they always have demanded and thirdly they later realized that they wouldn't be reproducing and have started to panic. they are now fighting not only for their personal survival but for the survival of their people. the outburst is occurring NOW.

I still <3 and agree with you. I was merely conceding that point to iamlegend in an attempt to get the conversation off that dead horse. t:

So yes! If you agree with me I'll agree with you, but I agree with you anyway!

 

[OutcryX]

I still <3 and agree with you. I was merely conceding that point to iamlegend in an attempt to get the conversation off that dead horse. t:

So yes! If you agree with me I'll agree with you, but I agree with you anyway!

oh...my bad. then we share the same opinion. good sh_t

 

[iamlegend]

To El Bastardo and Outcry...

No, mutants are not akin to whites, blacks, etc. etc. in terms of "race."

Wanna know why? If Whites, Blacks, or Asians were suddenly not able to reproduce then sure, it'd be a massive panic/disaster. They're a huge group of people that are suddenly unable to continue their society/culture.

But we're not talking about mutants not being able to reproduce. Of course all of the mutants can still reproduce! They can have all the little kiddies they want. They just won't be mutants. See the difference there?

That's why I related the so called "mutant race" to hair color. Being a mutant in the Marvel community just means have a certian gene set. It doesn't affect your culture, or your society. I mean, we've got mutants from all over the world that reflect their own cultures. There is no "mutant culture."

Thus, no more mutants being born doesn't strike me as being that big of a deal. The people who would have been mutants will still exist. That's what's important, right? No one's going extinct.

Oh, and please tell me why this outlook is "flawed and dangerous."

And please, don't bring the terms "genocide" into this. This isn't "genocide." No one's killing the mutants. I hate when that term is tossed around where it shouldn't be.

 

[Snikt 6]

Kind of a slow issue, but it was good. Kinda what Carey told us it would be. Not much action, but it set up the story line pretty good. Now I know Spec knows the answer to this. Which comes first, the Torn storyline or this one?

 

[Colossal Spoons]

^Well they deliberately didn't show Colossus or Kitty if you noticed lol

 

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

Kind of a slow issue, but it was good. Kinda what Carey told us it would be. Not much action, but it set up the story line pretty good. Now I know Spec knows the answer to this. Which comes first, the Torn storyline or this one?

This one.

Torn/Unstoppable is going to be inserted between october & november (AKA last issues before the crossover) into continuity.

 

[El Bastardo]

Likening the mutant race/species to anything in reality is tough, but likening it to a hair color, or eye color, or whether one has or does not have freckles is over-trivializing the entire thing.

But the X-titles can often be looked at, in their overall and original storyline, as being akin to a fight for civil rights. Whether you want to look at it as "race" or gender, this in and of itself gives better weight to looking at mutants as a sub-species of humans, just as homo sapiens sapiens were equally a sub-species of homo sapiens before taking over. They were different, but still "humans."

Of course there's no world-wide mutant culture. Is there a world-wide culture for any "race" in humanity? Do whites in America share the same culture and values as whites in Europe or whites in Russia? The values held by Japanese born and raised in Japan are not necessarily the same as those born today in America of Japanese descent.

But there very much is a mutant culture, and what a surprise, it's evident in the X-Men themselves. Now, especially, those at the Mansion are, what, the biggest collection of mutants in a single place in the entire world? Most likely, but I'm not counting how many there'd be. Genosha was an attempt at a mutant culture and nation that, in the end, failed. The Mansion isn't a self-governing body, sure, but being that it is in its almost-entirety mutant, it is a mutant culture in and of itself. Sunfire, for example, would assumedly represent Japanese culture - but he's pretty much always stayed on the outside of the mutant culture. Others have lived in the mutant culture always, or almost always, and constantly fought for their civil rights in whatever shape or form.

Yes, mutants can reproduce, but they can't reproduce beings with the mutant gene. It's the same as being unable to have offspring. Not being able to have a baby who can continue your legacy as what you are - as a mutant - is the same as whites or blacks or asians being unable to reproduce. Humans being unable to reproduce means no humans to continue human legacy. The mutant gene being gone or made permanently dormant means no mutants to continue mutant legacy - which means no mutant reproduction.

The specifics of what makes a mutant doesn't matter. Yep, it's a specific gene set, but that doesn't make it similar to hair color. It's merely the avenue taken in the next step of evolution. It doesn't cheapen said evolution, or cheapen the species.

It's a matter of legacy and it's a matter of species. If mutants can no longer give birth to children who might have an active x-gene, if humans can no longer give birth to children who might have an active x-gene, then it's the same as if no more white babies were born. It would be the dying out of an entire sub-species of humanity.

 

[OutcryX]

Likening the mutant race/species to anything in reality is tough, but likening it to a hair color, or eye color, or whether one has or does not have freckles is over-trivializing the entire thing.

But the X-titles can often be looked at, in their overall and original storyline, as being akin to a fight for civil rights. Whether you want to look at it as "race" or gender, this in and of itself gives better weight to looking at mutants as a sub-species of humans, just as homo sapiens sapiens were equally a sub-species of homo sapiens before taking over. They were different, but still "humans."

Of course there's no world-wide mutant culture. Is there a world-wide culture for any "race" in humanity? Do whites in America share the same culture and values as whites in Europe or whites in Russia? The values held by Japanese born and raised in Japan are not necessarily the same as those born today in America of Japanese descent.

But there very much is a mutant culture, and what a surprise, it's evident in the X-Men themselves. Now, especially, those at the Mansion are, what, the biggest collection of mutants in a single place in the entire world? Most likely, but I'm not counting how many there'd be. Genosha was an attempt at a mutant culture and nation that, in the end, failed. The Mansion isn't a self-governing body, sure, but being that it is in its almost-entirety mutant, it is a mutant culture in and of itself. Sunfire, for example, would assumedly represent Japanese culture - but he's pretty much always stayed on the outside of the mutant culture. Others have lived in the mutant culture always, or almost always, and constantly fought for their civil rights in whatever shape or form.

Yes, mutants can reproduce, but they can't reproduce beings with the mutant gene. It's the same as being unable to have offspring. Not being able to have a baby who can continue your legacy as what you are - as a mutant - is the same as whites or blacks or asians being unable to reproduce. Humans being unable to reproduce means no humans to continue human legacy. The mutant gene being gone or made permanently dormant means no mutants to continue mutant legacy - which means no mutant reproduction.

The specifics of what makes a mutant doesn't matter. Yep, it's a specific gene set, but that doesn't make it similar to hair color. It's merely the avenue taken in the next step of evolution. It doesn't cheapen said evolution, or cheapen the species.

It's a matter of legacy and it's a matter of species. If mutants can no longer give birth to children who might have an active x-gene, if humans can no longer give birth to children who might have an active x-gene, then it's the same as if no more white babies were born. It would be the dying out of an entire sub-species of humanity.

I agree with the bastard and disagree with the legend

 

[iamlegend]

I agree with the bastard and disagree with the legend

We'll just have to accept that we disagree then. I just don't see it the way you folks do.

 

[squeekness]

I thought it was rather disappointing Nothing really happened.

Same here. I expected something a bit more dramatic. I hope the little mini slices are more interesting.

 

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

Just for the record, I'm with Legend on this one.

I get why the average mutant would whine. But *HEROES*? Mmmm.

Sorry, folks.

 

[ragingdemon155]

PIcked up the X-men Endangered Species storyline today. Was the first title related to X-men that I had collected in a while so some of the characters felt a bit new to me.

ANyway, about this specific "Endangered Species" event...I understand that its running weekly as "backstories" in all the X-titles and its 17 parts long. Now is that the whole event right there? Or do those 17 issue backstories lead into another event???

 

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

PIcked up the X-men Endangered Species storyline today. Was the first title related to X-men that I had collected in a while so some of the characters felt a bit new to me.

ANyway, about this specific "Endangered Species" event...I understand that its running weekly as "backstories" in all the X-titles and its 17 parts long. Now is that the whole event right there? Or do those 17 issue backstories lead into another event???

Endangered Species is the prelude to the crossover, Messiah Complex. 13 issues starting with a one shot and then spread throughout X-Factor, NXM, Adjectiveless & UXM.

For some reason, Brubaker gets to write the one shot kickstarting the whole thing.

 

[OutcryX]

here's hoping Brubaker doesn't bring in Forge to solve the mystery then have Vulcan kill him...from space...SHI'AR space....

 

[Havok83]

Endangered Species is the prelude to the crossover, Messiah Complex. 13 issues starting with a one shot and then spread throughout X-Factor, NXM, Adjectiveless & UXM.

For some reason, Brubaker gets to write the one shot kickstarting the whole thing.

Brubaker is good writer so they mad a good choice