The Bond 23 Thread

[The Joker]

It isn't? I know Largo was dubbed.

Yeah, Frobe was dubbed. Flawless dubbing isn't it? You'd never know it wasn't him talking.

Honey Rider was dubbed. So was Domino Derval I think.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Yeah, Frobe was dubbed. Flawless dubbing isn't it? You'd never know it wasn't him talking.

Honey Rider was dubbed. So was Domino Derval I think.

All these years and I didn't know that, it really is flawless.

Didn't know about Honey either, but I gathered Domino was as it looked clearer, like Largo is obvious.

 

[Metallo]

A lot of the women were dubbed in the early Bond films...I guess since many of them had accents that the producers weren't satisfied with or their English wasn't the greatest. I believe Tanya/Tatiana's voice in From Russia With Love was also dubbed.

There have been claims that many of the actresses were dubbed by the same woman but I've never heard definitive proof of that.

Auric Goldfinger definitely has some of the best dubbing. I think Guy Hamilton said the key to that was that he told Frobe to talk very fast. I love how the first two letters of that insane bastards first name are the symbols for gold! Thats dedication folks!

 

[Brian Braddock]

The thing about Goldfinger is that isn't Gert Frobe's voice.

And the thing about Frobe is that it's weird to watch Chitty Chitty Bang Bang and think 'jeezuz - that's Goldfinger'.

 

[Metallo]

Goldfinger also had one of the best more clever yet realistic plans of any Bond movie at the time. I think in the book the plan was to steal the gold but either destroying or making it unobtainable sounds far more interesting and pluasible to me. Like Bond said it'd be very difficult to move that much gold but if you destroy it or make it radioactive that could have cause a financial disaster. For the 60's thats really forward thinking for a film plot

 

[The Joker]

All these years and I didn't know that, it really is flawless.

Didn't know about Honey either, but I gathered Domino was as it looked clearer, like Largo is obvious.

Largo's was obvious in several spots. Incidentally the actor who dubbed Largo also did Tiger Tanaka's voice in YOLT.

Auric Goldfinger definitely has some of the best dubbing. I think Guy Hamilton said the key to that was that he told Frobe to talk very fast. I love how the first two letters of that insane bastards first name are the symbols for gold! Thats dedication folks!

My god, me being a Science major and I never copped that in all these years.

That's awesome lol.

Goldfinger also had one of the best more clever yet realistic plans of any Bond movie at the time. I think in the book the plan was to steal the gold but either destroying or making it unobtainable sounds far more interesting and pluasible to me. Like Bond said it'd be very difficult to move that much gold but if you destroy it or make it radioactive that could have cause a financial disaster. For the 60's thats really forward thinking for a film plot

His plan was really clever. I love the scene where Bond is being all smug in explaining why Goldfinger's plan to rob Fort Knox won't work.

Bond: "Fifteen billion dollars in gold bullion weighs ten thousand five hundred tons. Sixty men would take ten days to load it onto two hundred trucks. Now at the most you're going to have two hours before the army and navy air force marines move in and make you put it back"
Goldfinger: "Who said anything about removing it?"

The look on Bond's face when Goldfinger casually says that is a picture.

 

[Gold Samurai]

So this brings up an interesting question. Which Bond villain had the best and worst plan?


I think Elliot Carver had the worst.

"Starting a war for ratings"

 

[ChickenScratch]

Yeah, Gert was dubbed. But weirdly enough a lot f other people in the earlier part of the series were dubbed. Specifically Dr No. It used illustrious Jamaican actors like Reggie Carter and then Ms. Jamaica (as the photographer girl) and pretty much every other Jamaican actor was dubbed over. These people didn't have heavy accents (the country was still British at the time) but they were all still dubbed to more Brit sounding actors. Oh, and Honey was dubbed too. I always assumed there was some sort of problem with the sound recordists because a lot of people were dubbed that didn't have to be, like Carter (the driver of Bond from the airport).

 

[Metallo]

Largo's was obvious in several spots. Incidentally the actor who dubbed Largo also did Tiger Tanaka's voice in YOLT.

Wow I never realized that before. Now that you've got me thinking about it I think your right. There are so many things about these movies I never notice at first.

My god, me being a Science major and I never copped that in all these years.

That's awesome lol.

Yeah I thought that was a clever touch. I didn't realize it for a long time either until I was reading some stuff about Goldfinger and noticed "Au" in Auric Goldfinger and thought "isn't that the symbol for gold?"

His plan was really clever. I love the scene where Bond is being all smug in explaining why Goldfinger's plan to rob Fort Knox won't work.

Bond: "Fifteen billion dollars in gold bullion weighs ten thousand five hundred tons. Sixty men would take ten days to load it onto two hundred trucks. Now at the most you're going to have two hours before the army and navy air force marines move in and make you put it back"
Goldfinger: "Who said anything about removing it?"

The look on Bond's face when Goldfinger casually says that is a picture.

They really subvert the typical over the top villain plan with that one. Thats why I like it. Makes you think "whoa" when the movie goes beyond standard stuff like that.

It makes me think of Die Hard With A Vengeance, Simon Grubers plan, and how he'd possibly move all that gold from the Federal Reserve bank.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Largo's was obvious in several spots. Incidentally the actor who dubbed Largo also did Tiger Tanaka's voice in YOLT.

I definitely hadn't noticed that, they don't sound alike. Learning lots of new things in this thread today lol, I'll have my ears on high concentration next time I watch YOLT.

His plan was really clever. I love the scene where Bond is being all smug in explaining why Goldfinger's plan to rob Fort Knox won't work.

Bond: "Fifteen billion dollars in gold bullion weighs ten thousand five hundred tons. Sixty men would take ten days to load it onto two hundred trucks. Now at the most you're going to have two hours before the army and navy air force marines move in and make you put it back"
Goldfinger: "Who said anything about removing it?"

The look on Bond's face when Goldfinger casually says that is a picture.

It definitely was one of the stronger plans for the series, and that scene is one of several great dialogue exchanges between the two, Goldfinger is probably Bond's best nemesis in that regard.

So this brings up an interesting question. Which Bond villain had the best and worst plan?


I think Elliot Carver had the worst.

"Starting a war for ratings"

Agreed on that, I think Pryce knew it was a lost cause as he played the role of Carver like he was in pantomime.

 

[Metallo]

A media mogul is definitely troublesome in the sense that they can skew the truth to their benefit (look at Turner and Murdoch) but Carver came off as not very threatening to me.

As far as geniuses who use cutting edge semi realistic technology as a means to an end I thought Max Zorin was much more threatening than Elliot Carver. Walken chewed it up but he was interesting to watch.

As far as worst plans though...hmmm. Never was crazy about Hugo Drax's plan. Even by Bond movie standards its pretty absurd and far fetched. Its threatening but something a real crazy would come up with. Not much of a realistic benefit for Drax except to start over the human race as its new ruler.

When I think about it its the basically the same thing Stromberg wanted to do in TSWLM except Drax's scheme is even more far fetched.

 

[Hunter Rider]

A media mogul is definitely troublesome in the sense that they can skew the truth to their benefit (look at Turner and Murdoch) but Carver came off as not very threatening to me.

As far as geniuses who use cutting edge semi realistic technology as a means to an end I thought Max Zorin was much more threatening than Elliot Carver. Walken chewed it up but he was interestign to watch.

The media mogul idea was solid and quite relevant, but the problem was they didn't come up with a good way for Carver to abuse his power, instead they went way too far out with the plan.

As far as worst plans though...hmmm. Never was crazy about Hugo Drax's plan. Even by Bond movie standards its pretty aburd and far fetched. Its threatening but something a real crazy would come up with. Not much of a realistic benefit for Drax except to start over the human race as its new ruler.

It was essentially presented as Hitler in space.

 

[Metallo]

The media mogul idea was solid and quite relevant, but the problem was they didn't come up with a good way for Carver to abuse his power, instead they went way too far out with the plan.

Yeah it didn't have a particularly interesting payoff. Carver controls what people think...then what? Its like he was doing it just to get kicks. Theres power in that but like you said I don't think the writers came up with a good way for Carver to utilize that power later.

He may be the weakest villain of the Brosnan films. Electra Kings plan seemed more credible and 006's plan I could buy working.

It was essentially presented as Hitler in space.

I just didn't find it particularly believable. The whole movie goes over the top by the end so thats not surprising. Karl Stromberg wanted to wipe out the human race and start over too and that was far enough into cartoonish supervillainy territory but Drax took it to a whole new level. Not the idea of a master race but the means to his ends. The scope of it was just crazy.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Eliot Carver was one of the two huge problems I had with Tomorrow Never Dies. He didn't feel believeable, and he came off as campy and, like Metallo said, non-threatening. I think this had a lot to do with the actor. I could've actually seen someone like Eddie Izzard pulling it off, but Carver sucked.

Another problem I had was the gimmicky action. I didn't like that Bond was in the backseat controlling the car for the chase seen nor did I like that Bond was in handcuffs with Yeoh's character. Tomorrow Never Dies is okay, but it fails to really be a special Bond film.

And with Huge Drax, his plan was stupid and unbelieveable. Stromberg in TSWLM was able to get away with his plan for me because he felt like a believable character. I really believe this character was f**king nuts. Huge I didn't get that feel from.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Btw, as I said before, my favorite villain plot is Thunderball. Largo's plan of stealing atomic bombs and holding the world for ransom may not be as creative, but I always felt that added great tension and suspense to Bond finding the bombs.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Yeah it didn't have a particularly interesting payoff. Carver controls what people think...then what? Its like he was doing it just to get kicks. Theres power in that but like you said I don't think the writers came up with a good way for Carver to utilize that power later.

He may be the weakest villain of the Brosnan films. Electra Kings plan seemed more credible and 006's plan I could buy working.

It was a shame given that there is definitely good material in a crazy power mad media mogul, but they got the balance wrong and he came off as goofy.

006's was a decent one and King's had a degree of possibility in it, I think with Bond it's how the villain is presented that tips the balance on whether the audience can suspend disbelief for the plan or not, as PW pointed out with Stromberg > Drax.

I just didn't find it particularly believable. The whole movie goes over the top by the end so thats not surprising. Karl Stromberg wanted to wipe out the human race and start over too and that was far enough into cartoonish supervillainy territory but Drax took it to a whole new level. Not the idea of a master race but the means to his ends. The scope of it was just crazy.

Agreed, it was no coincidence that Moore's next outing as Bond was a very scaled back cold war type of espionage thriller, maybe the most grounded plot of all the Bond movies.

Another problem I had was the gimmicky action. I didn't like that Bond was in the backseat controlling the car for the chase seen nor did I like that Bond was in handcuffs with Yeoh's character. Tomorrow Never Dies is okay, but it fails to really be a special Bond film.

I thought the remote control car sequence had a degree of entertainment value to it but I get your point. I thought the bike chase worked pretty well though.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

I had no problem with Stromberg's plan. When he said, I want to change the face of history, his delivery had me sold. I believe this guy was f**king crazy.

My problem with the remote control car sequence was that he shouldn't have been in the back the whole time. He should've took control over the car manually at some point in the chase.

TND is an okay film, but I can see why people were disappointed with this film after seeing Goldeneye.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Agreed, TND was probably an even bigger disappointment as a follow up to Goldeneye, than Quantum of Solace was as a follow up to Casino Royale.

 

[The Joker]

Agreed on that, I think Pryce knew it was a lost cause as he played the role of Carver like he was in pantomime.

Carver: "There's no news like bad news"

*Cringe*

As far as dumbest villain plots go I have to give it to Drax and Stromberg. One wanted to start a civilization in space and the other one under the sea

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

And ironically, both are follow-ups to Martin Campbell directed Bond movies.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

The thing that put me off about those gangster associates in Goldfinger was that they were so goddamn stereotypical. I mean how they talked and acted annoyed the **** out of me.

Haha I laughed at their delivery of their lines every time. Especially the "You owe me one million bucks" line.

Carver: "There's no news like bad news"

*Cringe*

As far as dumbest villain plots go I have to give it to Drax and Stromberg. One wanted to start a civilization in space and the other one under the sea

Stromberg's was stupid but like I said, he was still a believable character.

He probably went into the future and saw this:

[YT]jgA2xo0HYrE[/YT]

 

[The Joker]

Stromberg's was stupid but like I said, he was still a believable character

Believable in what sense? His delusions of grandeur? I found him to be one of the more bland villains. He basically just sits around Atlantis pushing buttons. It's a rare thing when the henchman (Jaws) really outshines the villain in every way.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Carver: "There's no news like bad news"

*Cringe*

As far as dumbest villain plots go I have to give it to Drax and Stromberg. One wanted to start a civilization in space and the other one under the sea

Terrible line, and when he does the kung fu moves in front of Michelle Yeoh's character when she's caught.....

And ironically, both are follow-ups to Martin Campbell directed Bond movies.

Yeah, I wonder if Campbell will make another Bond with Craig, or if he is only interested in doing the first ones for new Bond's. t:

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Believable in what sense? His delusions of grandeur? I found him to be one of the more bland villains. He basically just sits around Atlantis pushing buttons. It's a rare thing when the henchman (Jaws) really outshines the villain in every way.

It was exactly that. Like I said, I found him to be insane enough to believe his plan without going overboard or coming off as too cartoony or campy. I would say it was because the role was played straight, unlike Hugo Drax and Elliot Carver.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Yeah, I wonder if Campbell will make another Bond with Craig, or if he is only interested in doing the first ones for new Bond's. t:

After what happened with that other potential franchise with Campbell, I'd be surprised if EON talks to him, and he doesn't at least consider it.