BvS The Superman Suit Thread - Part 4

[Lencho01]

Alright folks, I think it's time to stop talking about the Superman Returns and the failed Burton suit. What's done is done. Let's stick to the BVS suit. You don't see the Batman suit thread bring up the Burton and Shumacher suits all the time. Though they tend to bask the TDK suit here and there.

Or just ignore those parts of the discussion.

 

[slumcat]

I think the MOS suit did not "cling" as well to the under-structure (be it Cavill or muscle suit) as the BvS suit seems to... especially in the Abs area.

The center line of the outer suit "bridges" over the Abs cut and makes the Abs seem oddly shaped/mechanical... a little.

The BvS suits, including Batman's, seem to have addressed this and the Abs look much more natural, even if VERY well developed. Prob. glued it down the center in some way.

you're welcome ladies...

And by the way... Note the arm "veins". For those who said that could not show through. It can with the right lighting and shadows...

No, not the white shirt seams.

I see what you are saying. There does exist material today that can contour to the body and show all the muscle definition as well, much of it is commercially available. But you would have to be in absolutely ridiculous shape to be able to do that, like in bodybuilder shape.

Cavill could pull off that look at his peak but the trouble is obviously the maintenance. I mean he gets to his super-shredded state for a couple of days to weeks tops to film his shirtless scenes. After that he remains buff but not necessarily Superman shredded. So if they ditch the muscle suit and have Cavill provide them muscle definition himself, Cavill would have to stay in shirtless shape for 10 months, the time it takes to shoot the film. That's just too demanding.

I think the sculpted superman suit coupled with a shirtless scene is a good compromise. Cavill gets the benefit of a more manageable training schedule for all the superman suit scenes while still having the opportunity to show the audience his superman physique in a scene or two.

Staying in that good of a shape for that long would be a challenge few actors would be up to.

 

[souperman]

Absolutely. I have always said that the muscle suit /under suit is mostly there for continuity purposes, exactly for the fluctuations in physique over time/sequels etc.

In other films where the actor is not in that kind of physical shape the suit can be padded or a CG body added/enhanced.

As you noted, the shirtless scenes are there to reinforce the idea that it is all real.

Tho those "could be" faked as well...

 

[matt47]

Still wished the suit looked like this in the movie.

 

[theotherme]

^ yeah, I'm not sure any actor could do that under the demands and duration of a modern CBM shooting schedule. Cavill mentioned in a recent interview that the calorie depravation required to get to that "shirtless" state means he has to be careful not to get too grumpy or bad tempered on set. So if someone generally considered very nice is worrying about that, lol, i imagine a set could be quite a nightmare if you had a bunch of starving actors running around trying to shoot 14 hour days.

 

[DlAMONDZ]

If you watch the Superman Lives documentary, the story of how whenever anyone would question Singer on the SR suit, he'd get one of his assistants or whoever to bust out the unflattering Nic Cage pic where he's blinking and be like, "This was what you were going to make."

Seemed he used it as some way to make them feel guilty and/or stupid for saying anything negative about his SR choices.

To build one's self up, it's best to knock someone else down. t:

at Singer criticizing other peoples costumes

 

[Lencho01]

Still wished the suit looked like this in the movie.

What are the major differences?

 

[matt47]

Only the muscle definition.

 

[souperman]

I don't think it is any different, just different lighting situations and shadows... That's why body building competitions use harsh overhead light, to accentuate the depth of the shadows and muscle cuts.
In flat light they look almost normal...
Almost

Again, they need to exaggerate it a bit to have it show at all in some light and fast action. We are dicecting still images that were never intended to be freeze framed.

I think the suit will look great overall...

 

[matt47]

But if you look at the night time shots in the trailer the abs are very different.

 

[souperman]

I'll look again but I suspect it is just the lighting or maybe they made a mid film adjustment for some reason that we were not supposed to notice!

 

[souperman]

edit

 

[souperman]

Just looked again. Looks the same to me, allowing for the angle and lighting.

Now hush up or you'll get a fresh one... like this...

or this...

 

[storyteller]

Or just ignore those parts of the discussion.

Easier said then done when it goes on for pages. Just because you can ignore something doesn't mean it's alright.

 

[MydnightPhoenix]

If you don't want to take part in the discussion you just don't take part. Leave and come back when the topic is something you want to talk about; but why try to end a conversation you don't like but that numerous others are taking part in?

 

[souperman]

Easier said then done when it goes on for pages. Just because you can ignore something doesn't mean it's alright.

...I think we are comparing historical renditions of the suit and comparing in a good humored way. No harm in my book.

unless you want to discuss Kryptonian thread count?

Anyone decipher those symbols on the suit yet?

 

[slumcat]

^ yeah, I'm not sure any actor could do that under the demands and duration of a modern CBM shooting schedule.

Only actor to successfully do that is Gerard Butler in Snyder's 300. He had to shoot the movie for 3 months while maintaining his condition and there was absolutely no costume to hide behind. He was basically constantly training. Any time they were setting up the shot, he was pumping. And before every "Action!" he was pumping.
But yeah, it's one of a kind thing, you can do it for a role of lifetime. You can't do it over 6-7 movies over a 10-15 year period.

 

[slumcat]

I don't think it is any different, just different lighting situations and shadows... That's why body building competitions use harsh overhead light, to accentuate the depth of the shadows and muscle cuts.
In flat light they look almost normal...
Almost

Again, they need to exaggerate it a bit to have it show at all in some light and fast action. We are dicecting still images that were never intended to be freeze framed.

I think the suit will look great overall...

There are going to be scenes in the movie where he is standing still. So the suit would have to look good for those shots. But I agree, it looks best in motion. Its kinda where the anatomy of it comes to life, it looks the most organic and lifelike in motion.

 

[Lencho01]

Easier said then done when it goes on for pages. Just because you can ignore something doesn't mean it's alright.

Not really. Just ignore it and talk about something else.

 

[hafizbat]

Only actor to successfully do that is Gerard Butler in Snyder's 300. He had to shoot the movie for 3 months while maintaining his condition and there was absolutely no costume to hide behind. He was basically constantly training. Any time they were setting up the shot, he was pumping. And before every "Action!" he was pumping.
But yeah, it's one of a kind thing, you can do it for a role of lifetime. You can't do it over 6-7 movies over a 10-15 year period.

I'd say it depends on the person. If it's an actor who is into the fitness lifestyle and would have a strong/big body regardless of the role, then it could be sustained for as many movies as needed. I think Cavill could definitely sustain his great shape for a long time if he stays with it. He seems to enjoy it, which is great. Also, the gains don't just disappear, with each movie his muscle mass and conditioning should be better, unless he completely lets himself go between roles.

 

[Rowsdower!]

That's funny.

Compare yourself to the lowest denominator...

"Hey, I could have given you this crap, but I decided to be nice and give you mediocre instead."

Oh well. As I've said. SR was OK. Fun as an ending for Donners versions.

Could have been much better with a better suit, better Lois, (was ok), better story, better direction and no kid! Funny scene but with the kid, I feel they were painted them into a corner. Was there any talk of where they would go story wise IF SR got a sequel?

Yeah, there was an early version of the script that had a mysterious Kryptonian come to Earth and befriend Superman. They pal around for a while until Supes realizes this other guy is no good and he's eventually revealed to be Brainiac. Brainiac then possesses Superman's own son, and Superman is forced to kill him. No, I'm not kidding.

Now, granted, that was an early version of the script, so who knows if that would have made it into the final version. But, like that *****ey story about Singer throwing the Superman Lives costume in everyone's face, doesn't surprise me. I remember reading some interviews with Singer during the production of SR and the guy just seemed to think like the film and all of his ideas were absolutely brilliant. I got the impression that anyone who tried to run different ideas past him just got immediately shot down. His ego really seemed to be at its peak in those days.

 

[souperman]

Interesting , thanks...

 

[sf2]

Yeah, there was an early version of the script that had a mysterious Kryptonian come to Earth and befriend Superman. They pal around for a while until Supes realizes this other guy is no good and he's eventually revealed to be Brainiac. Brainiac then possesses Superman's own son, and Superman is forced to kill him. No, I'm not kidding.

Now, granted, that was an early version of the script, so who knows if that would have made it into the final version. But, like that *****ey story about Singer throwing the Superman Lives costume in everyone's face, doesn't surprise me. I remember reading some interviews with Singer during the production of SR and the guy just seemed to think like the film and all of his ideas were absolutely brilliant. I got the impression that anyone who tried to run different ideas past him just got immediately shot down. His ego really seemed to be at its peak in those days.

indeed. if not mistaken, i read somewhere (bluetights forum?) where his crews commented to him that the climate (superman fighting an island) wasn't impressive but they were immediately berated. sorta.

 

[Defacto]

Being a huge Tim Burton's Superman Lives fan, I got to set this straight to anyone who hasn't seen the documentary yet. THIS was an EARLY EARLY suit test shoot. THIS was NOT going to be the final product, and by throwing it out there like it would prove how ****** Superman Lives was going to be, is invalid! That is all.

 

[MydnightPhoenix]

Being a huge Tim Burton's Superman Lives fan, I got to set this straight to anyone who hasn't seen the documentary yet. THIS was an EARLY EARLY suit test shoot. THIS was NOT going to be the final product, and by throwing it out there like it would prove how ****** Superman Lives was going to be, is invalid! That is all.

Well for me it was obvious it wasn't thr final product, but it's still no excuse imo. For me the worst thing about Superman Lives is Nicholas Cage as Superman. How the heck couLD anyone think that was a good idea.
As for the suit he wears...I would argue it's better than the SR suit. The blue and red is better at least.