Thundarr
Superhero
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This thread is to discuss all the Punisher movies: past, present, and future. I want to see opinions on the Dulph Lundgren and Thomas Jane versions, on Punisher: War Zone, and on where they take it from here.
The Punisher 1989 (starring Dulph Lundgren and Louis Gossett Jr.)
This movie sucked beyond all belief. Everything about it was terrible. About the only nice thing I can say about it is the action scenes were pretty damn cool. But everything else? Casting, writing, wardrobe, the whole thing stank to high heaven. I hardly know where to begin. I guess with casting.
Dulph Lundgren is one of the worst actors in all of Hollywood. He doesn't even look anything like The Punisher, at least from the neck up (I must admit, he does have the body for the role). Lou Gossett Jr. was fine as Frank Castle's best friend, but his character never existed in the comic books. Everyone else wasn't so badly cast, but since most of them wind up dead it really doesn't matter much.
Now the writing. I highly doubt whoever wrote that piece of crap had ever read a Punisher comic, except to maybe get the names of a few key players. To begin with, they made Frank Castle an ex-cop not an ex-marine. Secondly, they made the deaths of Frank's wife and kids the result of a car bomb where he was the target due to his job rather than just being in the wrong place at the wrong time. I guess they thought that this would make the vendetta more personal and make for a better story (completely unnecessary, having his wife and kids shot for witnessing a mob execution is personal enough). Third, in the comics Frank had a boy and a girl, but in the movie it was two girls. And finally, they wrote the Punisher as being an urban legend in the underworld. A myth that nobody really believes. That's just stupid.
As for wardrobe, they didn't have The Punisher wearing his skull symbol anywhere on his body, except for on the pommels of his knives. While I certainly agree with the decision not to put him in the black spandex tights The Punisher wears in the comics, they could have at least put the skull on the back of his leather jacket or something.
The Punisher 2004 (starring Thomas Jane and John Revolta)
I liked this movie way more than the first. It wasn't perfect by any means, but it was much closer than Dulph Lundgren's was to keeping with the true spirit of the comics.
First, I liked that they used several characters and scenes from the comics. Things like Spacker Dave having his piercings pulled out by a wiseguy, Mr. Bumpo, The Punisher's fight with The Russian, etc. And unlike in the first movie, The Punisher was wearing the skull symbol on his chest. They also came up with a story of the meaning behind it. They even made reference to his military background. Unfortunately, they made many of the same mistakes that were made in the first movie.
They once again made Frank Castle connected to law enforcement, this time as a deap cover operative for the FBI. They made the killing of Frank's family a targetted assassination, this time his mom and dad as well as his aunts, uncles, cousins, and inlaws in addition to his wife and kids. And this time he only had one kid, his son, rather than a boy and a girl. Again, I think this was done to make his vendetta against the mob more personal, and again I think it was totally unnecessary. The execution of your wife and kids is personal enough. And while Thomas Jane is a far better actor than Dulph Lundgren, he's still not quite right for the role. And I just am not a John Revolta fan.
The Punisher: War Zone 2008
FINALLY! Finally someone in Hollywood got it right! They started with Frank Castle aleady in his role as The Punisher. They found an actor who looks just like the drawings in the comics (at least in the face, I think the movie would have been a little better if we could've seen how buff The Punisher is). He was wearing his skull symbol. They got the names and genders of Frank's wife and kids right. They made Frank an ex-marine (though they changed it to being a Special Forces instructor rather than a marine on medical leave after being shot up in Vietnam, but I can forgive that). They introduced the character of Jigsaw (again, they made a slight change to how he became Jigsaw, he was originally thrown through a plate glass window, but I can forgive that). They also had Micro as his helper, Detective Soap, and other characters from the comic. And he was using a S&W500, which was totally cool (Dirty Harry, eat your heart out!). The only thing I really didn't like was his body armour. It looked too cumbersome. He looked more like he was on his way to disarm a bomb than to go out and shoot some bad guys. I also didn't like that they killed off Micro and Jigsaw. Jigsaw was always The Punisher's nemesis, that one villain he can never seem to kill. They should have kept him around for a possible sequel, or at least "kill him off" in a way where it's possible he might survive.
As for future Punisher movies? I'd like to see an adaptation of The Punisher vs Baracuda. That would be awsome! But just continue the story from where it left off, not a whole new retelling of The Punisher's origins.
The Punisher 1989 (starring Dulph Lundgren and Louis Gossett Jr.)
This movie sucked beyond all belief. Everything about it was terrible. About the only nice thing I can say about it is the action scenes were pretty damn cool. But everything else? Casting, writing, wardrobe, the whole thing stank to high heaven. I hardly know where to begin. I guess with casting.
Dulph Lundgren is one of the worst actors in all of Hollywood. He doesn't even look anything like The Punisher, at least from the neck up (I must admit, he does have the body for the role). Lou Gossett Jr. was fine as Frank Castle's best friend, but his character never existed in the comic books. Everyone else wasn't so badly cast, but since most of them wind up dead it really doesn't matter much.
Now the writing. I highly doubt whoever wrote that piece of crap had ever read a Punisher comic, except to maybe get the names of a few key players. To begin with, they made Frank Castle an ex-cop not an ex-marine. Secondly, they made the deaths of Frank's wife and kids the result of a car bomb where he was the target due to his job rather than just being in the wrong place at the wrong time. I guess they thought that this would make the vendetta more personal and make for a better story (completely unnecessary, having his wife and kids shot for witnessing a mob execution is personal enough). Third, in the comics Frank had a boy and a girl, but in the movie it was two girls. And finally, they wrote the Punisher as being an urban legend in the underworld. A myth that nobody really believes. That's just stupid.
As for wardrobe, they didn't have The Punisher wearing his skull symbol anywhere on his body, except for on the pommels of his knives. While I certainly agree with the decision not to put him in the black spandex tights The Punisher wears in the comics, they could have at least put the skull on the back of his leather jacket or something.
The Punisher 2004 (starring Thomas Jane and John Revolta)
I liked this movie way more than the first. It wasn't perfect by any means, but it was much closer than Dulph Lundgren's was to keeping with the true spirit of the comics.
First, I liked that they used several characters and scenes from the comics. Things like Spacker Dave having his piercings pulled out by a wiseguy, Mr. Bumpo, The Punisher's fight with The Russian, etc. And unlike in the first movie, The Punisher was wearing the skull symbol on his chest. They also came up with a story of the meaning behind it. They even made reference to his military background. Unfortunately, they made many of the same mistakes that were made in the first movie.
They once again made Frank Castle connected to law enforcement, this time as a deap cover operative for the FBI. They made the killing of Frank's family a targetted assassination, this time his mom and dad as well as his aunts, uncles, cousins, and inlaws in addition to his wife and kids. And this time he only had one kid, his son, rather than a boy and a girl. Again, I think this was done to make his vendetta against the mob more personal, and again I think it was totally unnecessary. The execution of your wife and kids is personal enough. And while Thomas Jane is a far better actor than Dulph Lundgren, he's still not quite right for the role. And I just am not a John Revolta fan.
The Punisher: War Zone 2008
FINALLY! Finally someone in Hollywood got it right! They started with Frank Castle aleady in his role as The Punisher. They found an actor who looks just like the drawings in the comics (at least in the face, I think the movie would have been a little better if we could've seen how buff The Punisher is). He was wearing his skull symbol. They got the names and genders of Frank's wife and kids right. They made Frank an ex-marine (though they changed it to being a Special Forces instructor rather than a marine on medical leave after being shot up in Vietnam, but I can forgive that). They introduced the character of Jigsaw (again, they made a slight change to how he became Jigsaw, he was originally thrown through a plate glass window, but I can forgive that). They also had Micro as his helper, Detective Soap, and other characters from the comic. And he was using a S&W500, which was totally cool (Dirty Harry, eat your heart out!). The only thing I really didn't like was his body armour. It looked too cumbersome. He looked more like he was on his way to disarm a bomb than to go out and shoot some bad guys. I also didn't like that they killed off Micro and Jigsaw. Jigsaw was always The Punisher's nemesis, that one villain he can never seem to kill. They should have kept him around for a possible sequel, or at least "kill him off" in a way where it's possible he might survive.
As for future Punisher movies? I'd like to see an adaptation of The Punisher vs Baracuda. That would be awsome! But just continue the story from where it left off, not a whole new retelling of The Punisher's origins.
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