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This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]472849[/split]
Fantasy TV is now The Lord of the Rings!
Heroes are moving to the Movies sections!
#3, @ about the 6:30 mark here:
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Could've done without Jigsaw and The Thing in that list. I was never impressed with the make up for either character, but other than that a pretty good list.
7 Major Problems With Batman Returns
http://whatculture.com/film/7-major-problems-batman-returns.php/87. Just Where Is Batman?
http://whatculture.com/film/7-major-problems-batman-returns.php/2
6. The Stupidest Origin Story Of All Time
http://whatculture.com/film/7-major-problems-batman-returns.php/3
5. The Penguin
http://whatculture.com/film/7-major-problems-batman-returns.php/4
4. The Penguin Runs For Mayor
http://whatculture.com/film/7-major-problems-batman-returns.php/5
3. The Set Design
http://whatculture.com/film/7-major-problems-batman-returns.php/6
2. Did Batman Just Grin As He Blew That Guy Up?
http://whatculture.com/film/7-major-problems-batman-returns.php/7
1. Too Many Villains
http://whatculture.com/film/7-major-problems-batman-returns.php/8
7. This complaint doesn't hold much water. I remember Travesty did a screen time ratio of Batman appearances across all the films, and it's pretty much the same. In fact, the Burton films have more Batman screen time than the Nolan films. The Burton films are accused of sidelining Batman for the villains, but the statistics don't lie.
Look here: http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=335105
The other points raised are all subjective.
7. This complaint doesn't hold much water. I remember Travesty did a screen time ratio of Batman appearances across all the films, and it's pretty much the same. In fact, the Burton films have more Batman screen time than the Nolan films. The Burton films are accused of sidelining Batman for the villains, but the statistics don't lie.
Look here: http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=335105
The other points raised are all subjective.
The thing is there is a lot of focus on Bruce/Batman in terms of the story. To understand what I mean though you must first understand the cinematic language that Batman Returns speaks in; German Expressionism. Just because it doesn't "focus" on those characters in more conventional terms doesn't mean that it's not there. It just means that it likely went over your head.
There's a ton of crazy fan art for this movie.
However, I'd argue that the Bruce Wayne story arc and characterization in Batman 1989 was better and came across more clearly as the focus of the film, in spite of his limited dialogue and the Joker arc playing a huge role throughout the film. We were able to peel back the layers of Bruce in B89 through the dialogue of other characters and with that brief flashback. IMO, the focus on the character in B89 was a triumph in how to deliver a non-traditional origin story of a superhero (the opposite of what we saw in Batman Begins), whilst still completely capturing the essence of the character and hitting all the necessary beats.
Also, the most common criticism of BR from Batman fans is that it's a great Tim Burton movie/story, but not the greatest Batman film. That's something I can understand and even agree with.
This I can agree with though it is still just a matter of preference. I'm sure there are people out there who find a haunted and "trapped in the abyss of his own soul" Batman arc like the one in Returns more appealing. Especially since it's ground that isn't often explored with the character in most media.