Iron Man 3 The IRON MAN 3 News & Speculation Thread - - - - - - Part 15

[Broseph44]

Jaqua to what are you guys referring to with the calling him master?

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

which is what i am trying to keep in mind. I think there is more to this movie than what ANYONE has figured out yet. I think there is more to mandarin, and more to what he is doing. I am going to leave a bold prediction here that will probably be wrong...but here it is...

whoever the mastermind behind The Winter Soldier is, is the current head of hydra, who funded Killians work, which allowed him to create AIM as a branch of hyrda (like it was in the comics)

there's my prediction. Probably waaayy off, but oh well

Either Zola (if the character isn't a secret) or Zemo (if it is a secret). And he's another Master? O_O

And Malekith? or perhaps we'll see Amora?


GAHHH "I'm pr0xyt0xin, I build neat stuff, I gotta great girl, and occasionally I save the world. So why can't I sleep?"

 

[jaqua99]

Feige did say you'd have to get in a couple viewings to fully understand all that was being done in the movie and some of it would be foreshadowing what they have in store for Phase 2.

Oh jeez. Now if thats the case... if Killian enters Trevor's body, Kingsley has a multiple film contract, AND more "masters" are introduced in Thor 2 and Cap 2...

Well then I might have to rethink my opinion of this film.

You might be onto something guys... I'd like to believe something like this is happening.

But alas, for now its bedtime.

does kingsley have multiple film contract?

 

[Webfoot Hero]

which is what i am trying to keep in mind. I think there is more to this movie than what ANYONE has figured out yet. I think there is more to mandarin, and more to what he is doing. I am going to leave a bold prediction here that will probably be wrong...but here it is...

whoever the mastermind behind The Winter Soldier is, is the current head of hydra, who funded Killians work, which allowed him to create AIM as a branch of hyrda (like it was in the comics)

there's my prediction. Probably waaayy off, but oh well

Feige said that the Phase 2 films would be a little more stand-alone than the Phase 1 ones were, but that certain connections would be made to slowly guide them into TA2. Thor and GotG are probably going to be the most singular films for this Phase but somehow they'll have to connect in so they make sense for being included in this new phase. I'm not sure how much CA: TWS will fit into Phase 2 but with AIM being a traditional off-shoot of one of CA's biggest enemies, it'd be a shock if they didn't do something with that.

 

[Webfoot Hero]

does kingsley have multiple film contract?

I'm not sure since Feige has never touched on that and neither has Kingsley, mainly due to me not recalling anyone ever asking in the interviews they given for IM3. I thought it was standard protocol for Marvel to sign most of their stars (even villains) to deals that have options for multiple movie appearances.

 

[jaqua99]

Jaqua to what are you guys referring to with the calling him master?

there is one point where Killian is on the phone, and he refers to the person he's talking to (i believe is kingsley, or it may be that he was talking to maya in the room, cant remember), as master.

they refer to mandarin as master.

So it's just some 2+2 speculation. Masters of Evil theory. Possibly Mandarin being one? The word "master" being used when talking about the mandarin? hinting that he will be part of the masters of evil? just some two and two speculation

Either Zola (if the character isn't a secret) or Zemo (if it is a secret). And he's another Master? O_O

And Malekith? or perhaps we'll see Amora?


GAHHH "I'm pr0xyt0xin, I build neat stuff, I gotta great girl, and occasionally I save the world. So why can't I sleep?"

that's what i would think. I don't think Malekith will survive but I mean, if we got zemo, zola, abomination, mandarin (who in turn could be fighting for control with over global domination, hydra vs aim since killian/mandarin went power hungry) if cap 2 is as big as what is being said, maybe more stuff comes to light...uhh, the leader? he's got to come back right?

and seriously, it's 4am here in MA, and I have to work on a paper on the roman empire tomorrow. I'll go sleep if you go lol, go now!

 

[Broseph44]

Jaqua that's def interesting

 

[jaqua99]

Feige said that the Phase 2 films would be a little more stand-alone than the Phase 1 ones were, but that certain connections would be made to slowly guide them into TA2. Thor and GotG are probably going to be the most singular films for this Phase but somehow they'll have to connect in so they make sense for being included in this new phase. I'm not sure how much CA: TWS will fit into Phase 2 but with AIM being a traditional off-shoot of one of CA's biggest enemies, it'd be a shock if they didn't do something with that.

exactly what i am thinking. I think that Zemo, and Killian have met, and are in a way, working together. I think Zemo MUST be the current head of hydra, and he offered to fund killian's work in AIM as a branch of hydra, maybe they see what they can do, and work together for global domination, though they each want it for themselves.

But given how packed CA: TWS is, and the fact that mackie described it as an avengers 1.5...with avengers 2 possibly having a small MoE part, perhaps to start, and a movie that is referred to as avengers 1.5, well I'd bet that the movie would certainly set the MoE thing in motion. assuming this is all true of course, which again, probably isn't likely, but could be

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

I'm pretty sure they call him the Master at least twice.

I'm also starting to think he won't be the only arch-villain "not done justice" in phase 2.

Even if there are only three "masters" that is enough for me to see face off against the Avengers in A2.

 

[jaqua99]

I'm pretty sure they call him the Master at least twice.

I'm also starting to think he won't be the only arch-villain "not done justice" in phase 2.

Even if there are only three "masters" that is enough for me to see face off against The Avengers in A2.

I'll bet my butt we see Killian, Zemo, Zola, and Abomination at minimum in avengers 2.

too much thinking, ugh I need to go to bed, guys, stop talking because I can't go away lol

edit: I'm just gunna do it..just gunna go, my bed is literally 5 feet away...i'm gone..

night guys!

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

I'll bet my butt we see Killian, Zemo, Zola, and Abomination at minimum in avengers 2.

too much thinking, ugh I need to go to bed, guys, stop talking because I can't go away lol

Lol actually I'm going the other direction and expecting/hoping we see Kingsley.

I really like this speculation. It gives me hope. Gotta have hope.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

Here's an example of them calling him "master"

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/iron-man-sir-ben-kingsley-gma-interview-actor-19091093

 

[Broseph44]

I'll bet my butt we see Killian, Zemo, Zola, and Abomination at minimum in avengers 2.

too much thinking, ugh I need to go to bed, guys, stop talking because I can't go away lol

edit: I'm just gunna do it..just gunna go, my bed is literally 5 feet away...i'm gone..

night guys!

Come on when your first got on tonight we got into a little tiff, but now we're actually having a good time. Crazy speculation and what not haha

 

[Sharkboy]

^ Irony lol. Cause the shane black ness of this movie is what hurt it in my opinion

Not really ironic, considering if you don't get/don't like/don't care about the Shane Black elements it's perfectly understandable why you'd think it would fail to help the story or even hurt the story overall...and vice versa.

 

[jaqua99]

Lol actually I'm going the other direction and expecting/hoping we see Kingsley.

I really like this speculation. It gives me hope. Gotta have hope.

crap

yeah me too. I think it would be a good way to put the mandarin character back into kingley's portrayal. Not only would it confuse the world, but it would add mystery...the mastermind was aldrich killian....yet, this robed mandarin guy is around again, and he's legit...bringing up the question, who..what is the mandarin?

A concept...something created by extremis, since "aldrich killian"s body is dead, and he's not, all that remains is the mandarin, and if he can go back to trevor and maybe literally control him, (trevor did hint at getting extremis, he did say killian fixed him up, gave him MORE drugs, and gave him surgery), then there would be no more aldrich killian, there would be JUST the mandarin, and it's played by ben kingsley. Going back to what dent said, the mandarin can be anyone, he's a symbol, and maybe it has a lot to do with all this brain hijacking crap via extremis. Maybe we are onto something here haha

alright, now it's bed time

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

agreed. Night all. same time next week?

 

[TRM]

Spoiler

In the comics Killian kills himself. I like how if you really think about it, they might have included a slight nod to this by him choosing not to Kill himself this time around (by not stepping off the roof). And then going on to become the Mandarin.

But what if Tony didn't really upset him by not showing up? Maybe there was an element of "desperation" to it from the very start... Meaning maybe even young Killian was sort of acting, or scripting his performance. He seems very interested in Maya's research from the start, obviously to cure himself, but maybe there's more to it. It's Tony who can make it work. Maybe Killian's "think tank" has been putting a lot of pressure on him the whole time. Not so much disappointed by Tony not showing up, as he was "desperate" and angry.
He tries to keep his cool. Late in the movie Killian says something about desperation when they're on the roof again.

Also the word Oracle can be seen in the movie in the background on a sign (i think around when he's in the van with the Happy Endings actor), and Jarvis says "Oracle cloud analysis complete" during the holographic investigation scene. I took these as possible easter eggs for Oracle industries, Namor's company, and that Jarvis uses some sort of sophisticated analysis software developed by Oracle or something.

Also Killian has a huge ego, maybe his brain actually created the Mandarin as part of his super-ego, which is something far greater than himself, a supervillain born out of his mind, creating his own demons. It would be cool if technology allows his mind to live on like Jaquaa is saying, to move into a backup body (Trevor), who has been prepped with certain surgeries to have Killian's mind slip inside Trevor's hollowed out mind. Maybe there is only this super-ego left of Killian, now that his body was destroyed. Only the Mandarin. Killian's out of control super-ego. Iron Man is Tony's super-ego. He is Tony Stark, but Tony Stark is Iron Man.

Iron Man is a part of him. It's not only a suit -- it's also an extension of his mind. He may have created his own demons as well, in multiple ways, but in the end he can accept that he is Tony Stark, and he is Iron Man. He is the suit. And the suit is just an extension of him.

He has his super-ego in control now. He was using the suits as a cocoon and running from the suit in some ways when he starts to break out of this cocoon... Keeping himself separate from it, making it an alternate identity. His ego and super ego are somewhat justified by his intelligence, gets him into trouble a little bit, although it can be a great asset to him even without the suit.

Killian really just benefited off Maya's research, found some investors, still couldn't quite get the algorithm Tony tried to point out in 1999. Tony says "I am Iron Man" again at the end, however now he's changed saying it in a new way... he's accepting it, He's not separate from it. It's no longer a cocoon surrounding him. It's not just a suit -- it is him, his mind and his potential energy put to use. He spends a lot of the movie outside of the suit learning how to rely on his ego Tony Stark, not his super-ego Iron Man. They're one and the same, Tony Stark is Iron Man, and there is no real Iron Man either... Tony Stark created him. There is only Tony Stark now, and Tony Stark will return... Tony Stark is and will always be Iron Man...
He's learned he can still be Tony Stark at the same time, and can balance both better... I don't think he's gone completely crazy, like Banner may think. He may have taken Extremis as some are starting to suspect. And if Mandarin is more than an idea, more than a thought, and taught Pepper how to Karate chop, but was taken out of her, it may live on.... editing Tony's mind to the Mandarin's preferred cut of the story... And trying to get what he wanted out of it: the algorithm. By tricking Tony into taking Extremis, and not telling anyone about it (he doesn't tell Banner/us exactly how he fixed his heart and Pepper).
Maybe Doctor Strange may have to perform neuro-surgery on him, or something, and it's a psychologist Banner is referring to, but what he now actually needs is a neuro surgeon who specializes in the brain, nerves, and central nervous system, one whose hands aren't shaky yet...

Killian saying I am the Mandarin is almost him doing the same thing as tony in the first movie, reverse of what's happening here in some ways (aim/mia), he could be developing demons in this other part of his mind, the super ego, the super villain within him.
Maybe it will take a doctor of a stranger sort to sort some of it out.
Is it true the subconscious mind can perceive things forwards and backwards?

Iron Man is within him, it's not running his life anymore, and even his normal egotistical ways are being set aside a little.

This is why I believe Tony does fix Extremis for himself at the end, takes it out of Pepper, and in Avengers 2 it may look like he doesn't have a suit but the suit starts to become physically within him....

 

[jaqua99]

agreed. Night all. same time next week?

you mean tomorrow morning? hahah

 

[Broseph44]

crap

yeah me too. I think it would be a good way to put the mandarin character back into kingley's portrayal. Not only would it confuse the world, but it would add mystery...the mastermind was aldrich killian....yet, this robed mandarin guy is around again, and he's legit...bringing up the question, who..what is the mandarin?

A concept...something created by extremis, since "aldrich killian"s body is dead, and he's not, all that remains is the mandarin, and if he can go back to trevor and maybe literally control him, (trevor did hint at getting extremis, he did say killian fixed him up, gave him MORE drugs, and gave him surgery), then there would be no more aldrich killian, there would be JUST the mandarin, and it's played by ben kingsley. Going back to what dent said, the mandarin can be anyone, he's a symbol, and maybe it has a lot to do with all this brain hijacking crap via extremis. Maybe we are onto something here haha

alright, now it's bed time

I haven't seen it yet but it def sounds like there might be some stuff to dissect with multiple viewings

 

[DareDemon]

Heh, I just looked up Coldblood on Wikipedia to see if I could think of any more possible references, and I may have found one. Eric Savin was once a Lt. Colonel on Ft. Killian.

 

[DareDemon]

Spoiler

In the comics Killian kills himself. I like how if you really think about it, they might have included a slight nod to Killian killing himself in the comics by him choosing not to Kill himself this time around (by not stepping off the roof in the beginning of the story). And then going on to become the Mandarin.

Interesting, good catch.

Spoiler

Also the word Oracle can be seen in the movie in the background at one point on a sign (i think around when he's in the van with the Happy Endings actor), and Jarvis says "Oracle cloud analysis complete" during the Chinese Theatre holographic investigation scene. I took these as possible easter eggs for Oracle, and that Jarvis uses some sort of sophisticated analysis software developed by Oracle or something, possibly.
[/I]

The one from Batman? She's in a different universe. I can't think of a Marvel version.

 

[Merlo]

about the master bit, I am sure that it was done just so people wouldn't find out that killian is the mandarin.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

The one from Batman? She's in a different universe. I can't think of a Marvel version.

I think he meant the Marvel Oracle. In reference to namor comics I believe? But yeah there's Oracle references in Avengers as well. But I believe its product placement for the real life company.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

about the master bit, I am sure that it was done just so people wouldn't find out that killian is the mandarin.

Don't ruin this for us bro. If they fix the mandarin by making him a master of evil, this easily raises the film a whole letter grade.

 

[TRM]

When Killian says it, it's worded weird which made me take in interest in watching that part a few times. it does definitely seem like it's supposed to be the Mandarin he's talking about, but watching the movie again makes when Killian says it, what he says, and where he's saying it (with pretty much no one around somewhere at AIM and to someone over the phone) makes me have some hope it is some kind of foreshadowing.

Spoiler

When you watch the movie again it's funny when Maya shows up at the Mansion and Tony asks "are you the Mandarin?". Like he already subconsciously knows Trevor isn't... Kinda like foreshadowing.

Also, Stark determines that Mandarin is a title that means adviser to the king. Could this mean something later, since Killian considered himself the Mandarin?