The Piracy Threat...?

[Figs]

I'm not arguing about human nature or people wanting things for free. I'm arguing that illegal downloads aren't a bad thing. Album sales fluxuate up and down all the time. To say it's all because of illegal downloads is not accurate.

Actually, upon reading some sites, LEGAL downloads are to blame for the album slump.

I don't think it's all because of illegal downloads. My main arguement is that if no one does anything about it, it will just get worse over time.

 

[Figs]

Yes, that's what I meant by movie industry 'bees'.

See that’s the kind of attitude that needs to change if you want to exterminate piracy and make way for a legal system of fast and easily accessible distribution. If you couldn’t care less for the people who can’t afford the things you take for granted than you know how the people who download movies couldn’t care less about the film industry feel.

The "smaller" people who work in the film industry, set designers, costume, etc. are busting their ass and not getting paid nearly as much as any actors or directors. They are the people who get hurt in the long run, this isn't about some bumb who decides to be lazy and not try to be succesful, or just blows all of his money on crap. Those kind of people I don't have pity for because it's their fault if there not trying to move up in the world to make more money/success.

The so called "little people" in film are working hard for what they want. A lot of times that's a great place to start if you eventually want to direct or even act in the industry. There trying at least, and they shouldn't be screwed over by people too cheap and poor that can't rightfully pay for the product.

It's the ignorance of those lazy types that think there only hurting multi millionaires.

 

[jks]

I'm not arguing about human nature or people wanting things for free. I'm arguing that illegal downloads aren't a bad thing. Album sales fluxuate up and down all the time. To say it's all because of illegal downloads is not accurate.

Then explain why album sales haven't reached where they were prior to 1999ish when napster first came into existence....

Actually, upon reading some sites, LEGAL downloads are to blame for the album slump.

Insane....absolutely insane. You're sitting there honestly trying to on one hand say that people dloading something for free doesn't hurt sales, yet people dloading from pay sites does? Can you not see the inherent flaw in that statement?

 

[bell110]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18220349/

Album sales decline as downloads are up
Online purchases, fewer big releases cited for 17 percent drop this year

LOS ANGELES - U.S. album sales are down 17 percent so far this year, a downward spiral caused in part by a surge in online music purchases and fewer big-name albums being released in the first quarter.

A total of 135.8 million albums were sold in the U.S. through the end of last week, compared to 163.3 million in the year-ago period, according to Nielsen SoundScan.
The number of digital tracks sold, meanwhile, jumped 53 percent to 250.8 million compared to 164.2 million in the same period last year, the firm said.
The shortfall in album sales drops to 10.5 percent when sales of digital singles are counted as 10-track equivalent albums.
"It's not making up totally for the decline, but at least it's able to account for some of the decline in sales," said Chris Muratore, vice president of retail relations for Nielsen Entertainment.
Still, overall music sales are up by more than 17 percent, but that figure includes all albums, singles, music videos and digital downloads.
The recording industry has seen CD album sales decline for years, in part due to the rise of online file-sharing, but also as consumers have spent more of their leisure dollars on other entertainment purchases, such as DVDs and video games.
The industry has benefited from sources of revenue that were not around just a few years ago, such as mobile phone music sales.
So far this year, more than 72 million ringtones have been purchased by mobile phone users, according to Nielsen RingScan, which began tracking the sector last fall.
One factor in the decline of album sales is that record labels have cut back on the number of new album releases by major artists early in the calendar year.
"If you look at the last couple of years, fewer and fewer of those acts have been released in the first half of the year and this year has been horrible," Muratore said. "It's proven that if you put something out, an established name, a big name, people are going to go buy the music."
Crooner Norah Jones and country singer Tim McGraw are the biggest acts to release new albums this year, he said.
Jones' album, "Not Too Late," has sold about 1.2 million copies so far this year, while McGraw's "Let It Go," has sold 570,000, according to SoundScan.
Fall Out Boy's album "Infinity On High," has sold around 760,000 copies, the firm said.
The other top sellers this year have been albums released last year by the likes of Justin Timberlake, Daughtry, and Akon.
Last year's biggest-selling album, the soundtrack inspired by the Disney Channel movie "High School Musical," was released in the month of January. It sold more than 3.7 million copies.
"Six out of the past seven years, the No. 1 album was released no later than May," Muratore said.

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So even though album sale are down, overall, music sales are up. And illegal downloads have very little to do with it.

 

[BlackLantern]

Yes, that's what I meant by movie industry 'bees'.

See that’s the kind of attitude that needs to change if you want to exterminate piracy and make way for a legal system of fast and easily accessible distribution. If you couldn’t care less for the people who can’t afford the things you take for granted than you know how those people feel who download movies couldn’t care less about the film industry.

I don't take it for granted...when I want to go see a movie I pay for my ticket, If I want to buy a game I pay for it. I'm very fortunate to have a nice job that allows me to indulge in my leisure activites. not to repeat myself..but Universal Music cut close to 2,000 jobs because the amount of Cd's they used to sell dropped by almost 40 percent in a years time....People have this cavalier attitude about how the CEO's and actors that are wealthy but neglect to think about the secretaries, wardrobe people, and sound techs...you're trying to make it sound like its their fault for choosing to work in that industry and that they deserve to lose their jobs because you don't feel you should have to pay for your movie....

 

[Trevor Goodchild]

FigmanJ, I have the impression that you just walked in mid conversation and got the wrong idea of what I am trying to say. And BlackLantern, you still don’t get it.
As much as I can say about myself, I want to pay for the entertainment that I want to get. But I still can’t get it because I have no access to it. And you’re disregarding me simply because I live in another country. I could be making more money than you for all you know, I should have equal access to what you get but I still don’t.
It’s not only an American issue, it’s an international one.

 

[BlackLantern]

FigmanJ, I have the impression that you just walked in mid conversation and got the wrong idea of what I am trying to say. And BlackLantern, you still don’t get it.
As much as I can say about myself, I want to pay for the entertainment that I want to get. But I still can’t get it because I have no access to it. And you’re disregarding me simply because I live in another country. I could be making more money than you for all you know, I should have equal access to what you get but I still don’t.
It’s not only an American issue, it’s an international one.

You should huh? According to who....? You want entertainment, you don't need it. US films are US product. I don't really care how much you make, for the record

 

[jks]

A total of 135.8 million albums were sold in the U.S. through the end of last week, compared to 163.3 million in the year-ago period, according to Nielsen SoundScan.
The number of digital tracks sold, meanwhile, jumped 53 percent to 250.8 million compared to 164.2 million in the same period last year, the firm said.

Even if the 250.8 million tracks were albums, that added to the 135.8 million in actual album sales doesn't remotely come close to the 711 million in 1998....right before illegal downloading became prevailant. You still have to account for the other 54% of sales that are gone.

 

[Figs]

FigmanJ, I have the impression that you just walked in mid conversation and got the wrong idea of what I am trying to say. And BlackLantern, you still don’t get it.
As much as I can say about myself, I want to pay for the entertainment that I want to get. But I still can’t get it because I have no access to it. And you’re disregarding me simply because I live in another country. I could be making more money than you for all you know, I should have equal access to what you get but I still don’t.
It’s not only an American issue, it’s an international one.

Actually if you look back some pages, I was posting in this discussion before you brought in your opinion. I guess I somewhat misunderstood you is all, sorry. I just had some responses to what I read in your opinions.

 

[BlackLantern]

Even if the 250.8 million tracks were albums, that added to the 135.8 million in actual album sales doesn't remotely come close to the 711 million in 1998....right before illegal downloading became prevailant. You still have to account for the other 54% of sales that are gone.

Cost cutting by record companies across the board. usually jobs.

 

[Trevor Goodchild]

You should huh? According to who....? You want entertainment, you don't need it. US films are US product.

Ah well, if you put it this way, imagining that you speak for all Americans, you deserve to be stolen from.
Come on, how egotistical and hypocritical can you be. Here I am, saying that I want to take part into your capitalism and democracy and I am willing to pay for it as much as you do and yet you spit on me like so.

 

[jks]

what does that have to do with why consumers arent buying albums as much as the pre-file sharing era?

Cost cutting by record companies across the board. usually jobs.

 

[Trevor Goodchild]

Actually if you look back some pages, I was posting in this discussion before you brought in your opinion. I guess I somewhat misunderstood you is all, sorry. I just had some responses to what I read in your opinions.

That's fine man, I'm guilty of not reading every single page in here anyway.

 

[BlackLantern]

what does that have to do with why consumers arent buying albums as much as the pre-file sharing era?

well if a business isnt making as much money as it used to....and that happens consistently....that business has to figure out how to operate using less money and less personnel....

 

[BlackLantern]

Ah well, if you put it this way, imagining that you speak for all Americans, you deserve to be stolen from.
Come on, how egotistical and hypocritical can you be. Here I am, saying that I want to take part into your capitalism and democracy and I am willing to pay for it as much as you do and yet you spit on me like so.

I don't speak for all Americans and never claimed I did, and no...just because you think someone should be stolen either because you feel they are rich enough or are just an ***hole from doesn't justify it. Like I said before...you are not ENTITLED to enterainment...

 

[Trevor Goodchild]

I don't speak for all Americans and never claimed I did, and no...just because you think someone should be stolen either because you feel they are rich enough or are just an ***hole from doesn't justify it.

Yes, I know, I was being sarcastic.

Like I said before...you are not ENTITLED to enterainment...

And who are you to say what I am and am not entitled to?
People create their own demand and what is demanded should be supplied.

 

[Figs]

Yes, I know, I was being sarcastic.


And who are you to say what I am and am not entitled to?
People create their own demand and what is demanded should be supplied.

It's not really BlackLantern that is saying what people can and can't be entitled to. He's stating a general rule of life. It's not a necessity to have entertainment.

 

[BlackLantern]

Yes, I know, I was being sarcastic.


And who are you to say what I am and am not entitled to?
People create their own demand and what is demanded should be supplied.

so if I demand kiddy porn...should that be afforded to me because I demanded it?

 

[BlackLantern]

It's not really BlackLantern that is saying what people can and can't be entitled to. He's stating a general rule of life. It's not a necessity to have entertainment.

^^Basically...lots of people today don't understand that.

 

[Trevor Goodchild]

so if I demand kiddy porn...should that be afforded to me because I demanded it?

Legal stuff of course, dummy. And movies are not cocaine.

It's not really BlackLantern that is saying what people can and can't be entitled to. He's stating a general rule of life. It's not a necessity to have entertainment.

It's not a necessity to drink alcohol or kill for food and yet you wouldn’t miss out on your juicy stake and beer now, would you?
Yes, you’re right, it’s not essential for survival but as I said - it’s human nature. People want to experience what other people do and most often can’t do without once they did. It’s human psychology. And people around the world are trying to facilitate that. They share. If all movie companies would’ve been just as an ***hole as BlackLantern is, they would’ve got 90% less income than they do now. They share for profit, like smart businessmen do.
All I’m trying to say is that it’s no wonder that people are resorting to stealing. It’s not as much as greed as it is envy. And as I see it, piracy will still exist world wide until entertainment business progresses till the point where all movies and music, not just the most popular or profitable ones, can be brought world wide, through the internet or otherwise, just as soon as it becomes available in their country of origin.

 

[bell110]

Even if the 250.8 million tracks were albums, that added to the 135.8 million in actual album sales doesn't remotely come close to the 711 million in 1998....right before illegal downloading became prevailant. You still have to account for the other 54% of sales that are gone.

Where did you get those numbers? I'm looking and can't find anything that says the music sales dropped because of online file sharing. Actually, it's quite the opposite.

 

[BlackLantern]

It's not necessity to drink alcohol or kill for food and yet you wouldn’t miss out on your juicy stake and beer now, would you?
Yes, you’re right, it’s not essential for survivor but as I said - it’s human nature. People want to experience what other people do and most often can’t do without once they did. It’s human psychology. And people around the world are trying to facilitate that. They share. If all movie companies would’ve been just as an ***hole as BlackLantern is, they would’ve got 90% less income than they do now. They share for profit, like smart businessmen do.
All I’m trying to say is that it’s no wonder that people are resorting to stealing. It’s not as much as greed as it is envy. And as I see it, piracy will still exist world wide until entertainment business progresses till the point where all movies and music, not just the most popular or profitable ones, can be brought world wide, through the internet or otherwise, just as soon as it becomes available in their country of origin.

All of this has nothing to do with me.....so why should I care?....Convince me why I should be concerned with people that don't have access to quality entertainment and are stealing to get it....I'll wait

 

[Kelly]

Legal stuff of course, dummy. And movies are not cocaine.


It's not a necessity to drink alcohol or kill for food and yet you wouldn’t miss out on your juicy stake and beer now, would you?
Yes, you’re right, it’s not essential for survival but as I said - it’s human nature. People want to experience what other people do and most often can’t do without once they did. It’s human psychology. And people around the world are trying to facilitate that. They share. If all movie companies would’ve been just as an ***hole as BlackLantern is, they would’ve got 90% less income than they do now. They share for profit, like smart businessmen do.
All I’m trying to say is that it’s no wonder that people are resorting to stealing. It’s not as much as greed as it is envy. And as I see it, piracy will still exist world wide until entertainment business progresses till the point where all movies and music, not just the most popular or profitable ones, can be brought world wide, through the internet or otherwise, just as soon as it becomes available in their country of origin.

Did they steal the beer and steaks? If they did they are as big of thiefs as those that pirate movies and music....
Silly comparison...

Has nothing to do with necessity, it has everything to do with the law, and the people who are actually getting hit in the pocket book....

 

[Trevor Goodchild]

All of this has nothing to do with me.....so why should I care?....Convince me why I should be concerned with people that don't have access to quality entertainment and are stealing to get it....I'll wait

Wow, you're so hilariously hypocritical, like a real live caricature.
So why do you care for the movie crews so much? Pirates think they have nothing to do with them either. And, don’t you see, you share their mentality. All you care is about your own self and your own surroundings. Damn, even Hollywood is smarter than you.
I’m saying that you, as a movie company CEO, let’s imagine, should care for the people who want to pay for the entertainment that you are providing. The costumer is always right. As in my previous post, I put forward a project that could passively reduce piracy, instead of wasting money on a manhunt. There are other, more constructive options than that.
Stop all the hatin'! Violence is not the answer!

 

[Trevor Goodchild]

Did they steal the beer and steaks? If they did they are as big of thiefs as those that pirate movies and music....
Silly comparison...
Has nothing to do with necessity, it has everything to do with the law, and the people who are actually getting hit in the pocket book....

Again, I'm not advocating theives, I'm defending the demand, those two parties should be distinct.
Sorry for the double post.