Uncanny Avengers

[Donnie Darko]

I really don't get the hatred for mutants in the Marvel universe. Like, how is it that Beast is a freak but Tigra is ok?

 

[Mr. Dent]

It's not like we've ever seen the mass public praise Tigra. But I've always thought of it as the media/government specifically promoting mutant hate for their own gain. They understand where people like Thor come from and know he is not human, but it's a concern to them that some people are randomly gaining powers and thus they want to weed it out before it's out of control.

It helps that superhumans on the Avengers are promoted by the government because of their connection to Tony and Cap.

 

[BoredGuy]

^and that's the age old Marvel question, my friend

i always find it funny, because what, did the humans in the Marvel U all get dossiers on how the superheroes got their powers??
how do they know all the Avengers got their powers given to them, and weren't born with them?

 

[Donnie Darko]

Yeah, if I was a mutant, I would just be like "nope, an alien came to my bedroom and made me grow these horns... not a mutant, no sir."

 

[Snikt8]

Good stuff, never understood that either. How can people not be freaked out about the Red Hulk......and panic over Jubilee?

 

[Havok83]

the last issue was amazing. I see this book turning around and Copiel's art is a definite improvement

 

[StreetWarrior]

the last issue was amazing. I see this book turning around and Copiel's art is a definite improvement

Agreed 100%. This may have become my favorite Avengers title and I'm loving Hickman's work on the main titles. Now this is the Remender that wrote Uncanny X-Force! t:

 

[Donnie Darko]

I'll admit, the first 2-3 issues didn't WOW me the way I thought they would (perhaps because of the delays), but these last two issues have been so damn good it's insane. Must buy Uncanny X-Force trades...

 

[StreetWarrior]

I'll admit, the first 2-3 issues didn't WOW me the way I thought they would (perhaps because of the delays), but these last two issues have been so damn good it's insane. Must buy Uncanny X-Force trades...

You won't regret it. I'm not really an X-Men fan but Remender's Uncanny X-Force is one of the best titles I've ever read. It's almost been completely released in trade too. The next volume is due out in the next week or so and the final TPB is scheduled to come out in June. I'll definitely be picking up both!

 

[Havok83]

I didnt like the first arc but it seemed more like necesary set up to get this book going which it seems to be hitting its stride now.

one issue i did have though was that when Cap was doing his training, I thought that was Alex at first. Unless they are in uniform, I can see myself having trouble differentiating between the two if they arent called out by name in the text

 

[StreetWarrior]

I didnt like the first arc but it seemed more like necesary set up to get this book going which it seems to be hitting its stride now.

one issue i did have though was that when Cap was doing his training, I thought that was Alex at first. Unless they are in uniform, I can see myself having trouble differentiating between the two if they arent called out by name in the text

Huh. I never thought it was anyone but Cap. I see where you're coming from though. Both are tall, white guys, with blonde hair in a similar style. I think Steve's a lot bulkier though. Also, the gymnastics training was more to his character and VERY reminiscent of training scenes from (much) older issues.

 

[BoredGuy]

So wait now, there are people getting upset about Alex's "don't call me a mutant" speech??
It makes perfect sense if you ask me
If I was a human being born with powers, and someone called me a mutant... I would propmtly use my powers to kill their ass

 

[StreetWarrior]

So wait now, there are people getting upset about Alex's "don't call me a mutant" speech??
It makes perfect sense if you ask me
If I was a human being born with powers, and someone called me a mutant... I would propmtly use my powers to kill their ass

Yeah, people are absolutely livid on another comics site.

 

[Havok83]

Huh. I never thought it was anyone but Cap. I see where you're coming from though. Both are tall, white guys, with blonde hair in a similar style. I think Steve's a lot bulkier though. Also, the gymnastics training was more to his character and VERY reminiscent of training scenes from (much) older issues.

Havok has done similar training as well. Bulk is something that will change from artist to artist. Visually they look the same without their costumes. The main clue that Copiel used having Steve's hair slightly shorter but again thats something that will vary depending on who draws.

So wait now, there are people getting upset about Alex's "don't call me a mutant" speech??
It makes perfect sense if you ask me
If I was a human being born with powers, and someone called me a mutant... I would propmtly use my powers to kill their ass

People see it inconsistent with his viewpoints on it from X-factor

Alex embraced the term mutant and being one. People dont feel this change is in character with him. I didnt like that part of his speech either but Im not overly upset about it. I liked him saying they were all humans but hated that he said the word mutant represented everything he hated. Well he and his oldest allies are all mutants. Its not something he should be ashamed off and ignore in order to conform to his acceptance among the Avengers. I dont think that latter part sends a good message and gives weight to the poster whom had issues earlier about them only picking human looking mutants to be on the roster. If you want to get rid of the word mutant and have them all call and accept you as humans than have mutants on their who dont look like a regular human on the roster. I thnk that would have made his speech send a more powerful message but as it stands it seems more to perpetuate that being a mutant is something that needs to be dealt with shame and hiding.

 

[BoredGuy]

Ummm he doesn't seem ashamed at all

his speech was not about "oh i just wanna be human don't call me names"

There's no inconsistency here, just a growing and developing of views. Alex is still proud to be a mutant, he just hates that term nowadays because of all the negative connotations it carries. And that makes perfect sense, mutant is a horrible negative description of any being, what with mutations being, by definition, genetic abnormalities. He's saying they're not abnormal. They're human, who just so happened to be born with powers. Whether you're a human calling others mutants, or the one being called a mutant, it's an ugly word that has no place in civil discourse.

People's views on these things can change. Same as it used to be acceptable to call black people "negroes" or "coloreds", and nowadays using those terms will get your ass kicked.

I see nothing out of character, especially when your current mission is PR-related and youre trying to give the mutant community a fresh new image.

 

[Havok83]

then he should add at least one "ugly" mutant to send the message that they are all humans. The term mutant isnt derrogatory. Its who they are and its what the X-men themselves use to define themselves and have for decades. Now all of a sudden its not okay? If Alex wants to make a change then he needs to go over to the JG school and tell Storm and everyone to quit using it bc its contradictory to what he's trying to establish.. On a pure science level the only reason they are referred to as such is bc they do have a mutatation in their genome, hence the term mutant. Its what they are. Alex should have embraced it by telling those listening that they are mutant and human. Again the thing I hated the most was him saying the word mutant represented everything he hated. It would have been perfect had he left that line out.

People's views on these things can change. Same as it used to be acceptable to call black people "negroes" or "coloreds", and nowadays using those terms will get your ass kicked.

I see nothing out of character, especially when your current mission is PR-related and youre trying to give the mutant community a fresh new image.

dont you mean human community? Theres no way around it. They are different. A new term is just going to have to be thought up bc it doesnt change the fact that they have a mutation in their X-gene that makes them stand out from the rest. I guess would go along with your example about "negros and colors", bc its not like there isnt other terms that popped up to take their places. Id fall into that category and Im black. Its part of who I am and thats still another term that differentiates me. I dont shy away from it and claim to merely be human. Im black and human. One is not mutually exclusive and IMO, thats the route Alex should have taken

 

[Donnie Darko]

That panel above just reminds me of how much I loved Havok's X-Factor costumer. So 90s. So awesome.

 

[JewishHobbit]

I know. Artists keep coming back to the original Black and Plasma rings one, but I LOVED the blue and yellow X-Factor costume.

 

[Havok83]

I loved this costume the best. It was the perfect mix of all his costume

 

[runawayboulder]

I posted my thoughts in the ongoing B/T thread last night about this book.......

Uncanny Avengers was pretty god damn good this week. I'm very happy that Remender has turned this around finally. Seriously, f**k Cassaday.

So, Archangel knocked up Pestilence when he was the villain of the Dark Angel Saga? And now they have Apocalypse Twins....? FREAKING sweet! There's so many questions down the line for that alone. What would happen if Angel found out? Psylocke? Genesis? There's so many potential plots in that alone that interests me.

Plus a teased attraction between Steve and Wanda (it's actually a throwback to their possible hook up during Disassembled). Remender uses past Marvel stories to the FULLEST, that's my favorite thing about him as a writer.

Also, Havok takes charge - AWESOME.

I'm glad too see that others are satisfied with it as well.

And I'll say it again - F**K CASSADAY! He nearly ruined this book. If Marvel ever gives that guy a high profile gig again, they're out of their flipping heads.

As for Havok's speech, I don't know why anyone would get worked up over it. When I first read it, I took it as something that was debated recently here (I think in the X-Men thread) about how civilians in the Marvel universe accept the super people in the Avengers but not the super people in a school in Westchester county. I thought that was Havok's point - we're all just super-people trying to do good things, don't classify us as mutants and non-mutants. Of course there are going to be bad seeds but when you get down to brass tacks, what's the difference between a guy like Dr. Doom and Mr. Sinister? Yeah, the motivations are different and all but at the end of the day they're both bad guys. That's all you need to know about them.

 

[Mad Ones]

I'm not offended by Havok's speech. But he is turning mutants into a derigatory word by calling it the "m" word. I didnt really like that part. But it's a real world discussion. Like in the gay community there are LGBT people who want to be seen as exactly like straight people, while others want to celebrate their differences with pride. Havok wants gay marriage and Cyclops doesnt want to restrict and limit gays to straight institutions like marriage. Just a little analogy.

I think it's brilliant and makes their dynamic more interesting.

 

[Donnie Darko]

I just know at some point, Cyclops is going to call Havok some variation of "Uncle Tom."

 

[runawayboulder]

Don't they already have one? I remember Claremont always using the term "flatscan" but I can't remember what context it was meant to be used for....

 

[Donnie Darko]

I think flatscan is human/non-mutant. I think I remember Quicksilver referring to Val Cooper as one in a conversation where she said "some of my best friends are mutants."

 

[JewishHobbit]

"How very typical of a flatscan."

I remember that. X-Factor 92... Fatal Attractions.