Batman Returns The Official Batman Returns Thread - Part 4

[titansupes]

This is correct. The idea of the cape itself turing semi-rigid is another idea lifted from the Burton films. It's just blatant, especially the bit where he casually rolls and the cape returns to its flaccid state. I don't know how one could interpret what's happening any other way.

The film's promotional material confirms it writing: "His cape-moddified with a special framework-serves as an emergency glider."

There's nothing new or revolutionary in general about using his cape to glide. In the first movie he uses a regular cape, usually with the assistance of a line attached to his belt. In the third movie, Kilmer uses a regular cape to glide down a HUGE distance toward O'Donnell in a alleyway. Clooney jumped out of the Batmobile in mid-air and sailed into the Freezemobile's windshield. Batman was gliding in video games long before Rocksteady as well. Batman: Vengeance immediately comes to mind, in which the glide function pretty looks and controls in the exact same way.

Exactly, good post.

 

[regwec]

I always thought the gliding/parachuting thing was implied in comics right back to the 70's. Batman was often to be seen swooping down from a great height with his cape outstretched like wings.

 

[Goshdarn Batman]

I remember the Batman Returns figure with candy coated chewing gum inside. Used it as an action figure.

We also had salty liquorice flavored pastilles with Batman, and chewing gum with stickers inside. Not inside of the gum...that would be stupid. The chewing gum was black/grey and tasted like...salty liquorice (because liquorice=Batman).

Good memories.

 

[Penguin]

If anyone hasn’t seen it already go check out Kevin Smith’s commentary with Marc Bernardin on YouTube, the commentary is absolute gold.

"Remember, we’re selling McDonald’s toys!" t:

 

[BobJM]

If anyone hasn’t seen it already go check out Kevin Smith’s commentary with Marc Bernardin on YouTube, the commentary is absolute gold.

"Remember, we’re selling McDonald’s toys!" t:

That's what I came here to post!

I still very much enjoy this movie, though its obvious (to me, anyway) that much of what I still like about it is due to nostalgia.

 

[Stu]

 

[Cain]

Kevin Smith's commentary on this movie is a perfect example as to why he was always such a terribly mediocre director and a much better writer. The man clearly does not comprehend the visual cinematic language in anyway. If it's not spelled out for him through dialogue he's as lost as a cat in a dog house. My respect level for him as a film maker and a fan of film went down a few notches once I sat through that commentary. But hey he had some funny dick and fart jokes in there as usual so it wasn't a complete loss.

 

[The Shape]

Kevin Smith's commentary on this movie is a perfect example as to why he was always such a terribly mediocre director and a much better writer. The man clearly does not comprehend the visual cinematic language in anyway. If it's not spelled out for him through dialogue he's as lost as a cat in a dog house.

He sucks.

 

[Cain]

I remember the Batman Returns figure with candy coated chewing gum inside. Used it as an action figure.

We also had salty liquorice flavored pastilles with Batman, and chewing gum with stickers inside. Not inside of the gum...that would be stupid. The chewing gum was black/grey and tasted like...salty liquorice (because liquorice=Batman).

Good memories.

I used to buy that too

I also remember the tiny PVC figures that Applause used to release. I had this Batman

And The Penguin one with the suction cup on a string as seen in this pic

I used to attach the suction to the door of my fridge's freezer because I considered it "Penguin's arctic fortress" lol

 

[Cain]

He sucks.

It's insane to me that I got more out of this movie at 9 years old in terms of it's substance then he did as a 20 something year old film school student.

I don't know if that's a testament to how ahead of it's time my precociousness as a child was or to how incompetent his level of comprehension may actually be.

 

[Travesty]

I forgot about those suction cup figures on a string. I had those hanging from my window in my room. They were extremely cheap.

I totally forgot about those.

 

[shauner111]

Kevin Smith's commentary on this movie is a perfect example as to why he was always such a terribly mediocre director and a much better writer. The man clearly does not comprehend the visual cinematic language in anyway. If it's not spelled out for him through dialogue he's as lost as a cat in a dog house. My respect level for him as a film maker and a fan of film went down a few notches once I sat through that commentary. But hey he had some funny dick and fart jokes in there as usual so it wasn't a complete loss.

So he has a laugh about the movie, finds what's wrong with it (let's not act like it's flawless), pokes fun at it with a buddy and that's somehow an example of his failures as a director/writer??

I watch a lot of film and television that sometimes doesn't even deal with much dialogue and i agreed with everything he said in that commentary. Then again, im a Kevin Smith fan and find him hilarious so maybe im a little biased.

Do i respect him as a filmmaker? I wouldn't go that far, but some of his movies are really enjoyable. Clerks for instance.

It's insane to me that I got more out of this movie at 9 years old in terms of it's substance then he did as a 20 something year old film school student.

I don't know if that's a testament to how ahead of it's time my precociousness as a child was or to how incompetent his level of comprehension may actually be.

Riiight, im sure you were catching all the substance from that movie at only age 9.

I loved this movie when i was young but it had to do with the cool and beautiful imagery. The look of Gotham, Batman looking cool. But as an adult, i find myself agreeing with Kevin Smith because i find the plot makes no sense, it's a paper thin script with not much substance at all. Characters just do things, and Batman isn't very Batmany at all in Returns (i have the same problem with the villains). But of course that's just my opinion. Not trying to take away your love for it, as i still think it looks beautiful. But i had to defend Kevin Smith since i laugh about all the of the same things that he laughs about in that commentary.

 

[Decepticonus]

If anyone hasn’t seen it already go check out Kevin Smith’s commentary with Marc Bernardin on YouTube, the commentary is absolute gold.

"Remember, we’re selling McDonald’s toys!" t:

Love it! Bernardin makes a good point as the movie isn't a real movie, it doesn't know what it wants to do, there is no real first, second, third act, it just does stuff randomly. I loved it when Smith stopped to quote and emphasize the Penguin...

"Why be biased? Male and female! Hell, the sexes are equal with their erogenous zones blown sky high!"

I mean seriously, wtf?! Who wrote that? Who edited this? No one looked over these lines and said "Really, you want to say that? Especially when we are trying to sell happy meals?" Hell, someone over at WB had to be like "ummm by the way Burton love your work but could you maybe alter that line or just not say it?"

Not really a Smith fan, only seen two of his films, liked them but they are go-to favorites for me. But I felt he nailed it with Bernardin on this so-called "film" if you want to call it that. I'm thinking more like "something to be placed under a microscope in lab with a added pension to the researcher's family if they die while working on this thing".

 

[shauner111]

Love it! Bernardin makes a good point as the movie isn't a real movie, it doesn't know what it wants to do, there is no real first, second, third act, it just does stuff randomly. I loved it when Smith stopped to quote and emphasize the Penguin...

"Why be biased? Male and female! Hell, the sexes are equal with their erogenous zones blown sky high!"

I mean seriously, wtf?! Who wrote that? Who edited this? No one looked over these lines and said "Really, you want to say that? Especially when we are trying to sell happy meals?" Hell, someone over at WB had to be like "ummm by the way Burton love your work but could you maybe alter that line or just not say it?"

Not really a Smith fan, only seen two of his films, liked them but they are go-to favorites for me. But I felt he nailed it with Bernardin on this so-called "film" if you want to call it that. I'm thinking more like "something to be placed under a microscope in lab with a added pension to the researcher's family if they die while working on this thing".

Somebody who also agrees with me!

It's a clusterf**k of a script and movie with some fantastic imagery. But even that imagery, like the shots of Gotham in the winter, feels more fake than Batman 89. It's definitely more Burton than it is Batman.

I love how Smith talks about how dumb it is to have like 40 people in the whole city, because that's what it feels like. The mayor and the whole Christmas tree thing felt like they gathered people from a few blocks. Even Wayne Manor doesn't look like a real building on the outside.

 

[I Am The Knight]

Well, you could consider that maybe Burton wasn't concerned with selling Happy Meals. He wanted to make his freakshow movie, WB gave him the money...And that's that.

 

[shauner111]

I do respect him for that.

 

[The Shape]

I actually agree with much of what Smith says about Batman Returns, but I still think he generally sucks. I also agree with the fact that he doesn't understand (or at least failed to acknowledge) the visual cinematic language and German expressionistic storytelling of this film.

 

[Cain]

Riiight, im sure you were catching all the substance from that movie at only age 9.

Sometimes you come across as such a tool with your overtly defensive gimmick I swear.

Where did I say that?

I said I "got more" at age 9 out of this movie than he seem to have in his 20's. I did not say "I caught all the substance in the movie at the age of 9". Reading comprehension is important.

For the record I like some of Smith's movies. Doesn't change the fact that he's a terrible director. He would agree so himself.

 

[shauner111]

Sometimes you come across as such a tool with your overtly defensive gimmick I swear.

Where did I say that?

I said I "got more" at age 9 out of this movie than he seem to have in his 20's. I did not say "I caught all the substance in the movie at the age of 9". Reading comprehension is important.

For the record I like some of Smith's movies. Doesn't change the fact that he's a terrible director. He would agree so himself.

This is what you said:

It's insane to me that I got more out of this movie at 9 years old in terms of it's substance then he did as a 20 something year old film school student.

I don't know if that's a testament to how ahead of it's time my precociousness as a child was or to how incompetent his level of comprehension may actually be.

If that's not pretentious..

You're still saying that, at age 9, you understood it's substance more than he did. So what substance are you talking about? Name the "substance" that you got from the movie when you were just 9, that Kev apparently didn't get. I would like to hear this.

BTW it's no gimmick. If i defend something, it's because i feel passionate enough to defend a person or a movie's plot point etc. I defended Kevin Smith's commentary because he's not saying it's the worst movie ever. He's enjoying some things about it, but he's also having fun with his buddy, making fun of the things he finds stupid. And i happen to agree with his commentary since i had the same reaction watching Batman Returns with a bunch of friends a few years back.

 

[Decepticonus]

Somebody who also agrees with me!

It's a clusterf**k of a script and movie with some fantastic imagery. But even that imagery, like the shots of Gotham in the winter, feels more fake than Batman 89. It's definitely more Burton than it is Batman.

I love how Smith talks about how dumb it is to have like 40 people in the whole city, because that's what it feels like. The mayor and the whole Christmas tree thing felt like they gathered people from a few blocks. Even Wayne Manor doesn't look like a real building on the outside.

Yes thank you. Yes, the imagery is great. I love the idea of Gotham at winter, with snow, especially during Christmas time. The scene of the Batmobile prowling through the snow looks sexy. But yes it is very Burton than it is Batman.

But yeah I love how he commented if he lighting of the tree in NYC had this many people attend they would shut it down and never do it again most likely.

 

[Decepticonus]

BTW it's no gimmick. If i defend something, it's because i feel passionate enough to defend a person or a movie's plot point etc. I defended Kevin Smith's commentary because he's not saying it's the worst movie ever. He's enjoying some things about it, but he's also having fun with his buddy, making fun of the things he finds stupid. And i happen to agree with his commentary since i had the same reaction watching Batman Returns with a bunch of friends a few years back.

Yeah, I'm sure like Smith alot of us looked at this movie when it first came out as "**** yeah, another Batman movie, coming from Burton the genius who gave us the first." After viewing, we liked it, didn't like it as much as '89 but liked it since we were all starving as Smith put it - for comic book films.

I watched it later too and half-way through I'm like - this movie needs to end, for it is a tough sit. And what is this campy ****? Penguin in a children's car?

 

[Cain]

I tend to post in jest a lot on here but you take things too seriously so of course to you it comes across as pretentious. I also don't bother with deconstructing and digesting posts on here so I will be straight and direct in one fell swoop.

I understood that Batman wasn't the most sociable character from the way he was in the first movie. So I was not shocked by the lack of Batman and Gordon camaraderie as a 9 year old.

I also understood that it wasn't going to be like a Batman comic because the first wasn't like a Batman comic when I was 9.

I got that duality was the main point of the movie and not an elaborate plot. I got that it was all about the connections between the principal 4 characters at age 9.

For the record I like this movie more now than I did back when I was 9 but that's probably because now I get even more out of it but the fundamentals were very transparent to me as a kid. Especially because it was a very simple and classic type of structure. It was like a 40's movie made in the 90's and I grew up on a lot of golden age cinema. That was also pretty much the Burton I knew by the time I had seen BR because by that point I had been watching his movies since Beetlejuice.

 

[Cain]

This movie is very Dickensian and that comes across to you easier if you read a lot of Dickens as a kid. Which was my situation.

Funnily enough it wasn't the only Batman movie to crib a lot of themes from Dickens. Nolan did the same especially with his last.

 

[Naked Shia]

I know Smith is a batman fanboy, and he seems like a nice guy, but he doesn't really get what makes batman special. I'm sorry, but he really doesn't. Anybody who read cacophony and Wydening Gyre can see hos it's true.

I like both stories, the same way I like all star batman or batman odyssey. They are awful crazy, daring, obscene, fun, enternaining, stupid and everything. But in no way are Kevin smith or Neal Adams understanding Batman in those stories (Miller is another story, he gets what is his batman at least ^^).

Which is why I don't care at all about his opinion when it comes to the movies. Also, I don't care for what celibrities think of stuffs actually. For instance, I don't care either for what Grant Morrison said about the BvS trailer, and Grant Morrison is still one of my favourite writers.

 

[regwec]

It depends who is giving their view and on what. I would always listen to Paul Dini, because he seems to get Batman as well as anyone alive. I discard the political ruminations of comedians and pop singers, however.