Batman Returns The Official Batman Returns Thread - Part 4

[Kane52630]

http://kane52630.tumblr.com/post/147986685074/its-a-blur-not-complete-amnesia-i-remember

 

[AnneFan]

Sex and death.

 

[titansupes]

Never seen this one before:

 

[union_jak]

http://kane52630.tumblr.com/post/147986685074/its-a-blur-not-complete-amnesia-i-remember

Ricky Friedburg was supposed to be the rapist in the alley, right? The dry way she says he's dead, and the reference to his perversions directly following the scene where she stops a man raping a girl, is intentional, isn't it?

I mentioned this once before online and got shot down by people who said I read to much into it, but it doesn't take a genius to understand how film scenes are put together. They couldn't see a connection

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

Ricky Friedburg was supposed to be the rapist in the alley, right? The dry way she says he's dead, and the reference to his perversions directly following the scene where she stops a man raping a girl, is intentional, isn't it?

I mentioned this once before online and got shot down by people who said I read to much into it, but it doesn't take a genius to understand how film scenes are put together. They couldn't see a connection

I'm pretty sure that was the intention.

 

[antsman41]

Never seen this one before:

That is amazing.

Its crazy how many BTS photos are still in vault somewhere. You'd think, having this film and 89 in my life for every second of it, I'd had seen everything.

 

[Blitzkrieg Bop]

I never made the Ricky connection.

 

[TX85]

Me neither but that's cool if true

 

[Ponyboy]

Ricky Friedburg was supposed to be the rapist in the alley, right? The dry way she says he's dead, and the reference to his perversions directly following the scene where she stops a man raping a girl, is intentional, isn't it?

I always thought the guy in the alley was Ricky Freedburg as well. It was the "he's dead now" that kinda gave it away. If that wasn't Burton's intention I'd be surprised. Seems for Selina to mention an old dead classmate at random during that scene would be pretty strange.

 

[Drizzle]

Ricky Friedburg was supposed to be the rapist in the alley, right? The dry way she says he's dead, and the reference to his perversions directly following the scene where she stops a man raping a girl, is intentional, isn't it?

I mentioned this once before online and got shot down by people who said I read to much into it, but it doesn't take a genius to understand how film scenes are put together. They couldn't see a connection

She didn't kill that guy, though. She scratched up his face and knocked him out.

 

[Kane52630]

And did 6 backflips.

 

[union_jak]

She didn't kill that guy, though. She scratched up his face and knocked him out.

She stabbed him in both eyeballs. The following scene implies someone who was a peeping tom is now dead. We're supposed to read between the lines. Her delivery of the line 'He's dead now' implies she was responsible for it. We don't know what happened after she backflipped away, perhaps she finished the job off, perhaps he bled to death or ran in front of a car whilst blinded. Perhaps even Joan, the victim, felt empowered to kill him? We'll never know, it's down to interpretation. I'm grateful Burton didn't spoon feed us all the facts and let us form our own ideas. A lot of directors feel the audience NEED to see everything.

 

[Saint]

Ricky Friedburg was supposed to be the rapist in the alley, right? The dry way she says he's dead, and the reference to his perversions directly following the scene where she stops a man raping a girl, is intentional, isn't it?

I mentioned this once before online and got shot down by people who said I read to much into it, but it doesn't take a genius to understand how film scenes are put together. They couldn't see a connection

I honestly can't tell whether this is something you're reading too much into or not.

I was six when this movie came out--and like a lot of movies that you grow up watching, things that didn't register with you as a child, or that you interpreted in a childlike way, tend to stick with you. It can be really hard to break yourself of that and watch a film with fresh eyes.

My gut says you might be connecting the dots in a way not intended, but I can see both sides. I'll have to rewatch the film in the near future and judge for myself.

 

[titansupes]

She stabbed him in both eyeballs. The following scene implies someone who was a peeping tom is now dead. We're supposed to read between the lines. Her delivery of the line 'He's dead now' implies she was responsible for it. We don't know what happened after she backflipped away, perhaps she finished the job off, perhaps he bled to death or ran in front of a car whilst blinded. Perhaps even Joan, the victim, felt empowered to kill him? We'll never know, it's down to interpretation. I'm grateful Burton didn't spoon feed us all the facts and let us form our own ideas. A lot of directors feel the audience NEED to see everything.

All due respect-- This is... just not the case. If it were, what you'd be describing is bad filmmaking.

The Ricky scene is simply to highlight how different and schizophrenic Selina's become. How the men in the room are not prepared for someone like her. It shows Max just how much more assertive she is, how ballsy she is for coming back to him. It magnetizes Bruce by showing him how confident and playful, yet damaged and dark she is, something Bruce can relate to. It becomes all the more extreme as the movie goes on (the costume ball for instance). Is also shows that she's had problems with men getting one over her since she was a child (from Ricky to the boyfriend on the answering machine, to Shreck and the stun gun clown, to Penguin and Batman).

The alley way scene, in which she saves a scared and weak woman being pinned against a wall by a thuggish man, is a mirror to Selina herself being in that situation earlier-- the stun gun clown attacking, her wailing... Batman saving. She used to be the victimized girl who had to wait for some Batman to save her. But no more. Now she can save herself. It's not entirely virtuous of course-- she intimidates the girl in the alley because she recognizes that that's how she used to be and despises it.

Also-- She doesn't stab him in the eyes. Literally nothing indicates that. It looks, sounds and acts like a punch... And no filmmaker would imply Catwoman's going to finish the job by showing her leaving the scene. And there's also nothing to indicate that the girl somehow got brazen enough (after being terrified by the man and then Catwoman herself) to do anything either. Also, of course, no indication that he ran in front of a car.

That guy ain't no Ricky. Nor was the stun gun clown, which is another theory I heard bandied about a few years ago.

 

[DocLathropBrown]

All due respect-- This is... just not the case. If it were, what you'd be describing is bad filmmaking.

The Ricky scene is simply to highlight how different and schizophrenic Selina's become. How the men in the room are not prepared for someone like her. It shows Max just how much more assertive she is, how ballsy she is for coming back to him. It magnetizes Bruce by showing him how confident and playful, yet damaged and dark she is, something Bruce can relate to. It becomes all the more extreme as the movie goes on (the costume ball for instance). Is also shows that she's had problems with men getting one over her since she was a child (from Ricky to the boyfriend on the answering machine, to Shreck and the stun gun clown, to Penguin and Batman).

The alley way scene, in which she saves a scared and weak woman being pinned against a wall by a thuggish man, is a mirror to Selina herself being in that situation earlier-- the stun gun clown attacking, her wailing... Batman saving. She used to be the victimized girl who had to wait for some Batman to save her. But no more. Now she can save herself. It's not entirely virtuous of course-- she intimidates the girl in the alley because she recognizes that that's how she used to be and despises it.

Also-- She doesn't stab him in the eyes. Literally nothing indicates that. It looks, sounds and acts like a punch... And no filmmaker would imply Catwoman's going to finish the job by showing her leaving the scene. And there's also nothing to indicate that the girl somehow got brazen enough (after being terrified by the man and then Catwoman herself) to do anything either. Also, of course, no indication that he ran in front of a car.

That guy ain't no Ricky. Nor was the stun gun clown, which is another theory I heard bandied about a few years ago.

Here here!

Reading between the lines is my specialty (I wrote a book reading between B89's lines, for cryin' out loud), and that Ricky Freidberg theory is realllly stretching.

 

[Drizzle]

All due respect-- This is... just not the case. If it were, what you'd be describing is bad filmmaking.

The Ricky scene is simply to highlight how different and schizophrenic Selina's become. How the men in the room are not prepared for someone like her. It shows Max just how much more assertive she is, how ballsy she is for coming back to him. It magnetizes Bruce by showing him how confident and playful, yet damaged and dark she is, something Bruce can relate to. It becomes all the more extreme as the movie goes on (the costume ball for instance). Is also shows that she's had problems with men getting one over her since she was a child (from Ricky to the boyfriend on the answering machine, to Shreck and the stun gun clown, to Penguin and Batman).

The alley way scene, in which she saves a scared and weak woman being pinned against a wall by a thuggish man, is a mirror to Selina herself being in that situation earlier-- the stun gun clown attacking, her wailing... Batman saving. She used to be the victimized girl who had to wait for some Batman to save her. But no more. Now she can save herself. It's not entirely virtuous of course-- she intimidates the girl in the alley because she recognizes that that's how she used to be and despises it.

Also-- She doesn't stab him in the eyes. Literally nothing indicates that. It looks, sounds and acts like a punch... And no filmmaker would imply Catwoman's going to finish the job by showing her leaving the scene. And there's also nothing to indicate that the girl somehow got brazen enough (after being terrified by the man and then Catwoman herself) to do anything either. Also, of course, no indication that he ran in front of a car.

That guy ain't no Ricky. Nor was the stun gun clown, which is another theory I heard bandied about a few years ago.

 

[DCW]

I never thought the guy in the alley was Friedburg and I don't think she did anything more that scratch him and knock him out with a punch.

It's been a while since I've watched Returns though, I'm curious to see the scene again after reading this conversation.

 

[Sawyer]

Burton's Gotham is pure sex and I will full-on slap anyone who says otherwise.

 

[Elevator Man]

The winter atmosphere really separates it from other Batman movies (aside from TDKR).

 

[Kane52630]

 

[Ponyboy]

^Almost looks like a poster that would be in Nintendo Power or something

 

[DaRkVeNgeanCe]

I would love to know the artist that did that amazing piece of art.

 

[TMC1982]

DANIEL WATERS ON 'BATMAN RETURNS'

We covered working with Tim Burton, Dan's vision for the film, being rewritten, his love of the Catwoman character and what went down with the spin-off movie that never happened.

 

[Ponyboy]

Here's some cool stuff from The Art of John Alvin

 

[Kane52630]

Here's some cool stuff from The Art of John Alvin

Spoiler

Would love to hang that on my wall.