The Amazing Spider-Man 2 The Amazing Spider-Man 2 - User Review Thread! - SPOILERS! - Part 5

[grieven]

I just got back and I'm not even sure how to describe my opinion of it because I don't think I've ever had such conflicting feelings toward a movie.

On one hand, I loved, loved LOVED so much about this movie. This version of Peter Parker/Spider-Man is THE definitive screen version for me through and through. Andrew's performance and the way he was written was just perfection to me. I feel the same way about Gwen Stacy. In fact, I like this version of Gwen better than I've ever liked her in the comics, and she's now one of my favorite "superhero love interest" characters in movies, period. Actually, I think she's surpassed Pepper Potts as my favorite. Every scene Peter and Gwen had together or with other characters just worked so well, imo, and I credit that both to the actors and Marc Webb's direction of them.

I also enjoyed the action scenes more than any Spidey movie, including SM2. They were easy to follow yet still extremely kinetic with a very distinctive style of their own. I really loved the overall tone, and and the visuals were stunning (saw it in IMAX 3D). It just had the personality I've always felt like a Spidey movie should have (I've mentioned several times before that Raimi's tone just went too camp too often for me). All of that, I have to give kudos to Marc Webb for, because honestly, I don't think this script could have been directed any better.

...which is where we get to the "conflicted feelings" part. Because despite all the lovely character and action moments and visuals, this movie is a narrative mess. Yes, I guess Webb deserves some blame for that, as a little more work in the editing room could have possibly helped, but honestly I feel like the crux of the problem lies with the screenplay and Sony's grand franchise plans seriously weighing it all down. There's just too much they're trying to do in the grand scheme that they forgot to focus on THIS individual story and what it has to say. It feels like nothing more than a continuation meant to lead to bigger things, and doesn't work as a standalone narrative. Electro didn't need to be in it at all. I mean, he lifts right out of the story, except he's there to give Spidey someone to fight until Goblin shows up. And then when Goblin DOES show up, since Electro's been the major villain so far and is the focus of the climactic spectacle, he undercuts the payoff of the Goblin story, turning that whole storyline into one big anti-climax. It's like, Electro could have been the main villain in one movie, Goblin could have been the main villain in another, but throwing them together cuts down on their time to be developed and undercuts each one's effectiveness. It makes them both seem like undercooked afterthoughts in a way. Then there's all the other stuff, with Oscorp, Peter's parents, and obvious setups for the Sinister Six, and it all just starts to be way too much. The only character development that didn't suffer from this was Peter and Gwen's. Everyone else just felt like cogs in a machine, despite some good performances (I didn't care for Jamie Foxx, though).

So yeah, I basically have to rate this on 2 different scales - one as a Spidey movie, and one as a film in general, because my feelings on how it works as each of those things are so dramatically different.

As a Spidey movie - 9.5/10. As I said, this is the best interpretation of the character I've seen thus far, and the portrayal of his interactions with everyone from Gwen to Aunt May to his many foes were just perfect to me. I had such a grin on my face throughout these scenes. It pretty much had everything I've ever wanted to see in a Spidey movie, in tone, action and character (at least with the protagonists).

As a film - 6.5/10. Mostly great performances, stunning visuals (shout out to the production design too!), good music (still prefer Horner's theme, but Zimmer did a good job), and great action scenes. All hampered by a super-weak narrative and undercooked villains.

So my overall score would have to be an average of the two which is an 8/10. I really enjoyed this movie, despite the completely bungled narrative. And while I accept that SM2 is a MUCH better-crafted story than this and won't argue with anyone who declares its superiority over this sequel, I personally still enjoyed this more than that one, because of how much I prefer and enjoy this version of the main characters.

I agree with practically ever word you've written, flickchick, down to your rating breakdown (I'm not settled on a final score but it's probably in the 8 vicinity). You articulate the weaknesses that I felt about the film, and also highlight the things I really loved.

I can't help but feel that Webb shot a better movie, that spools of film are sitting in a room somewhere and that better version just needed to be "found", cut together in a more satisfying way. That version might not solve all the writing problems or character development problems of the villains and such, but it would feel less disjointed and half baked than the version in theaters.

I still liked TASM2 overall, but I didn't love it the way I did with TASM1.

 

[SpideyK]

Is the ASM 2 game taking a beating critically? I've seen most gamers say it's a great game.

It's... Good. Not even remotely great, though.

 

[sephiroth61787]

To be fair, I can judge a movie on any terms I like. I could be a cinematographer and the most important thing to me could be lighting and composition or an screen writer where the most important thing to me is the script. I'm a Spider-Man fan and the most important thing to me in a Spider-Man movie is Spider-Man himself. You have your barometer and I have mine.

I'm not denying that at all. The fact that this movie seems so polarizing is proof enough of different opinions. I personally enjoyed the movie, but I'm open to those who did not like it. I enjoy reading and discussing the opinions of others. I'd never put anyone down for their opinion and that wasn't my intent at all.

I just don't see the reason for a separate Spider-Man film score and an overall film score. Especially since those two ratings tend to be somewhat contradicting.

 

[Human Torch]

Alright,for starters I'll say this film was something of a mixed bag.I would unequivocally say this film is a sizable step up from the first one.(Given my monumental disdain for the first film,things could only go up!) Credit where it's due,it seems they addressed the tonal problems of the first film being too grim/dark and seemingly "Nolanizing" the Web Head's universe.Things are considerably lighter in tone for the most part.Spider-Man actually felt like Spider-Man to me in this one.I remember one of my biggest criticisms of the first film was there was no sense of exhilaration at being Spider-Man.Also there was more of the wise cracking Spidey trademark than ever attempted before.

One of my long time gripes of Spidey's constant unmasking is addressed as well.Garfield is maskless only twice (if memory serves) and both times briefly and before a single person.Garfield himself,seems more at ease in the role and has abandoned the stuttering,twitchy mannerisms that I found completely annoying in the first film.Opening the film with a cool action scene of Spidey vs "the man who would be Rhino" was a fantastic move.

Admittedly, Electro's motivation was pretty threadbare.(Jaime Foxx basically as a modern day Jerry Lewis,takes Spidey as an Idol,only to despise him 24 hrs later.Not unlike Jim Carrey's Riddler in Batman Forever) It also kinda reminded me of how Sandman was handled in Spider-Man 3.(although,in comparison Sandman's "I did it all for my sick daughter" motivation looks Oscar worthy) The problem being trying to take a B-list "villain of the month" and give them the gravitas to carry a whole film for 2+ hrs.Maybe they should've stuck to more A- list villain material.Like the old adage says: "You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear."


Then there's Harry Osborn,recently returned from "exile" by Norman (who "dies" immediately after).And to the film's credit,I don't really feel they rushed his sudden "BFF" status with Peter.An attempt to cause Harry's fall in the same film he's introduced however,is unforgivable.He's given a genetic condition that took a lifetime to kill Norman,(yet is killing him over a mere few days,) that causes the laughably bad leprechaun look he has as the Green Goblin.Again,in shades of Venom in SM 3,he's shoehorned into the climactic final.


As you might expect,Gwen Stacy meets her famous demise (At least still at the hands of a Green Goblin,though it should've been Norman).The scene played very well and emotional.Like the original comic story,Gwen's an instant gonner.No rousing last words or pledging undying love.She's just there one minute,gone the next.And I liked that very much. The problem though,is it feels very inconsequential.Harry is defeated almost as an afterthought.A time lapse tells us Peter gives up being Spidey for 5 months.But besides the actual death scene,it doesn't really resonate the way such a mythic moment in Spidey history should.Had the story actually been built around the event and not stuffed into "an Electro movie", it would've been more effective.


More needless stuff about Peter's parents shows up.They sort of half-hearted the original comic story (again,credit where due) of Pete's parents suspected of being traitors.But the film goes off on detail over Pete seeing a video message his dad left to explain things.(Kinda reminded me the stuff about Tony & his dad in Iron Man 2)The film also begins with more unnecessary time spent on a scene of his parents fleeing before their death. Oddly,the plotline of Uncle Ben's killer (who was still at large in the first film) is completely overlooked.

My biggest problem with this new series is how it just...doesn't feel like Spidey's world.Jameson gets mentioned but is never seen.Apart from Gwen (admittedly played to perfection by Emma Stone) there is very little of the Spidey universe-even with the dozens character references and "easter eggs"- in the series. The Raimi films just felt like opening a live action comic book of Spidey.This series still has the feeling of a (for want of a better term) "Twilightized" Spider-Man.

I guess,in conclusion,I enjoyed it for the most part.It's still a far cry from Spidey's glory days on the silver screen,but at least they've inched slightly in a positive direction.

 

[Nemeres]

I'm not denying that at all. The fact that this movie seems so polarizing is proof enough of different opinions. I personally enjoyed the movie, but I'm open to those who did not like it. I enjoy reading and discussing the opinions of others. I'd never put anyone down for their opinion and that wasn't my intent at all.

I just don't see the reason for a separate Spider-Man film score and an overall film score. Especially since those two ratings tend to be somewhat contradicting.

Same. How can a great Spider-Man movie also be a so-so movie, or vice versa? It's kind of like saying that Superman III was a great Superman movie because it has the Superman character down to a T. Ok, but what about the mess of a movie around him?

I don't mean to ridicule people's rating systems, to each their own. It just puzzles me, is all.

 

[spider-neil]

Same. How can a great Spider-Man movie also be a so-so movie, or vice versa? It's kind of like saying that Superman III was a great Superman movie because it has the Superman character down to a T. Ok, but what about the mess of a movie around him?

You 'could' say that if Superman was great in S3, but he wasn't.

 

[UltimateWebhead]

Alright,for starters I'll say this film was something of a mixed bag.I would unequivocally say this film is a sizable step up from the first one.(Given my monumental disdain for the first film,things could only go up!) Credit where it's due,it seems they addressed the tonal problems of the first film being too grim/dark and seemingly "Nolanizing" the Web Head's universe.Things are considerably lighter in tone for the most part.Spider-Man actually felt like Spider-Man to me in this one.I remember one of my biggest criticisms of the first film was there was no sense of exhilaration at being Spider-Man.Also there was more of the wise cracking Spidey trademark than ever attempted before.

One of my long time gripes of Spidey's constant unmasking is addressed as well.Garfield is maskless only twice (if memory serves) and both times briefly and before a single person.Garfield himself,seems more at ease in the role and has abandoned the stuttering,twitchy mannerisms that I found completely annoying in the first film.Opening the film with a cool action scene of Spidey vs "the man who would be Rhino" was a fantastic move.

Admittedly, Electro's motivation was pretty threadbare.(Jaime Foxx basically as a modern day Jerry Lewis,takes Spidey as an Idol,only to despise him 24 hrs later.Not unlike Jim Carrey's Riddler in Batman Forever) It also kinda reminded me of how Sandman was handled in Spider-Man 3.(although,in comparison Sandman's "I did it all for my sick daughter" motivation looks Oscar worthy) The problem being trying to take a B-list "villain of the month" and give them the gravitas to carry a whole film for 2+ hrs.Maybe they should've stuck to more A- list villain material.Like the old adage says: "You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear."


Then there's Harry Osborn,recently returned from "exile" by Norman (who "dies" immediately after).And to the film's credit,I don't really feel they rushed his sudden "BFF" status with Peter.An attempt to cause Harry's fall in the same film he's introduced however,is unforgivable.He's given a genetic condition that took a lifetime to kill Norman,(yet is killing him over a mere few days,) that causes the laughably bad leprechaun look he has as the Green Goblin.Again,in shades of Venom in SM 3,he's shoehorned into the climactic final.


As you might expect,Gwen Stacy meets her famous demise (At least still at the hands of a Green Goblin,though it should've been Norman).The scene played very well and emotional.Like the original comic story,Gwen's an instant gonner.No rousing last words or pledging undying love.She's just there one minute,gone the next.And I liked that very much. The problem though,is it feels very inconsequential.Harry is defeated almost as an afterthought.A time lapse tells us Peter gives up being Spidey for 5 months.But besides the actual death scene,it doesn't really resonate the way such a mythic moment in Spidey history should.Had the story actually been built around the event and not stuffed into "an Electro movie", it would've been more effective.


More needless stuff about Peter's parents shows up.They sort of half-hearted the original comic story (again,credit where due) of Pete's parents suspected of being traitors.But the film goes off on detail over Pete seeing a video message his dad left to explain things.(Kinda reminded me the stuff about Tony & his dad in Iron Man 2)The film also begins with more unnecessary time spent on a scene of his parents fleeing before their death. Oddly,the plotline of Uncle Ben's killer (who was still at large in the first film) is completely overlooked.

My biggest problem with this new series is how it just...doesn't feel like Spidey's world.Jameson gets mentioned but is never seen.Apart from Gwen (admittedly played to perfection by Emma Stone) there is very little of the Spidey universe-even with the dozens character references and "easter eggs"- in the series. The Raimi films just felt like opening a live action comic book of Spidey.This series still has the feeling of a (for want of a better term) "Twilightized" Spider-Man.

I guess,in conclusion,I enjoyed it for the most part.It's still a far cry from Spidey's glory days on the silver screen,but at least they've inched slightly in a positive direction.

Nicely written review. You make some good points here and although I don't agree with everything you've written, it was still enjoyable to read.

 

[Nemeres]

You 'could' say that if Superman was great in S3, but he wasn't.

I don't think you could even if he was. A messy movie is a messy movie.

But again, I'm sure people have their reasons for their ratings. I know I have my own weird way of appreciating things.

 

[Human Torch]

Nicely written review. You make some good points here and although I don't agree with everything you've written, it was still enjoyable to read.

Thanks Webhead.

 

[Casius--J]

I watched this for the second time today and for me it held up even better! The small nitpicks I had with this movie are even more insignificant.

I really enjoyed it and I still stand by that this is my favourite Spidey film right now. I'm looking forward to the third one even more now.

 

[UltimateWebhead]

I watched this for the second time today and for me it held up even better! The small nitpicks I had with this movie are even more insignificant.

I really enjoyed it and I still stand by that this is my favourite Spidey film right now. I'm looking forward to the third one even more now.

That's great to hear.

Out of curiosity, what are/were your 'nitpicks?'

 

[Casius--J]

That's great to hear.

Out of curiosity, what are/were your 'nitpicks?'

-Peter not figuring out the electrical issue with his webshooters
-Electro not being in it enough
-Norman "dying"
-Thought the fights were too short but on second viewing they were fine


I think there were some more but I honestly can't remember them now lol

 

[SpideyK]

Hey, UltimateWebHead.

What'd you rate the movie on a scale from 1 - 10?

 

[UltimateWebhead]

-Peter not figuring out the electrical issue with his webshooters
-Electro not being in it enough
-Norman "dying"
-Thought the fights were too short but on second viewing they were fine


I think there were some more but I honestly can't remember them now lol

I read some complaints about Peter not figuring out the electricity issue with his webshooters but I didn't have a problem with this while watching the movie. He simply forgot a basic lesson about magnetization and holding charges. I consider myself to be one of the smarter peeps in my field, however there are times I forget certain aspects or details and need to be reminded of them. Especially when it's something that I don't encounter very often and maybe only learned about it once in the past, a long time ago.

It gave Gwen yet another opportunity to show her smarts. Kudos to the writing or whoever for making her so much more than just the 'heroes gf.' Besides, when they're trying to figure out how to defeat Electro, Peter is the one that brainstorms to come up with the solution and orchestrates the plan to take him out.

Electro should have had more scenes, I agree. He was a great presence in the movie.

Norman being dead is not bothersome since imo I don't think he's really dead.

The fights were timed just right imo. They didn't drag on, the had enough build-up, tension and resolution. They were beautifully filmed, choreographed, and left you wanting more.

 

[Casius--J]

I read some complaints about Peter not figuring out the electricity issue with his webshooters but I didn't have a problem with this while watching the movie. He simply forgot a basic lesson about magnetization and holding charges. I consider myself to be one of the smarter peeps in my field, however there are times I forget certain aspects or details and need to be reminded of them. Especially when it's something that I don't encounter very often and maybe only learned about it once in the past, a long time ago.

It gave Gwen yet another opportunity to show her smarts. Kudos to the writing or whoever for making her so much more than just the 'heroes gf.' Besides, when they're trying to figure out how to defeat Electro, Peter is the one that brainstorms to come up with the solution and orchestrates the plan to take him out.

Electro should have had more scenes, I agree. He was a great presence in the movie.

Norman being dead is not bothersome since imo I don't think he's really dead.

The fights were timed just right imo. They didn't drag on, the had enough build-up, tension and resolution. They were beautifully filmed, choreographed, and left you wanting more.

Well thats what I mean, they WERE my nitpicks but I got over them on the second viewing.

I agree 100% with what you said re. the web shooter issue it's just the first time I was like hmmm not sure I like that he didn't solve it himself. But it really doesn't matter.

I don't think Norman is dead either and i didn't before, I was just hoping that they would reveal that in this movie but they didn't so there is doubt.

yep the fights were well timed, like I said this was on the first watch. Seeing it for second time made me appreciate them more, I think had they had made the electro fights longer it would have become repetitive.

 

[UltimateWebhead]

Well thats what I mean, they WERE my nitpicks but I got over them on the second viewing.

I agree 100% with what you said re. the web shooter issue it's just the first time I was like hmmm not sure I like that he didn't solve it himself. But it really doesn't matter.

I don't think Norman is dead either and i didn't before, I was just hoping that they would reveal that in this movie but they didn't so there is doubt.

yep the fights were well timed, like I said this was on the first watch. Seeing it for second time made me appreciate them more, I think had they had made the electro fights longer it would have become repetitive.

Sorry, I didn't mean to make it sound like I was coming at you with an argument, that wasn't my intention. I was just relaying my thoughts on those topics, but it looks like we agree on them so that's good.

 

[Sun_Down]

7.5/10 - Despite the sloppy narrative and having a few too many plates spinning, I was just so impressed with Garfield and Stone, and Webb's direction. The visuals were incredible, and only rarely took me out of the moment (Spidey and Electro's fistfight, for example). I really prefer Webb's style to Raimi's, who was about as subtle as a jackhammer. This film was sharply shot and edited and had a lot of great bits of direction (the grave quick montage, for example). And Garfield and Stone have so much natural chemistry, comedic timing, and genuine likeability. Gwen's fate was well-done and packed a true emotional punch, in large part because of how much I liked Peter and Gwen.

The story meandered and sputtered a bit, and the villains' plot was fairly ridiculous in a lot of ways, but I thought Foxx and DeHaan especially did a good job. DeHaan was kind of wasted; I thought he gave a great performance as Harry but the Goblin angle felt shoe-horned. Giamatti was pretty silly.

But even with the problems, I still greatly enjoyed myself.

 

[Isildur´s Heir]

Just saw the movie, and i give it a 6 out of 10

The very best of the movie was Peter/Gwen relationship and Electro (not Max).
The all Goblin transformation was pretty good too, as he DeHaan portrait of Harry.

All the rest....meh.

Max Dillon is basically Marvel version of Batman Forever's The Riddler, which is kind of ridiculous.
One loves Bruce Wayne, the other loves Spider-Man, both have posters of them and want nothing more to be their friend.
Both are pathetic caricatures of "invisible nerds".
Then he chances in Electro, and he really becomes a good character....minus the all "i just want to be loved" reason to be a villain.

Rhino is as ridiculous as everyone was expecting. The transformer's reject suit is so stupid is not even funny. He appears at the beginning and the end...he has no reason to be in the movie.....except to sell toys.

Gwen's dead is awful, it has no shock value, no drama, no nothing.
The Goblin appears (for like 5 minutes), fights with Spidey and she dies...that's it.
There is no explanation why he has the glider, why he has the bombs....nothing.
The movie has 2 villains too many. Only Electro is actually any good.

Ravencroft Institute is basically Arkham Asylum, they didn't tried to hide it.

All in all, it's much much worst than Captain America 2.

 

[Picard Sisko]

Rhino is as ridiculous as everyone was expecting. The transformer's reject suit is so stupid is not even funny. He appears at the beginning and the end...he has no reason to be in the movie.....except to sell toys.

Sony does not currently have the Spider-Man merchandising rights, so no. Rhino was not made to sell toys since they won't profit from it. He was there to tease the next movie, that's it.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Going to see this for a 2nd time today, I am curious to see if my rating goes up or down. I am so mixed on this movie, it has some amazing parts, but some awful ones as well.

 

[Isildur´s Heir]

Sony does not currently have the Spider-Man merchandising rights, so no. Rhino was not made to sell toys since they won't profit from it. He was there to tease the next movie, that's it.

So, it's even more pathetic than i thought...

I particularly like the news on tv saying "Aleksei Sytsevich escaped from The Vault".
If they want more comic reference, at least do their homework.

The Vault is a prison for superhuman criminals, not for gansgters.
Aleksei Sytsevich would never had been put in The Vault.

One thing i also disliked about the movie is the way everything was so causal.
There is no urgency to the fact that superhuman guys are destroying the city, not even for Spidey, it's like it's a normal situation.
How many gangster in a transformer's wannabe armor suit are there?
In that regard, is too much "comic bookish" for it's own good, imo.

 

[Hoorayforeric]

Saw it last night. Give it a 6.5/10. I liked the Gwen/Peter relationship, but it's a Spiderman movie and romance (while important to the story) shouldn't be the best part. Seemed a bit rushed, especially Electro's outfit equipped with bolts and lightning shaped on his chest. WTF? How did they make that thing so fast? I did like the throwback to the comics with Spiderman's humorous insults at his foes. That was always one of my favorite things about Spiderman. His ability to show courage and humor in the midst of battle and laugh in the face of his foes, while also being aware of his surroundings. That was missing from Raimi's Spiderman during his fights. The Raimi fights had a few bad lines like, "Here's your change!" in SM2, for instance, but Garfield's version was a little more like the comics. My son watches Spiderman on Disney XD and it's kind of funny. That's another thing about these reboots of Spiderman that bother me, as well. In the cartoons on Disney XD, Spiderman talks with Shield, Nick Fury, The Avengers and even Agent Phil Coulson. It's the only way Disney can team these guys up and I think the studio issues distract from these non-Disney/Marvel, Marvel films. Disney/Marvel movies seem like the real MCU and these others are just desperate cash grabs.

But, I do want to see a great Spidey flick and neither ASM or ASM2 seem to be grasping people's interest in a whole tie-in/spinoff saga. Spidey will need help and can't fight the same limited number of characters over and over again. Works in the comics, but not on film. People will lose interest, especially if the current ASM movies are so-so at best.

 

[Visualiza]

Saw it last night. Give it a 6.5/10. I liked the Gwen/Peter relationship, but it's a Spiderman movie and romance (while important to the story) shouldn't be the best part.

Thank you.

 

[Picard Sisko]

The romance is one of the elements that makes Spider-Man more interesting than many of the other superheroes.

 

[AnneFan]

The romance is one of the elements that makes Spider-Man more interesting than many of the other superheroes.

Yep. I doesn't verge on 'chick flick' but there's a particular intimacy about the relationships in Spider-Man.